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tbitz's Avatar
 
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Ignore the old fuel rail. See the wire harness behind the fuel lines?

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Tony
'78 911SC with BITZRACING EFI conversion kit
Old 03-13-2004, 12:53 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #201 (permalink)
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Thanks for the pic Tony, I'll correct the wiring harness before I drop the car off the jackstands
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Will R.
87 Carrera 3.3 Turbo
Old 03-13-2004, 01:03 PM
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The fuel rails really look solid Tony! Nice pics Will!
Old 03-13-2004, 04:47 PM
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Another update on my install:

I finished the wiring and the installation of the air temp sensor, disconnected the megasquirt cable, pressurized the fuel lines, checked for leaks, reconnected the megasquirt cable and my laptop to the megasquirt. Then I tried to start the engine and........
..
succes. It fired up instantly. It's actually running on megasquirt.
.
The megatune software is windows based and looks really easy to work with. Tony is going to send me the new (warmup,enrichment,afterstart) values for this configuration soon.
.
In all it took me about 9.5 hours spread over three days for the installation including removing carbs and reinstalling cis. Tonys' instructions are superb. I'm running an msd box, points and ssi's on a 3.0 carrera engine. I hope to run it like this all summer and take the next logical step next winter, maybe a pre-production beta kit for a TURBO

(when I read my own post, it reads like a commercial endorsement. I have no affiliation with Tony and have nothing to gain from his success.) My carbs were running great, I just always knew I would do some type of EFI setup and this one was the right price for me and used alot of my original equipment.
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Will R.
87 Carrera 3.3 Turbo
Old 03-15-2004, 08:23 PM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #204 (permalink)
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Nice Will! Way to go Tony!
Old 03-16-2004, 12:22 AM
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Congratulations! Beautiful job!

Can't wait to see more.
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Old 03-16-2004, 04:52 AM
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Just read the entire thread form start to finish and I'm interested as well. I think the 2.7 and 3.0 cars will be around for a long time but how about the longevity of CIS (parts availability, etc) 20 years from now? Great work. Unless I missed it somewhere, how will it respond to elevation changes?
I'll be following closely, this is very cool.
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1984 911 Carrera
Old 03-16-2004, 08:29 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #207 (permalink)
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Quote:
.....Unless I missed it somewhere, how will it respond to elevation changes?
I'll be following closely, this is very cool.
Just before startup the ECU takes a pressure reading from the sensor and computes a correction factor.

Also as the altitude varies the pressure sensor see more/less vacuum and automatically compensates.

There is lot's of good information about MegaSquirt in the "MegaManual".

MegaManual
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Tony
'78 911SC with BITZRACING EFI conversion kit

Last edited by tbitz; 03-16-2004 at 08:53 AM..
Old 03-16-2004, 08:50 AM
  Pelican Parts Catalog | Tech Articles | Promos & Specials    Reply With Quote #208 (permalink)
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Guys,

My installation guide is finally ready for review. You can download it from the link below. Note it is 75 pages and 12Mb long. Let me know if there are any problems downloading it.
CIS to EFI Installation guide

Although there has been great interest in this kit, I was not able to sell all the initial kits, so I've decided to put one up on ebay. Here is the link:

ebay add
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Tony
'78 911SC with BITZRACING EFI conversion kit
Old 03-20-2004, 09:36 AM
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Send a message via Yahoo to Lukesportsman
I'll start the bidding
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Old 03-20-2004, 10:11 AM
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what is the advantage to EFI?

For those of us who are technologically illiterate, what advantage would this EFI system of Tony's have over my tried and true CIS? Would my 911 drive differently? Could it accomodate more radicals cams if I rebuild? Would it have advantages over just converting to Webers if performance was what I was after?
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Old 03-20-2004, 01:54 PM
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I would think that it would be more reliable than cards and that since CIS isn't tunable, if you are interested in preformance enhancements this is definitely the way to go (efi that is).
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Old 03-20-2004, 04:27 PM
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Re: what is the advantage to EFI?

Quote:
Originally posted by Doug Steinel
[B]For those of us who are technologically illiterate, what advantage would this EFI system of Tony's have over my tried and true CIS?
It's not CIS! It's also lighter, fully adjustable, fuel-efficient and has no barn-door. It can wring the last ounce of performance out of your setup and doesn't have enything in the airpath.
Quote:
Would my 911 drive differently?
If properly mapped, yes!
Quote:
Could it accomodate more radicals cams if I rebuild?
Yes.
Quote:
Would it have advantages over just converting to Webers if performance was what I was after?
Yes. It can be optimaly tuned for whole rev-range. Carbs are wide-assed way of guesstimating how much fuel is needed and cannot be made to run optima at all possible speeds/loads. You can probably get approx. same max power from carbs but you'll never get same area under torque curve...guess what counts when accelerating?
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Thank you for your time,
Old 03-20-2004, 04:41 PM
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map?

Thanks for the input Beepbeep. Now how about explaining what "map"means in your answer? If Tony's kit pans out, why would anyone want to buy carbs? Wouldn't it be a blow to PMO? Tony may well be able to sell this EFI below the cost of carbs. I was thinking of buying carbs and a pre-74 exhaust for performance enhancement on my CIS 3.0L, but why make such a move now. Better to wait and see if the guinea pig Pelicans give
Tony's kit the thumbs up.
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77 911, 3.0L
Old 03-20-2004, 04:52 PM
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Mapping: entering specific values into air/fuel/RPM matrix.

There is a pressure transducer in the system, called MAP-sensor. By knowing pressure in the manifold and RPM, it's possible to calculate how much air has been drawn into the engine and how much fuel should be injected.

While this can be calculated it's often done empirically, by running the engine trough various loads, observing air/fuel mixture and leaning/richening where change is due. Those values are entered into air/fuel matrix, that can be represented by 3D topological "MAP"...thus "mapping"...

Think of a carb where you can program how much fuel should be used for every rev and throttle range...that's what EFI is good for. Also, there is nothing that is measuring air-flow (everything is calculated indircetly) and nothing that stops the airflow.
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Thank you for your time,
Old 03-20-2004, 05:34 PM
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Will,

Bravo on the install. It looks great. I can't wait to see some dyno numbers.

Tony,

You da man!!! Your relentless effort is paying off. I can't wait to see more results. Excellent work!!
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Old 03-20-2004, 06:03 PM
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Folks,

I've gotten some feedback from another installer of the prototype kit.

It looks like the air-condition unit is interfering with the right fuel rail and the stock heater duct going to the blower motor interferes with the left fuel rail.

Both William and I did not have this problem because we don't have A/C and our heating system has been backdated.

So for now if you plan to get this kit you need to backdate your heating system and the A/C has to go.

Does the stock A/C work on a 911 anyway? Is this a show stopper for some folks?

The blower motor only makes a difference when the engine is idling. When crusing the backdated heating system is blazing hot.

Below is a picture that shows the two parts required to backdate the heating.
part numbers are listed in this Pelican Thread



I've updated my installation guide with this information. A new version has been uploaded to my website.
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Tony
'78 911SC with BITZRACING EFI conversion kit
Old 03-20-2004, 06:42 PM
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My AC works well and I do know the fan does make a difference, as I just replaced it.

I think that having to backdate heat and ditch the AC could be a big deal for people who have daily drivers and don't live in climates that are always nearly perfect.

It would be a major factor for me in terms of this kit. How bad is the interference? Is there a reason it could never fit, or could future versions of the kit accomodate stock heat and AC?

Olivier

Olivier
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Old 03-20-2004, 07:34 PM
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Removing AC is no problem

IMHO, a 911 should not have AC... and the backdated system is fine even when it is 20 degrees. I have already backdated my '82 3.0L and now I will have an excuse to rip that AC out and lose 50lbs of useless steel.I drove it all winter with a backdated system . People who want to replace the CIS with EFI are after performance which means they should be willing to lose the AC and the blower motor.
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77 911, 3.0L
Old 03-20-2004, 07:50 PM
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I think that there are a lot of people who are looking to this EFI swap as a alternative to replacing expensive CIS parts when they fail. If I needed a fuel distributor tomorrow I would just purchase this kit and be done with it, BUT I do need A/C. The car is pretty much a driver and black ain't helping things in Hotlanta.
Old 03-20-2004, 08:10 PM
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