Early 911 - Rear tires rubbing - question

Jim Richards · 10-17-2003, 03:07 PM

This past weekend I used our 73E for my first PCA driver's ed and the lips on the rear wheel openings really rubbed the rear tire sidewalls. I have 215/60/15's on 7x15 Fuchs in back. My rear camber is -1.25° and the shop that aligned it doesn't want to increase the camber for fear of rubbing on the inside. My ride height in back is 25" to the top of the rear wheel openings. I don't want to roll the wheel openings as this car has factory chrome wheel arch trim that my wife likes. Any suggestions / recommendations regarding camber, tire size, ride height, etc.? Thanks!

Zeke · 10-17-2003, 03:15 PM

The only things I can think of is going back to 6's or stiffening up the rear or mounting 205/50s on your 7's and make them track wheels. I have that setup on cookies and the 205/60's on deep sixes. Both seem to make for good clearance. The truth be known, I have not tracked the 911 nor do I yet have camber numbers known for sure. But the 2 combinations I mentioned look right.

Jim Richards · 10-17-2003, 04:44 PM

Thanks for you thoughts on this, Milt. I stiffened up the suspension some...26 mm rear torsion bars and Bilstein Sport rear shocks. Up front there's 21mm t-bars and Bilstein HDs. Also stock (15 mm?) front & rear sway bars. I'd like to stay with 7's in back, and probably downsize a bit on the tires, unless other's have managed to fit the 215/60's without rubbing.

mjshira · 10-17-2003, 05:02 PM

these cars are not intended to have 7's on the back. You'll have to max out the camber and depending on suspension condition that not be enough. In that case you'll need to get into the torsion bars which I recommend you take the car to a shop at that point.

Jim Richards · 10-17-2003, 05:43 PM

Suspension is totally fresh, and as I said above, the torsion bars are now larger than stock (21mm front / 26mm rear). The shop didn't want to increase rear camber beyond -1.25° for fear of rubbing on the inside. It seems others have done this though.

mjshira · 10-17-2003, 05:49 PM

I have a 69 911 with all 86 running gear. My rear wheels are 7x16. I had to cut the inside of the fender lip off and dial in the max camber and they still rub over severe bumps. (sorry I missed some of the detail you posted) I would recommend getting the adjustable spring plates.

Jim Richards · 10-17-2003, 05:57 PM

Hehehe. I have them, too. Thanks!

mjshira · 10-17-2003, 06:02 PM

start re-indexing your torsion bars, a click at at time and then put the car back on the ground. It sucks but that is your only option. If you want I can drive down and help you over a weekend. Just let me know. I have my DME being re-done but when it is back I'd be happy to help
--James

pwd72s · 10-17-2003, 06:47 PM

7's in the rear? Not "R" wheels? Get out the baseball bat, start rolling.

Jim Richards · 10-17-2003, 07:04 PM

Paul, would you take a bat to your early car? Naaah. Same with me. I think I'll have to bite the bullet and go to 205's. I know some people that track their cars like their tires shaved, but probably not their sidewalls.

pjv911 · pjv911's Garage

16X7 IN THE REAR WITH 225/50/16 YOKO AVS. NO RUBBING . I even have front mounted cooler lines running past the inside rim lip with no contact. Allthough its real close everywhere. My rear camber is set at 1.5 neg . Rear torsion bars are 31mm hollow tube. Inner fender lips are all rolled. This is on a 69 coupe with stock flares.

Kurt Williams

Hell , I got one better how about my latest project car. It has 17x 8 HRE 540 front rims with 235/40/17 tires in the front !!!! With no flares and no rubbing. Custom rim offsets work wonders. Yes I did say 8 inches in the front on a early stock front fender.

tangerine911e · 10-17-2003, 11:12 PM

Whoa - Kurt, that looks great!

I'm about to go down the track of the 16x7 with 225/50 rubber on the rear. Fits nicely but am about to upgrade the torsion bars before it hits the road. Up around 28mm (or bigger) for the rear. My guy said I'll need to run at least that size to avoid the dreaded rub if I want to keep the 225s.

Jim - it looks like you may need to downsize the rubber if you don't push those torsion bars up another size or two. How much rubbing are you getting? Maybe another tire brand the a sightly different sidwall design will solve the problem? My mechanic dislikes my 16in with 225 choice - he likes your 215/60/15s far better!

Good luck

Ash

Halm · 10-18-2003, 04:03 AM

Here is a parallel question. I have a set of 7X15's I want to mount on my '70E and not roll the lips. If I use 205/60's in the back what should be mounted on the 6's up front? Stay with 205's there too?, How about 195/65, they arte close in rolling diamater, but not exact.

Jim Richards · 10-18-2003, 05:56 AM

Thanks guys!

Hal, I currently have 195/65's in front on 6x15 Fuchs.

Ash, I lost between 1.5 - 2 mm of sidewall in one day at the track.

Since the 73E is mostly street driven, I think I'll downsize the tires and stay with the 26mm t-bars.

Thanks again for your help.

pwd72s · 10-18-2003, 09:04 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Jim Richards
Paul, would you take a bat to your early car? Naaah. Same with me. I think I'll have to bite the bullet and go to 205's. I know some people that track their cars like their tires shaved, but probably not their sidewalls.

Jim, that's exactly what I did. It was 1976...car on jackstands, I bought the 7's, had new XWX's mounted...I'd already sold the 6's, shipped them off to Colorado, where they may still be running around on a Speedster with modified fenders & disc brakes. So, I bolted on the 7's, took the car off jackstands, and cried...thought about it for 1/2 hour or so, and with tears in my eyes, I got out the old wood softball bat. And rolled those puppies! I had already gone 23/28 on Torsion bars, 19mm on sway bars, making things stiff enough that I get away with the 7's...Knowing what I know today? I'd have stayed with the 6's. But heck, it was the 70's...the now loved early 911S was just another car back then, and it was the then new Turbo that was considered king....The older cars? Heck, we thought they were made to be modified!

Jim Richards · 10-18-2003, 11:12 AM

I'm stunned. Paul. I would've never thought your beautiful 72S has such a "checkered" history. What's this world coming to?

I think I'm going to hold out on the fender rolling, like I mentioned before, it'll impact my ability to keep the chrome wheel arch trim my wife likes. So I'd better start thinking about a set of 205's in back. And maybe try a bit more neg camber.