911 3.2 motor number issue
 

https://postimg.cc/8jkRMn3RHello everyone.

I recently purcashed a 911 3.2 that was previously registered in my country, but originaly it was a US car.
I run into the problam that in Hungary a COA is requirement for it to have a license plate.
My car however has an overstamp on the second digit of the engine number. The engine number is 64K02*** and on the second digit there is an overstamped 3 on the 4(or the other way around). The car was succesfully registered in the Netherlands, Austria and Hungary before with this issue that I know of.
The car was in use with this problem for at least the last 10 years. It was printed in on all of its previous documentation, however now the exam place refuses to pass it since it has been tempered with.
My questions are:
why would anyone temper with the original destination country? I don't see any upsides to this?
Is it a possibility that this is an original factory error? Has anyone see anything like this before?
Is there any way to get a COA for such an engine?
Did they stamp the engines separatelly for US and ROW meaning: does a 64K02*** and a 63K02*** exist or the serial itself is unique and either one exists but not both?

+1 the car is not matching numbers (it is an '87 car and this motor is an '89) so I cannot get a build sheet or a PPS
Any insights would be helpful.

[IMG] https://postimg.cc/8jkRMn3R [/IMG]
(In reality the 4 seems to be the dominant number but not on this picture.)

let`s see the numbers in picture..not to worry about the rest numbers just show it all between the stars and the engine case bottom 930/25
I would to a different person more knowledgeable than the one you went to...

Ivan

exam
 

The fact is the car already been to an exam place and they told me that given it has been tempered with they do not want to take on the risk of passing it.
They fear that the overstamp is because som shady thing and they pass it it can be a legal issue.

looks from the picture the 3 is original unumber....
Ivan

IF its a "63K" it an 89 3.2 (170KW) if it is a "64K" it is 89 3.2 with a catalytic converter (160KW).

So the "63" were euro/ROW and the "64" were North American. That is just from a quick search of our library.

Cheers

Thank you guys.
The problem is not the fact is was originally designed for US or ROW.
The issue is it doesn't have a COA since its not original in the car (car is '87 motor is '89). If not documented properly, in Hungary it cannot pass the exam for license plate. For us a COA or proper papers for the motor change is obligatory. The reason it was discovered was the number issue, but this is also why it is harder to get papers for it.

I think what would be nice to know if the numbers after the letter lets say 6*K02222 are unique numbers in the K year or did they count the regional motors differently?
Were a 63K02222 and 64K02222 produced or just one depending on the original destination country? If both exists I think I will have a really hard time getting any certificate even from porsche itself since I dont know which one I have. (CAT and a slight difference in compression wouldn't tell the story since they could be altered later) Basically as far as I know the motor block itsel fis identical and the difference is only in the assembly as the whole ICE/ unit.

what is the number 930/ ??

the rest of the 5 numbers is just serial number....

it is strange as you say ,the car was driving registered in Hungary past 10 years and you need extra documentations?
i`d go to a different place with the 911..
Ivan

63K00001 930/20
64K00001 930/25 with cat
so you need to look for the 930/2x stamp nearby to determine the correct engine type, and thus the correct serial #. Both series are independent, so the same serial will exist in 63K and 64K, but only one will match the 930/2x. If the 930/2x has also been tampered with then that is just more trouble.
What if you were to get a blank replacement case and rebuild the engine on that? How do the inspection authorities treat a case without numbers?

DJ...I was hoping you will show up....yup ,keep asking him for that 930/.. number
Still wierd the car was driving in Hungary for 10 years
kristof it is here....in black cirle

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1764335383.jpg

Thank you all for the comments! I know more about my car every day :D
I went to check the number since I didn't know it was there before- thanks for the picture. The correct number is a 4. It is a 930/20

But the plot thickens:

intro:
The car was imported to EU in '14-'15. At that time they replaced the hood VIN number to such as it would be in an OG EU car (meaning they replaced the VIN's digit with a Z on the 4,5,6,9). That wasn't an issue anywhere so far since the car has the good VIN in at least 3 other places and the alteration/motivation is as clear as day.
In the last 10 years it was in Hungary, but the last owner is from Austria, so I basically import it to Hungary with the only difference that it already had a Hungarian license plate and all the oldtimer certificates. I even have the photo taken of this motor with the problematic number from the autoclub, but more on that later.

the story unfolds:
The issue emerged when I brought it to reregister as an oldtimer and they need to reevaulate the car.
There they told me 2 things:
1. They will have some more paperwork to do since the car is registered under the "EU" VIN in Austria and in Hungary it was registered under the "US" VIN. I use the quotes because I know that only the US one is valid but Austrians didn't bother much.
2. With the overstamp they fear that they brake the law if they let it slide. So they don't dare to give a green light on it.

Possible solutions:
1. Get an authenticity and a type match certificate from Porsche. I'm in the process of that, but the aftersalse department (who understood me the most, since they are Hungarian and know how this mess works) told me that they will try to get such a paper from the German factory but they need weeks to get them understand the issue even and only then can he tell me whether they are willing to.
2. The first time it was registered in Hungary it wasn't an issue somehow. The somehow might even involve envelopes, I will never know. I don't want to go this way since I want to keep this car as long as I can. It is beautiful and in a really really good condition. I want to do it properly.
3. Go to the Car Club that did the evaluation when it first came to Hungary, and try to get the original papers. I did do that and I even got photos. Since they have these it would be reasonable to ask for a statement that if they know this car with this motor than they can validate it (motor number and issue clearly visible on one of ther pics). In hungary for a veteran car however only one autoclub that has the authority to give this permits. This means if they make an unfavourable statement I might as well sell the car on a loss.

climax:
The type number also has a stamp. Fortunatelly enough it is next to the original, not ON it.
This means that it is a 930/20, so a 64K but there is a 25 next to it. Given the full story I start to suspect that whoever brought it to the EU did everything to convert the car as if it was originally sold in the EU. If I were to look (and know what to look for) I would probably not find a catalyst in the car. I would assume at this point.

finale:
The new engine case is a last resort since that would be really pricey especially given that my engine is in really good condition. At this point I think I can only wait for Porsche Germany to answer and if they can't help I will either proceed with option 2. or 3.

ending?
I appriciate the help, the case number thing was helpful, now I know what I have. If anyone is interested I can do a follow up when the fog cleared up.


I attach a photo of the engine as illustration
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1764356062.jpg