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Oil cooler in Whale Tail

Has anyone put an oil cooler in the Whale Tail of their Porsche. I have never read anything about this application. After contacting several people with varying recommendations I decided to try it and it seems to be working very well. New Mocal thermostat and temperature is steady and lower than ever. Any long term ramifications?

Old 12-31-2003, 06:00 PM
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I guess the question would be: Why?

It's kind of a 'rob Peter to pay Paul' kind of solution, with the oil heating the air that's supposed to cool the cylinders.

But if you say it's working, then I can't think of anything you'd need to worry about.
Old 12-31-2003, 06:14 PM
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Just to keep it short, other body modifications preclude placing the cooler anywhere else.
Old 12-31-2003, 07:11 PM
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Jack hit the nail on the head.

You say the oil temp is lower (at the gauge), but what is happening in the cylinders, at the piston top, e.g. at the first compression ring where temp. really matters? That area may rely more on cool air than cool oil! You could be at higher temp there?

Just a thought. I think if there is no room for the oil cooler anywhere else, make room for it. Could you duct air through that only feeds the oil cooler, e.g. through a wide fender?

Cheers, George
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Old 12-31-2003, 08:26 PM
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Couple of other things to consider:
1. redistribution of weight to an area that is detrimental to the cars handling.
2. in the event of a collision or whatever-hot oil on a hot engine is undesirable.
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Old 01-03-2004, 08:57 AM
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Clinton- Thanks for the input, greatly appreciated. Bruce
Old 01-03-2004, 09:33 AM
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On the flip side of what others have said, Porsche places intercoolers in that location so it must not get too hot. I know that an intercooler is far less vital to the survival of the engine than an oil cooler, but cool air is very important to consistent turbo function.
Old 01-03-2004, 01:33 PM
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The placement of intercooler is more about compromise and working within the limitations of the available space, far from being optimal.

Many of the race cars wore the intercoolers to the sides, with unrestricted fresh air to the motor.
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Old 01-03-2004, 01:56 PM
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Chuck- Thank you for your input. It seems to me that the air flow over the top of the car into the wing is much greater than the air flow under the fender and also more than only one side of the car. An automotive engineer agrees. I really appreciate your time. Thanks again. Bruce
Old 01-03-2004, 02:01 PM
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You may be right about the airflow, but I think Chuck (and others who have posted) are referring to the temperature in the engine bay. While cool air may be flowing over the top of the cooler, hot air is hitting the bottom and sides. In addition, the oil lines in the 911 oil cooling system also serve to cool the oil as it travels to and from the fender or valence.
Old 01-03-2004, 04:45 PM
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Sort of. The problem isn't getting cool air to the oil cooler. That's very easy. The problem is getting cool air to the cylinders and heads. The air headed to them is being both obstructed and heated up by putting the oil cooler in-line, upstream of the engine itself. What you're doing is reducing the engine's ability to cool itself, and you're doing it where it's difficult to measure the effects -- unless you've got a CHT gauge.

Oil cooling is just one part of the overall cooling scheme for a 911's motor. The easy illustration of this point is that when your fan belt breaks, you can cook the motor in a matter of minutes, in spite of the fact that your oil cooling system is still operating normally.

Last edited by Jack Olsen; 01-03-2004 at 04:52 PM..
Old 01-03-2004, 04:50 PM
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Jack- as soon as I get the cooler back from Power Haus(it leaked) I will take a picture of the application. There is air flowing under the cooler. Thanks for the information. It's never too late to try to find someplace else for the cooler. After all its only money. Bruce
Old 01-03-2004, 07:33 PM
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I saw a guy who put the oil cooler in a duck tail.
Obviously nothing is free so you might lose some of the benefits from the tail with air going through it rather than having if function as a dam.
Anyone else want to weigh in on this one?
I'm thinking of doing it. The car is the 70T which will see little track time but an enormous amount of daily driving i.e. stop-n-go driving, spirited drives in the middle of the night etc.
I'm hoping it might let the engine run a few degrees cooler. If it does work then it won't, at least in my mind, look dumb.

Note: 5F but it feels like -10F and it's supposed to get colder.
Guess I'll be gettin' out the long pants. You betcha!!
Needless to say I'm looking for "in the garage" projects.
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Old 01-04-2004, 04:43 PM
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This is an interesting subject. I plan to put the oil cooler up into the ducktail on my '73 911 hotrod (2000lbs/300HP). I like the simplicity of the oil cooling system situated at the rear inspite of any additional weight over the tailend. I think there would be a net weight loss vs. front cooler and lines. Also, with the cooler mounted up in the top area of the ducktail, there is no interference with airflow into the stock grille opening for motor cooling.
By the way, Bruce Anderson discusses this exact approach on page 188 of his 911 Performance Handbook. A small cooler linked into the pressure circuit and mounted at the rear of the 911 kept the motor cooler than the original, large front mounted unit.
Fianlly, since I live in Canada where we might see (max.) 2 to 3 weeks of 80F plus weather per year, my cars cooling requirements will be less demanding than 911 owners in the southern States.
Moab, I would be very interested to see photos of your WhaleTail installation.
Limble, perhaps we should exchange ideas on this?

Paulo
Old 01-05-2004, 06:35 PM
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If I did it, I'd put on a cylinder head temperature gauge, just to be on the safe side.
Old 01-05-2004, 06:42 PM
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this is damn interesting. i thought of this too. but my AC component occupys the same place. i wonder how much heat this puts out into the engine compartment? i know diddly on AC stuff. my wtail actually has two openings. i know it is an aftermarket fiberglass model with two grids. maybe i should post a pic. but i have a alot of vent area on my tail. but jack is right, a simple head temp gauge like the two stroke karting guys use would be cheap insurance. but i guess you need to measure the temp before the mod to set a benchmark.
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Old 01-05-2004, 08:15 PM
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Paulo- As soon as the cooler gets back from the manufacturer I will send you pictures. Soon I hope.

Jack- Where do you install the cylinder head temperature gauge? Bruce
Old 01-05-2004, 08:16 PM
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unfixed- Maybe if we keep getting input something good will come of this idea. Either do it or put it to rest.
Old 01-05-2004, 08:20 PM
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you are right. check into those yamaha two stroke head temp gauges. i think they are cheap, and battery operated so you would not have any wiring. i dont know how long the leads are, so you may have to get creative on mounting it. but the thermo coupler is attached with a high temp adhesive. i think, it has been a long time. keep us posted please.
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Old 01-05-2004, 08:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by moab911
Just to keep it short, other body modifications preclude placing the cooler anywhere else.
Out of interest, what sort of body modifications do you have that preclude the installation of an oil cooler?

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Old 01-05-2004, 08:27 PM
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