Final Engine Rebuild Costs
 

I've collected the final receipts for the engine rebuild costs, and would like to share with you guys (gender neutral). Note that this rebuild includes all new-almost-everything but did not split the case, as there were only 80,000 track and long distance miles on her. But new P&C, new seals, gaskes, updates, etc:

$3,058 Engine Parts
$1,785 Engine Labor at $30/hr (PCA member and friend)
$ 722 Transmission Parts (synchros, dog teeth, etc.)
$ 390 Trans. Labor at $30/hr. same PCA friend)
$ 626 Machining and Welding
$ 157 Misc. Parts (fluids, cleaners, paint, etc.)
$ 300 Bead blasting and Powdercoating
_______________________________________
$7,038 GRAND TOTAL

The labor listed is that of a friend who had all the speciality Porsche tools, such as engine stand, etc. and who helped with the major, difficult stuff. Had I had the confidence to do it all myself then, I could have saved $2,175 in labor, but at the risk of having less confidence in the final outcome.

I think that I can say that I now have more confidence in my own abilities (since I am also very anal in doing things the "correct" and meticulous way), and so I'm ready for another rebuild.

I might even try a new engine, without body to go with it, just for the satisfaction of doing another, and then perhaps buying a Beck's Spyder or Beck's 904 in which to put that engine.

Have I got it bad?

Good Job. It's nice to see dollars attached to some of this stuff to give people an idea of what's involved financially.

By my math, your friend saved you about 5 grand. I hope you bought him beer!
$1785+$390=$2175 your labor costs
$2175/$30=72.5 hours
72.5($100/hr for a typical shop)=$7250 labor costs
It goes to show you one thing: These cars are expensive to maintain if you pay someone else to do it.

Good friend you have!
And yes the p-cars are a very expensive to maintain if you are not a DIY man, the best you can do is evry time you bought something to your car get a book and some P-tool to.
My .02

that's a cheap one, i ran a 2500 euro bill for the machine work alone
then another 2 grand for P&C's

and another 2.5 grand to get my mfi redone

and another 1.5 grand for new cams and rockers

and that's not counting misc stuff like chemicals, gaskets , nuts and bolts
of course , while i'm doing it , might as well replace my fan shroud which is full of holes and cracks

and i'm talking euro's here , multiply with 1.2 to get the dollar estimate...

oh yeah , i'm kinda not progressing at the moment , coz i need to manwhore a little bit more so i can use my bigalow bankaccount to fill the hole in my porschewhore account

i managed to spend more money on repair/rebuild bills than i bought the car from... i'm chasing Steve Wilkinson , but i'm going for silver plated instead

have you got it bad? i'de say no :D:D

Does this guy need any new friends? I'll bet he could make quite a few if he wanted.

Do these DOLLAR FIGURES bother anyone but us?

We have been in racing for a long time, and are very well aquainted with "extra premium" connected with any performance parts (just like the moment one mentions "boat" the price of common rope automatically triples!).

Having said that, the cost of ownership of a 911, older or newer, is nothing short of astronomical! Andras could have purchased an early '90s Corvette, complete with an extra set of wheels, for what he paid for his upper end motor rebuild, plus a trans refresh. Perhaps most of us do not want a 'Vette, but where is the prespective here??

One year ago, we had a similar R&R performed on our Formula Continental - motor rebuild including machining, parts replacement, transaxle overhaul, no beadblasting - also by a friend in SCCA, whom we paid for his time - $1800.

There are addictions, there is the need for speed, and then there is just plain throwing money away. This is not directed at Andras in particular, but at we Porsche owners in general. $ 3800 for engine and trans REBUILD parts?!? What are we doing?

Ed LoPresti
RacePro Engineering

Ed, That's why I want to build a hot rodded Mitsi Eclipse GSX to take to the track to annoy the diehards at a PCA DE event :D Not that it would be cheap, but much cheaper :)

This business is not for the faint of heart or weak of wallet. The silly rascles that own these machines do it for many reasons and lets face it, investment is not one of them (e.g. 911 4sale, $58K invested, asking $13K OBO). If nothing else, it proves to be a great hobby with an amazing network of people involved. My wife bought into it by rationalizing "at least he isn't out in the bars, at the deer lease or on the lake every weekend". I know a bunch of guys who drop thousands each year on killing deer, boating and general deauchary. At the end of the year they have not much to show for it but some deer meat sausauge or boat expenses that would allow 3 rebuilds. (plus the cars are way too cool).

How much does it cost to lease a deer? ;) Sorry, I coudn't resist!

I sold my last Porsche, a '78 911 SC, (a $10,000 purchase) when I realized that in order to be happy with the car it needed paint, upholstery, AC, etc. worth about $8,000, and that then my car would be worth about $11,000. I am now shopping (older, wiser and with a fatter account) for a 911 Carrera, and I will pay whatever I need to to get the right car, because unless you are as talented and daring as some of the folks on this board, major work on a 911 is a losing proposition.

rickdm

rickdm: PCA's Maverick Slipstream had several 911 Carreras listed locally. If you don't get Slipstream, I'll e-mail you the details on them.

PorscheVirgin: depends on your intentions...

There was nothing really "wrong" with my 38,000 mile car, other than some much needed regular maintainence, fixing the AC, and fixing some broken switches.

Included:
Fixing Speedo-Odo
Fixing Dimmer Switch
Fixing Fog Lights
Fixing and Converting AC
Replacing Belts
Rebuilding Rear CV Joints
Replacing Shocks
Replacing Hood and Trunk Shocks
Adjusting Valves
Change all fluids and Filters
New Brake Rotors and Pads
Complete Engine Lookover

Total Time 22 Hours
Cost $4167.00

But it drives like a new car. This was the first Major maintainence in 16 years, so cost of ownership is reasonable. Wonder what a 87 Ferrari would cost to keep in mint condition?

Hi Ed,

I guess what is wrong with us (Porsche people in general) is that we (my wife and I in particular) have owned this car since we picked it up at the factory, and, except for the engine, it is in "perfect" condition. It still takes most peoples' breath away, it is so nice and so original.

However, 22 years of track events and long-distance driving have created problems with the engine, and they had to be fixed. Two pistons had broken lands, one piston/cylinder interface showed blow-by, and six compression rings were broken. In spite of all this, the car ran beautifully, put out 158 HP at the chassis dyno one week before the re-build, and started right up each and every time.

We decided to "fix" the engine, and now feel that it will last another 22 years before we leave it to our small children for THEIR stewardship of this magnificent beast. I have no doubt that it will last that long that they can in turn leave it to their children as a legacy.

The cost, by the way, was arrived at by my comparing prices for each and every component, and buying the OEM Part from the least expensive supplier; and my spread sheet shows the savings of the NEXT LOWEST PRICE, not to mention what we COULD HAVE PAID if we had gone to the "normally accepted Porsche parts houses" was over $5,000 in parts alone!

So, the moral of the story? Perhaps it is the cost of parts that is so expensive. Why are parts suppliers trying to get rich off of all of us? Is making a decent living not enough any more?

Those are the real queastions!!!!!

Peace and cheers...........Andras

I bet you typically clean the Waterford and let the grandkids finger print the Lenox. We tend to take care and pride in the things that we recognize as being worthwhile and beautiful with percieved and recognized value. The concept of the $800 hammer takes into account the gov contractors equation of price = margin + (indirect and direct costs pools). Porsche and their parts can get the margins becuase they get little to no price objections and also becuase of limited quantity and in some cases increased design/engineering costs. But at the end of the day, something is only worth what someone is willing to pay.

Andras,

Although your costs seem a bit high to me for a top-end job, they are 'nominal' ... these days!

<b>All of these comments about 'alternative' uses of the money spent buying anything else new are a bit misplaced and riduculoius!!!</b>

My [hopefully] soon to be ex-brother-in-law bought a new, fancy Chevy Suburban in 1988 ... and has spent at least the following in maintenance and repairs during about 200K miles of ownership and paying someone else to do the work:

1. 2 rebuilt transmissions @$750+

2. 1 rebuilt rear axle @$1400+

3. 1 engine rebuild @$3900+

4. 3 new alternators @ $500+

<b>Soooo .... Chevy ownership isn't any bargain, either!!!</b>

BTW, my sister gets it -- his pride'n joy hunting truck ... though it still needs a paint job, real bad! Lousy GM metallic paint is peeling and craked all over! Also, it needs some brake work, now, too, so it is parked for the meantime. You can't immagine what he has spent on deer leases and out-of-state hunting licenses in Colorado over the past 25 years! All to bring home a couple of whitetail & antelope freebies, and one actual mule deer!

The cost does also act something like a high pass filter; most of the people I've deat with in this hobby seem to have a more serious and thorough nature than the typical "motorhead." Jim

It looks like more than just a typical "top end" job to me.

He replaced the pistons and cylinders, too, using new parts. Those aren't cheap!

Owning a car for many years to come
 

I have no problem investing money in a vehicle I plan to own for a long, long time. When I'm ready to rebuild my engine, I plan to go at it with the mindset that the final product will be an engine that will carry the vehicle another 20 years. There's not much room for shortcutting it if you have that mindset.

When I looked into buying a 911 I researched how much parts went for. In general they appeared to be roughly 1/3 more than the cost of more common vehicles. In reality that's not bad for a vehicle that isn't mass produced. Mass production has it's benefits, the best being that you normally get aftermarket competition driving parts prices lower. The drawback is that you have to go out of your way to arrive at something unique. Our cars don't fit in that category, they are unique from day one.

Appreciate your figures, for some reason not too many folks like to provide major project costs.

Thanks, Gordo

Hello Andras,
This price differential is extremely interesting to me, as I am about to get into my '78 911 SC with two broken head bolt studs. I'm curious who you audited as OEM parts sources, and who your top three suppliers turned out to be.

Gary S.