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A few motors here...

http://www.mobile.de/cgi-bin/searchPublic.pl?bereich=pkw&sprache=2


(select Porsche, type 964 and chose up to 10,000 euros)
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Last edited by smarjoram; 07-11-2003 at 05:45 AM..
Old 07-11-2003, 05:41 AM
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Siena911

What was the oil pressure reading when this happen? Was it normal or was it low? What weight oil was in the engine and was the oil level low or normal? Even though these are aircooled engine, it really a combination of air and oil that cools these engines.
Old 07-11-2003, 05:51 AM
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What did the spark plugs look like? If it seized, the plug will tell. If it ran lean to get hot, the plug will tell. The banging you descrbe is scary, but maybe you can located the problem and dodge the bullet.
Old 07-11-2003, 06:12 AM
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Sounds to me like oil starvation or a very lean mixture exerbated by the warm weather may have caused the seize up . I've run my 911 for hours in some very high temperatures on the continent without a problem so I would look to another cause for the high engine temps other than the weather . If the crank and pistons for some reason (a blockage) started to recieve less oil than they should temperatures would rise super fast and the crank pins or little ends would start to 'knock' .
That's heartbraking , I know I would be hacked off if that happened . If you do the 'workshop' let me know .
Old 07-11-2003, 06:55 AM
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Red face Things that make you go &*^$# !

If you haven't done it yet, you can get a much better idea of additional debris, which may turn out to be bearing material, by taking the crank/sump cover plate bolts off and making a larger hole to peer into.

With the loud knocking noise description (and some black smoke in my case) it could be bearing #6 failure. I found debris when getting into it and it made the small material I first found on the plug seem trivial.

If it is lower end and not top, it could be an oil supply issue or metal contaminants causing problems in the bottom end. The higher temps you saw were enough to push it to failure. In a healthy/fresh engine the temps would not on their own be enough reason/cause for concern.

I feel for you loss-- prepare yourself for the rollercoaster ride that is the rebuild/upgrade/comtemplate a 3.6L swap in your future...

Good luck!
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Old 07-11-2003, 06:57 AM
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I you didn't already, carefully cut open your oil filter. See it there are any copper or brass colored shavings in the element. That would indicate bearing failure.
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Old 07-11-2003, 07:10 AM
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OK, so I've done a little investigating, kinda hard with two little ones running around.

Anyway, I cut open the oil filter as per Hetmann, and voila loads of copper coloured shavings.


Hilandscott, there was no black smoke, and on the 3.2's there is no sump cover plate but as stated above the oil filter had all the evidence. LOL I am beginning to feel the rollercoaster already, we shall see once I tear into it.

Zeke I took out the spark plugs and looked at them as well, I am not that clued up as to what they tell me(read as I'm totally clueless), so I have attached a picture of them, maybe you guys can give me some idea, if anything, no6 looks a little different!!


ruf-porsche, the oil pressure seemed normal, nothing different.
smarjoram, YOU ARE A BAD, BAD MAN!!!!!!!! I hope you had a good trip to goodwood, cmon' post us some pics.

Bones, and all the rest of you guys, nearish Guildford, I will post future dates of work planned and we can organise to get together, maybe do a bbq after dropping and stripping the motor, etc etc, we shall see.

Thanks for the help and encouragement that everyone has offered, and I am kinda looking forward to getting this done.

Cheers Jakes
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Old 07-13-2003, 11:57 AM
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Bummer man I feel for you.

Looks like not only a top end repair, but also a bottom end.

Goodwood, I haven't been there since 85 when I went to the Lotus owners gathering.
Old 07-13-2003, 12:05 PM
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Ruf, yep I think you're right, but I am going to put Wayne's new book to most excellent use. I plan on getting it oily and dog eared in no time!:-)

Jakes
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If you want to run with the big dogs, you can't pee like a puppy!!!

92 Rover Metro 1.1 (54 manly horsepower) - Dont knock it it does 60 mpg!!!
81sc / 3.2 litre transplant (Broken BIG Time )
SCWDP deserter - HP junkie wannabe
Old 07-13-2003, 12:08 PM
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A horrible sight all those brass coloured filings . Without doing a two stroke style 'plug-chop' it can be hard to determine cylinder performance with modern fuels but whilst your engine is out get the injectors cleaned and that whole fuel side of the engine thoroughly checked , things weren't right in there . Good Luck
Old 07-13-2003, 12:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Siena911
OK, so I've done a little investigating, kinda hard with two little ones running around.

Zeke I took out the spark plugs and looked at them as well, I am not that clued up as to what they tell me(read as I'm totally clueless), so I have attached a picture of them, maybe you guys can give me some idea, if anything, no6 looks a little different!!


Thanks for the help and encouragement that everyone has offered, and I am kinda looking forward to getting this done.

Cheers Jakes
Your plug shows a very lean condition in most of the cylinders.
You need to check this out once you get the engine back together again. Or else it gonna happen again.
Old 07-13-2003, 01:13 PM
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Ok, here's a ccouple of replacement engine suggestions - photographed at the Festival of Speed.

First a 1974 RSR...



..or how about this? Not quite so conventional, a gas turbine...


Hopefully I'll get more images up later today.
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Old 07-14-2003, 01:21 AM
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Jakes,

How's it going? any updates for us yet?

Cheers
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Old 09-11-2003, 06:31 AM
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Wow, Smarjoram,

those pics are nice. Sorry about the delay, things are soooo hectic,

Were going live tomorrow, well partially, and Tim, you know what these times are like !!!

Anyway, I have somehow restrained myself from spending too much time on the board as well as staying out of my garage,

At this point in time we are still negotiating with the Insurers about sorting out the subsidence on my garage, I don't really want to have a ton of engine parts lying around if there is going to be a load of builders creating dust while doing the repairs.

So I'm kinda holding out for that to be sorted out as well,

Never rains but pours I'm afraid but life would be boring otherwise..

Cheers Jakes
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If you want to run with the big dogs, you can't pee like a puppy!!!

92 Rover Metro 1.1 (54 manly horsepower) - Dont knock it it does 60 mpg!!!
81sc / 3.2 litre transplant (Broken BIG Time )
SCWDP deserter - HP junkie wannabe
Old 09-11-2003, 07:14 AM
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Hey, good luck with the go-live mate, and yes I do know what it's like

Looking forward to the engine drop & tear-down, so hurry up and get that garage fixed up!

Cheers
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Old 09-11-2003, 07:22 AM
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3.2L plugs seem to tend to look pretty lean after the shots that I have seen on this board and from my own motor. Your plugs had a bunch more oily looking buildup around the plug than mine which to me is an indication that things are worn and you have been burning some oil, but you probably already knew that.
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Old 09-11-2003, 07:32 AM
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Hmmm...plugs look perfectly healthy to me, as they should look like on EFI engine (many Pelicanites run CIS and carbs and consider everything else than soot-covered plugs "lean" .

Anyway, my be is that everything is OK with your Heads and cylinders but you have probably have failed connecting-rod bearing(s). Coppar-shavings and knock indicate that...

Why it happened is another story...best bet is bad oil-pressure. Something lodged somewhere and your engine got oil-starved. Unfortunately it probably means you'll have to tear it down to crank, and there is slight possibility that crank itself might be damaged too.

So you are probably looking at complete teardown, new crank-bearings + finding what obstructed oil flow.

If it hapened to me i would purschase another 3.2 to drop in the car and sell existing one in pieces...

Good luck!
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Old 09-11-2003, 07:37 AM
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So after 10 months of waiting I finally got time (and cash) to get the necessary tools etc, that I have now started stripping the motor down.

Lo and behold I have a spun bearing on Cylinder three.

The crank journal and conrod look pretty well scored up and I will be looking at machining next (or secondhand crank for that matter).

Well I know there will be tons of questions coming up. Thanks to all who have provided input thus far.

cheers Jakes
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If you want to run with the big dogs, you can't pee like a puppy!!!

92 Rover Metro 1.1 (54 manly horsepower) - Dont knock it it does 60 mpg!!!
81sc / 3.2 litre transplant (Broken BIG Time )
SCWDP deserter - HP junkie wannabe
Old 05-13-2004, 08:46 AM
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Glad you've made a start, AT LAST!!

Keep us posted, any pics of the carnage yet?Cheers,

Tim.
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Old 05-13-2004, 09:32 AM
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Old 05-13-2004, 10:26 AM
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