I think the factory, you know, the folks designed the car, already factored in all the body lean into their calculations for optimum alignment so we don't have to be engineers to drive the car.

"O ye of little faith"

Ohmygosh, this is starting to sound like the E-ram thread :)

Conspiracy theory: stlrj==Mark Kibort

Precisely....so if we're running stronger torsion bars...OR if we're using the car in a way ( track and street vs street only) other than the ASSUMPTIONS made by the EXCELLENT factory engineers...then the EXCELLENT settings that the EXCELLENT engineers made... is not so EXCELLENT any more...isn't it....it would seem that a different set of "compromise" settings would then have been made by the EXCELLENT factory engineers...no? Look at what the factory does ( differently) for a late street 911 vs a late Cup car, for instance. Same settings? No way !

Is any of this getting through ?? Not taking anything away from the EXCELLENCE of the factory's work, don'tcha know.... ??

---Wil

Excellent factory engineers? Come on.

Don't forget the impact of 'excellent' liability-oriented lawyers and actuaries. Understeer is safer, for ordinary users.

Stock settings would be great if the car was running 11" wide racing slicks on the front with really hard torsion bars and 14" racing slicks on the back. Then we would want next to no camber.

This is amazing, to try to say that the best handling specs for our cars are the factories just seems crazy. Everyone knows that the factory settings are a huge compromise.

So what have you come up with to improve on understeer?

See above :)

way up towards the top

closer to equal camber settings front to rear, but the best bet is an adjustable sway bar and a knowledge of vehicle dynamics and dynamic weight distribution/change.

I'm no expert, but I do know just enough to be dangerous. ;)

Wil, factory settings non the less...yea way.

STLRJ:

????

Your rebuttal to my point that the "factory" has BOTH street settings for street cars and ....more aggressive settings for Cup Cars....

...tell me again how this contradicts what I'm saying ????

You, sir...seem incorrigable...and seek merely to find a fight.

The fact remains that all settings are compromises, and the factory stock settings are fine for the ASSUMPTIONS made as to how the car is to be used. The original poster made some rather significant modifications such as torsion bar upgrades and other things... that clearly place him towards a "fringe" use....more like fast, aggressive track work. Therefore ANOTHER set of settings would be more appropriate..the same way the factory has a different set of "settings" for their Cup or racing cars. Yes indeed, two ( or more) sets of "factory" recommendations....depending upon USE.

At this point ...I remain only clinically interested as to how your mind works, and would not desire a another counter-point from you on the technical merits of your objections, since you haven't been able to do so this far !

I'm done...spent....

To the rest of the gang.... Merry Christmas !!!

---Wil Ferch

Wil, didn't mean to get you upset, but I just prefer the factory assumptions over anybody elses including your own.

Just my opinion...

Merry Christmas

You prefer factory's assumptions of "my" ultimate use....

...rather than my own assumptions ...on "my" use ??

Good grief, and good bye !!!!

Have a happy holiday and a mind-expanding new year !!

--- Wil

Alllllll rightyyyyy then.

Awesome, we now agree to disagree.

What were those settings again, I've forgotten.

Don't start....:)

I think that an obviously young guy needs a lot of patience..
And a young guy should sometimes be more respectful.

How 'bout those Seahawks, eh?

How 'bout them Bears too? Won ANOTHER game! :eek:

I have a car similar to 84toy in that I have upgraded shocks, torsion bars, lowered ride height (no corner balance). My car got set up with factory specs. and it understeers mightily in lower speed cornering. Very annoying. A few high speed corners here and there have shown that some oversteer is out there to be found, but it comes with a light feeling front end. The front tires don't seem to "dig in" very well, feeling squirmy. Tires are fresh Kumho MX's on 6/7 Fuchs with 205/55, 225/50 respectively. Also feels the same with Yoko ES100 on 7/8 951 phone dials using 205/55, 245/45 sizes.

Just my experience. Dunno if different alignment will help my condition. Those guys out there tearing up the track with tilted-in wheels might be on to something though........... :confused:

Green Bay is going to have to sit down very hard against Da Raidahs for the SeaHawks to get anywhere...we'll see.

Tonight, on a very special Monday Night Football...

Jw