Will I most probably have stud corrosion?

JackT · 11-24-2003, 10:24 AM

I am going to install SSI heat exchangers myself. Are the chances pretty good that I will have a hard time removing the studs. My car pretty rust free, but, the current exhangers look like they are 23 years old, as they should. Should I go ahead and get some spare studs just in case I have problems? Is there any tricks to getting the nuts off the studs without using heat? I do not have anyway to apply the heat at my home.

CHILI · CHILI's Garage

I sprayed mine with WD40 the night before, then again in the morning before I ate breakfast. They actually came right off. I was expecting Hell! But, one backed out of the case, so I did replace that one. Fortunately, it was a weekday so a local P-car mechanic (never used them for anything, but parts) was open. I think I paid about $3 for the new stud. It went right in. Just turn your wrench very slowly and straight up and down (as to not bind the nut).

I dodged a bullet on that one. But, the bad news is, I didn't even get to do what I wanted. I was going to backdate the heat exchangers, but they hit my shocks. That reminds me, I'm gonna post that question.

Superman · 11-24-2003, 10:45 AM

According to my understanding, you don't want to break an exhaust stud on one of these engines, and breaking them is pretty easy to do since the heads are air cooled and the studs have gotten very hot many times. If I were in your shoes, I'd probably try the penetrant (PB Blaster or my favorite, Maltby's), but I would not apply much force to the nuts before giving up and renting an oxy/acetylene setup. I have seen these nuts removed with heat, and it is very definitely the way to go. John can remove them without using a wrench. Just flame.

scottb · 11-24-2003, 10:45 AM

Soak them in PB Blaster overnight. The stuff is magic!

Doug Zielke · 11-24-2003, 10:57 AM

How many times do we have to repeat the excellent advice of John Walker.....use red heat from an oxy/ace torch. Forget penetrating oils. Forget whimpy heating sources like propane and Bic lighters. Use the "Blue Wrench" and the nuts will be off without any damage to the studs. And when it's all done, hoist a beer in JW's honor!

john walker's workshop · 10:59 AM

[QUOTE]Originally posted by scottb
Soak them in PB Blaster overnight. The stuff is magic! [/QUOTE

stinky magic.

cary · 11-24-2003, 11:13 AM

Using JW's years of knowledge.

Here's what worked for me.

Heat them up CHERRY red hot. Then give them a little twist TIGHTER to break the bond. Then back them out. If it doesn't feel right. STOP. REPEAT.

I used a MAPP/OXY mix with my portable torch. Worked great. Some day when I grow up I'll get a REAL torch. But then Super In-Law would find WAY too much stuff to save behind the woodshed. LOL.

Superman · 11-24-2003, 11:15 AM

Doug's got the spirit. John Walker, or John Wayne for that matter, would not mess with the inferior, time-consuming penetrant method. And as a consequence, they would also not mess with any broken studs. It would all be over in about ten minutes, with twelve very hot nuts lying on the floor.

Superman · 11-24-2003, 11:19 AM

Lemme put it another way. When Tyson hosted the SSI Clinic down the street from JW's Workshop, John left while we were fighting with nuts. Knowing there would be at least a couple stubborn nuts, he had gone to get his Blue Wrench. He returned just as we were realizing we needed heat.

JackT · 11-24-2003, 11:22 AM

I think I will take it to a muffler shop and ask them to take the old bolts off and put on stainless steal bolts, then I will change it myself. Or, better yet, maybe I'll just let the muffler shop do the whole thing.

Schrup · Schrup's Garage

[QUOTE]Originally posted by john walker's workshop

Quote:

Originally posted by scottb
Soak them in PB Blaster overnight. The stuff is magic! [/QUOTE

stinky magic.

Tell me about it. I am using my mother-in-laws garage in the basement of her house. I sprayed all my suspension fasteners to let them soak a few weeks ago & still haven't heard the end of it.

Randy Webb · 11-24-2003, 01:51 PM

impact works great also

Jim Sims · 11-24-2003, 02:06 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by DrewT
I think I will take it to a muffler shop and ask them to take the old bolts off and put on stainless steal bolts, then I will change it myself. Or, better yet, maybe I'll just let the muffler shop do the whole thing.

This is a good way to end up having to drill out and replace broken off exhaust studs (bolts should not to be used) and stainless steel studs are not recommended (usually considerably weaker than the OEM carbon steel studs). I doubt most "muffler shops" would know what to do; I would recommend you find an independent shop with 911 experience in your area and take your car there. I also suspect an impact wrench would just shear the studs off at the surface of the head if the nuts and studs are corroded together. Cheers, Jim

JackT · 11-24-2003, 02:07 PM

Thanks for the advise.

1fastredsc · 11-24-2003, 02:12 PM

Grow some cajones, get some REAL heat. I had to find this out the hard way AFTER i broke 4 exhaust studs on my sc motor (luckily the heads were coming out anyway). Now that i own a torch, nothing kicks more ass than 6k degrees of pure metal melting, stud torching, nut glowing power.

Superman · 11-24-2003, 03:57 PM

I just read some good advise. Heat...the way to go.

I'd agree that an impact gun, if you could fit it in there, would just make a mess of several studs. I would not agree that MufflerMan would mess it up, necessarily. Possibly. But I have seen some muffler guys who could just about do anything they wanted with an oxy/acetylene torch. Every bit as skilled as JW (sorry John, but some of these guys pick up a torch in the morning and lay it down just before they go home).

I have also seen some people who, for whatever reason, do not like to put anti-sieze on exhaust studs. Maybe I'm an idiot....well okay I'm a verifiable idiot, but I still use anti-sieze on exhaust fasteners.

Damomma · 12-05-2003, 05:23 PM

Well I soaked mine with pb blaster daily for 10 days then used a propane torch which clearly isn't enough heat. I then proceded to break off six of the twelve. I got all the flanges off after all the nuts were off or the studs broken. The weakest part of the stud was on the outside edge of the flange which left enough stud to weld to or add a nut for removal with some real heat. So I took it to my local shop for extraction, he welded nuts on the studs used real heat (enough? I don't know) and couldn't get a single one loose but didn't want to break them off flush so he stopped and told me to come pick up the car.

My Question -- Advice please on what next!? I was thinking of bringing it to a porsche specialist whou would know exactly how much heat you could get a way with on the head. I guess if that doesn't work my only option is to drop the engine, remove the cylinder heads and have the studs drilled or EDM'd out?

It's my wifes car, I wish I would have just told her to wear thicker socks because 911's don't have heat :-) Which is what got me headed down this path in the first place.