Need bushings help, I am confused.

[safe]

Hi
I'm going to replace my front and read swaybar, with used ones, so I need new bushings for them.
As I have read I need to remove the A-arms in order to install a new front swaybar (under body type). So therefore I thought I could also replace the a-arm bushings as well.

But I don't know what type of bushings to get. I dont want a squeaky car and I dont spend much time on the track.

Poly,Poly graphite, plastic, rubber, teflon, neatrix, for me its a jungle out there.
Can someone please explain?

I have read som threads and they all point to Poly-brons, but thats a tad to expensive for me.

/Magnus

[Shuie]

Ive got the Elephant Racing poly-bronze on the front of my car. They are a quality product and were really easy to install properly.

I went with the poly-bronze instead of the hard poly bushings becuase I didnt have a lathe to turn them down in the event that they didnt fit properly.

Suspension bushing, the right way

I went with Weltmeister Neatrix bushings on my rear springplates and they have worked out fine so far. If I had the extra cash, I would have bought the Elephant bushings for the rear also.

[Schrup]

I installed poly-graphite with zerk fittings ($44) no regrets.

[Randy Webb]

Based on the fact that you do mostly street driving, just put in new stock rubber. It's fine. But do replace all (ALL) the old hard or worn rubber.

Or you can find stuff that is one step firmer than stock (out of a total of 4 steps) - I think mine came from NEatrix when I did that.

[rbcsaver]

I agree with Randy Webb,
That's what I did.
regards,
\Steve

[jazzbass]

For those advising to stick with rubber, are you talking about the a-arms or the sways? The original poster asked about both. New rubber a-arm bushings need to be vulcanized on and the whole process costs about $400 - so if he's on a budget, this is probably out of the question.

For the a-arms, I did what Shuie did, and for the exact same reasons. Didn't feel like spending the time to fit the poly-graphite ones. I don't think you can get Neatrix for these.

For the sway bars, AFAIK, you can only get OEM rubber. They're cheap for the front (~$5 each) and more expensive for the rear because you have to buy the whole drop link. Unless someone makes some hardcore racing version of the sway bar bushings that I haven't seen yet, I'm pretty sure your only option on these is OEM replacements. Anyone confirm this?

[toolman]

I just bought the ones Pelican sells and they slipped right on. The hardest part was removing the old ones. Thank god I have a torch. Just heat them up, after removing them from the car and they will catch on fire and melt. then you can remove them. I bead blasted and repainted everything. Take the ball joint nuts off, and remove the entire cross member and A arms as an assembly, this way you will be able to remove the sway bar too. I lubed the new bushings with synthetic grease and everything slipped together like butter.

[Randy Webb]

I see no need to vulcanize them on. Yes, I would replace all rubber on a 20 yr. old car (ie nearly all 911s). Its a dirty, gritty job, but you can do it all yourself.

[Schrup]

The poly-graphite bushings I used did not require any lathing for good fitment. There is no binding & had no problems with corner balance or alignment. I installed the zerk fittings as a precaution, although the manufacturer advised me that they weren't necessary.

[RoninLB]

Originally posted by jazzbass
New rubber a-arm bushings need to be vulcanized on and the whole process costs about $400 -

For the sway bars, AFAIK, you can only get OEM rubber.

vulcanized only afaik. I used some bushing gorilla snot on the welt spring bushings.

I have the urethane, front and rear, on the sway bars.

[KTL]

Rubber ones are vulcanized because the rubber is intended to twist & deform, not rotate like the other poly or Elephant bushings. I think if they were allowed to spin freely, the rubber would eventually wear away at the interface of the rubber-to-metal contact point. Then you'd have a really sloppy situation?

[Randy Webb]

Possibly. I suspect the wt. of the car would prevent much spinning. You could glue them on if you are worried about rotation. I think the spinning, if any, would be better than the old, hard rubber.

[safe]

If I go with the harder Poly-bushings, is that going to give me a much ruffer ride, or is it marginal?

[Zeke]

Interesting discussion. My take is that the front arms move too much for the OEM bushings to remain static and simply twist internally. It maybe true for minute movement, but certainly they would tear when lifting the car off the ground.

The main purpose of one end being solid I think is too make the bigger end move and suffer the wear. Wear along a longer circumference would be less. There are some other engineering advatages I can postulate.

When installing a hard bushing, it becomes more of a bearing and more precision fitting is in order. The outer part of these assemblies is not a machined bearing-ready surface. So, the inner surface becomes the active one. Real bearings solve all the problems.

But back to the rubber. I dont see an absolute necessity for vulcanizing the rubber bushings on, but to to do so is to effectively transfer the operation to the smaller diameter. Be sure to lubricate is accordingly.

This is all a personal opinion. Counter views on this are more than welcome as it may shed light on a much uninformed subject of our cars.

Edit to address the above question:
No bearing/bushing affects the 'quality' of the ride. The shock and bar combination does that job. You will hear more road noise transferred to the chassis, though.

If you take quality of ride to mean performance, that's why we are doing this, for better performance. But you won't notice a thing in a straight line neither accelerating or braking.

[Chuck Moreland]

The factory rubber bushings do not slide at all. They are in there incredibly tight. Their lack of friction surface is what allows them to last so long without lubrication. If they did slide the soft, dry rubber would wear quickly.

The term "ride quality" might mean different things to different people. But bushings do effect vibration and harshness. Hi friction bushings, like polyurethane, make the ride harsh. The suspension doesn't move at all until the friction is overcome, hence small bumps and road ripples are passed right through. We feel this as vibration and harshness.

[bruboy]

Safe

I have just replace the bushings on the front and rear sway bars on my 83 sc and despite what the book says you do not need to remove or loosen the front A arms to replace to sway bar bushes. a bit of patience and it can be done, I considered changing A arm bushes as well but my car still pulled up straight with hard braking from high speed OK, might not be worth the trouble and expence?

Bruce
83 sc

[Oldporsche]

I have a car with an unknown number of miles on its suspension. Since it's about 30 yrs old with the original suspension bushings, I am comtemplating the new project.

I would like to replace the spring plates in the rear with some adjustable ones.
My question is this:
If I use SC spring plates, what choices do I have for bushing material?
If I use Sway-Away spring plates, what choices do I have for bushing material?

Thanks for the help.

David Duffield

[Zeke]

Originally posted by Chuck Moreland
The factory rubber bushings do not slide at all. They are in there incredibly tight. Their lack of friction surface is what allows them to last so long with lubrication.

Chuck, I'm having a hard time with that statement. You may ceratainly be correct, but why would a non moving bushing need a lubricant? Or are you simply speaking of a dressing/preservative?

I don't mean to split hairs. I/we want to understand the function of the OEM rubber bushing and its proper replacement with same. But, if you lubricate, especially the outer rear bushings, are they not apt to slip on one or the other moving surfaces?

[North Coast Cab]

Safe,
If you are only changing the sway bar and bushing you need not remove the a-arms. With a little bit of paitence you can get the upgraded bar in with the a-arms in place. You should be able to do the whole job in an hour or two.
If you decide to remove and replace all the a-arm bushing then the choice is really yours. If it is a fun/DE car I'd stick with the OEM rubber.
You don't give the year of the car, but if it's pre '90's I plan on replacing them all. The OEM rubber flows over time and can dramatically effect handling.

John

[Chuck Moreland]

Originally posted by Zeke
Chuck, I'm having a hard time with that statement. You may ceratainly be correct, but why would a non moving bushing need a lubricant? Or are you simply speaking of a dressing/preservative?

I don't mean to split hairs. I/we want to understand the function of the OEM rubber bushing and its proper replacement with same. But, if you lubricate, especially the outer rear bushings, are they not apt to slip on one or the other moving surfaces?

Doah! I meant without lubrication. I've edited my original post to correct.

Rubber control arm / spring plate bushings are not supposed to be lubricated.