Value of 74 911

[Jay H]

Hi All:

I’m looking into a 1974 911 and wondering what this car might be worth. Any and all opinions, advice and criticisms would be welcomed. I’ve only seen pictures and have not driven the car. It’s quite a distance from me; hence I thought I would get some opinions before continuing to pursue this car. Details are as follows:

-1974 911 (base model – not an “S” or Carrera) 150 hp, 2.7 liter.
-Mileage appears to be 150,000.
-2.7 engine has head stud update done and Carrera tensioners have been fitted, but I’m unsure as to how long ago this work has been completed.
-Repainted in it’s original color, but there is overspray in various areas. Repaint is due to age and to fix rust areas. All rust is said to be ‘taken care of’. Re-paint is not of concours quality.
-Interior looks 30 years old and intact. Would need carpets, door panels, rear deck, trunk carpet, seat repairs and other misc trim items (which can get extensive) to be very presentable. It is passable right now. I am able to address most interior issues with my own labor.
-I do not know how this particluar car's 915 tranny and clutch feels or shifts, though car is said to run and drive well.
-All the other unknowns about this car need to be found out and I would assume the worst in most cases. Some records are present, but I have not inspected them yet and don’t know what they entail.

Asking price is $10,000. I’m thinking this car might be worth closer to $6000-7000 due to the interior needs, average paint, past rust issues (rust never sleeps) and potential mechanical needs (tranny rebuild, clutch, brakes, exhaust, etc.). I need to inspect this car in person (to find all it’s faults) and to drive it first, but am I all wet in thinking of $6-7k price range or is the seller pricing this car correctly?

Thanks again,

Jay
90 964

[IROC]

I even think that $6-$7k is a little optimistic. Off the top of my head, I was thinking around $5k until you mentioned the asking price. $10k will buy alot of 911 these days. 150k miles on a 2.7 without a total rebuild is quite a few miles.

Unfortunately, the particular 911 is nothing special and it either could be a great car giving you years of enjoyment or it could be a money pit.

If you do decide to pursue it, I would get a good PPI and try and evaluate what it is really worth. Unless the car is orange, which makes it extremely valuable and you need to send the guy a check sight unseen. :>)

Mike

[Bob's Flat-Six]

The car is priced to high, for So Cal anyway.
I always ask myself, If I buy this vehicle and do a lot of work to it what will I have when I'm done ? Will it be a desirable 911 ?
I never like a car from the start that has a bad repaint. It's just too costly to correct.
If I was looking for a project, I would rather try to find an original car, ie. paint , not much rust, etc etc. that needs motor or trans work.
But this all depends on what your looking for. If it's for a driver or if your looking for a project for weekend fun or ???

[Tooth911]

Hi Jay I have a 77 911s so Iam familiar with mid year 911s I had my motor rebult at 162k .sometime befor I owned the car 3 head studs where timeserted. all is well. your price est of 6 to 7k is about right.But the paint and rust is abig concern.in 77 porsche went to galvinised bodys to get rust out of the picture. for 10k or so you would be way better off with a 78 or79 SC . a 3L motor 39mm intake ports and 180 HP.with some exhaust mods like SSI you could get 200hp apx. Go test drive one you never be the same!

[bigchillcar]

a '74 can be loads of fun. mid year cars can be considered a sort of compromise between the early cars and the the sc and later models. it's lighter than a later car and has the 7:31 ring and pinion, as opposed to the 8:31 of the later car, so it has that great seat in the pants kick. additionally, the '74 in particular has a unique exhaust with a beautiful note considered the most desireable of most of the cars. also, a '74 is the only mid-year car not to have thermal reactors which allowed the car to run cooler than the '75-'77 cars, which was a large part of the temperature-created head stud issues. personally, my '74 looks like a 'sleeper' with it's narrow-hipped look, but i will tell you that mine won't ever be for sale and has never quit growing on me...there's no sc model i'd trade mine for.

look at the pics of mine in my profile. the paint was very good on mine when purchased from the previous owners who had taken good care of it. i feel like i 'stole' mine for 6.5k, it had about 80k on it as well, but i wouldn't take twice that today for the time and love i continue to put into it and mine is driven daily. the '74 is a cool car...i'm not scared of mine...i drive the **** out of it and it never fails to put a big grin on my face. good luck. 6-7k sounds reasonable...i admit 10k sounds high though in present condition, as much as i'd like to a '74 bringing more...
ryan

[competentone]

Originally posted by Jay H
-Repainted in it’s original color, but there is overspray in various areas. Repaint is due to age and to fix rust areas. All rust is said to be ‘taken care of’. Re-paint is not of concours quality.

If the re-paint is poor expect any rust repair to be poor too (probably just fiber-glassed over?).

If the car is in WI (or anywhere where there has been salt applied on the roads) expect a lot of rust that you can't see -- especially if it's been covered with recent "paint."

As the others have said, it sounds way over-priced -- they may get their asking price from someone who "wants a Porsche," but nobody who knows the cars will pay that much for what you describe.

Pass.

[fintstone]

My '74 cost me just over $5k a few years ago with no rust, a good interior and good paint job. S-suspension, brakes, and gauges and nice fuchs. The S-parts are desireable and add to the value of a base car. It had the same engine as yours..competent performance, ran good, but leaked oil. Like most posters here. Once you own a Porsche..you will want everything...even the things that are "pretty good" to be perfect. I know I do. You will probably want to add an external oil cooler if someone has not already, etc..I am probably well over $20K total now and am sanding the "good" paint job for repspray. Other than the paint...I have about $5k more to spend to get it the way I want it. Mostly adding an upgraded A/C system that really works. Unless the car has had significant recent repair...it is probably a "fixer upper" and will need significant work to bring it up to it's true potential."

On the other hand..I love my car...a '74 is a great choice due to the fact that it comes with a good factory exhaust and is not subject to emissions. The opening vent windows and chrome mirrors give it a nice look. It's 15 inch wheels/low gearing give some great 0-60 performace considering the size powerplant....although I opted for a modified 3.0 for mine. If it is not a daily driver, you can add/modify/fix things as you have time/money. I figure the rate I spend on mine over time is about the same as I would on a much lesser, newer car in payments except mine is not depreciating...so eventually I will come out ahead if I keep it forever...and I plan to.

Good luck!

[Jay H]

Thanks to all of you for the info and advice (both critical and positive). I appreciate it!

I do like the '74 year for the reasons billchillcar mentions above. To answer Bob's Flat Six, I'm looking for a presentable "weekend" car with the occasional trip to work on sunny Friday's. 3000-4000 miles per year max type of driving. I do feel anything I get will always need something and I'm prepared to do some restoration and repairs. I do have a good shop to help me with major issues (along with a slush fund we all need to keep a 911 running well).

My current 911 is a 964 which is a concours only car. I previously had an '86 3.2 which I loved to drive. I feel the need for an older car to mess with a bit and actually get to drive instead of sitting in the garage.

After I posted I thought too that if the paint was done cheaply, the (big quotes here) "rust removal" probably was done poorly or not at all.

More info: The original asking price was $12,000 in the ad, leading me to believe this was a low mile, mint condition '74 2.7 911S. More due diligence gleaned that it is a base 911 with the above mentioned issues. Hence my original post about the value of this particular car (I've not been watching 2.7 cars as of late).

Again, thank you all for the helpful advice! Any other thoughts are always welcome.

Jay
90 964

[LARRY SHARP]

Three years ago I bought my 1974 911S for $3500,, It was a engine fire car. The good things it had were Steel 73 carrera flares , real 15x7&8 Fuchs, Good interior, Very little rust. it was definatly a project car.. normals to me have low value especially if it has rust

[azasadny]

I bought my '74 on eBay 1 1/2 years ago for $6500.00, no rust, but small bump on rear fender, bad seats, cold starting problem, replica Fuchs. I've put about $3000 into the car since and have enjoyed every minute. I will put SSI's on it soon and I've replaced the replica Fuchs. I really enjoy my '74 for the reasons mentioned by the others. I would think the car is worth $5000 or so.

[CarreraS2]

Originally posted by fintstone
My '74 cost me just over $5k a few years ago . . . I am probably well over $20K total now

Once again proving the rule - all older 911s are $20K cars!

You either pay it up front, or pay it later!

[Zeke]

Originally posted by Jay H
Thanks to all of you for the info and advice (both critical and positive). I appreciate it!

I do like the '74 year for the reasons billchillcar mentions above. To answer Bob's Flat Six, I'm looking for a presentable "weekend" car with the occasional trip to work on sunny Friday's. 3000-4000 miles per year max type of driving. I do feel anything I get will always need something and I'm prepared to do some restoration and repairs. I do have a good shop to help me with major issues (along with a slush fund we all need to keep a 911 running well).

My current 911 is a 964 which is a concours only car. I previously had an '86 3.2 which I loved to drive. I feel the need for an older car to mess with a bit and actually get to drive instead of sitting in the garage.

After I posted I thought too that if the paint was done cheaply, the (big quotes here) "rust removal" probably was done poorly or not at all.

More info: The original asking price was $12,000 in the ad, leading me to believe this was a low mile, mint condition '74 2.7 911S. More due diligence gleaned that it is a base 911 with the above mentioned issues. Hence my original post about the value of this particular car (I've not been watching 2.7 cars as of late).

Again, thank you all for the helpful advice! Any other thoughts are always welcome.

Jay
90 964

Seems like your perspective is correct as well as your expectations. For a simpler fun driver that won't get you in a tizzy over a stone chip or a few rattles, not to mention a rust bubble or two, I think you're on the right path.

Except moneywise. 10K is too much to spend for your 'program.' Finding a nice car in WI w/o rust issues will be a challenge, but buying an out-of-state car can cost big money to ship (or your time and gas).

I try to keep 5K handy and look all the time. I haven't bought anything for a year (Oh, wait, I did too. A Targa for $200 that I parted this last Spring), but you never know and they come up when you least expect.

[Rufblackbird]

I agree with Noah... I just bought a running (albeit not great) '74 911S for $1500, which came with 2 extra set of rims, plus a ton of extra parts. Unless it was in really good condition I wouldn't pay more than say $3500. $10K can buy you a VERY nice 911 driver. But Brian is right...you either spend the money now, or you'll spend the money later.

[Jay H]

Originally posted by Zeke
Seems like your perspective is correct as well as your expectations. For a simpler fun driver that won't get you in a tizzy over a stone chip or a few rattles, not to mention a rust bubble or two, I think you're on the right path.

Except moneywise. 10K is too much to spend for your 'program.' Finding a nice car in WI w/o rust issues will be a challenge, but buying an out-of-state car can cost big money to ship (or your time and gas).

Thanks Zeke (and others) for the vote of confidence.

I think part of the problem with the initial price of this car is that the owner thinks he has a 2.7 Carrera and might not realize the VIN reveals a base 911. I'll probably speak to the owner again on Monday to see if that purchase price will drop substantially and if I can glean some more info on the extent of body repairs and other mechanical issues. If not, I'm not wasting any more time on it.

911's in Wisconsin are tough to find. My previous '86 was a WI car and the PO used it in the winter (and the exposure to salt). After 14 years, I had good proof as to why a valued 911 should be stored during the winter and keep them out of the salt. What a mess that undercarriage and body was, even with the zinc coated body...

The three 2.7 liter cars I've seen for sale over the past several years in this area were priced at or above $10,000. A nice '77 I missed this fall was priced at $14,000 (show car, original paint, interior, updated 2.7, relatively low miles and full records) and wasn't advertised long. Demand seems to exceed supply. Also another reason I thought $6000 or $7000 might not be too bad for an intial buy in on a '74.

I do appreciate the collective opinion that the car I'm looking at should really only be worth $3000 to $5000.

Another question for the board: How rare is a non sunroof car of this era? Are options such as power windows and factory A/C also relatively rare? I prefer something without these items, though obviously one can't be too picky when it comes to used 911's.

Thanks again,

Jay
90 964

[bigchillcar]

jay,
i can't speak directly to the sunroof or power windows question, but in those days, there was no 'factory air'. air conditioning was a dealer add-on. i believe there were two dealer add-ons depending upon where you lived. my '74 had it supplied by a company called 'cool aire'.
ryan

[MAS]

I dunno about the States, but here in BC, I don't think I've ever seen any 911 (of any year) priced below $10,000 (Canadian). A typical SC will run you $17-25,000, with the mid-year cars between 10-15k, depending on condition, of course.

Sounds to me like us folks in the rest of the world should come down and buy out all of your bargain $4k cars and resell them for a healthy profit elsewhere


-MAS

[Wayne 962]

I'll chime in here. There's nothing really rare about the 1974-77 cars, so don't pay extra for sunroofs, or no sunroofs. Notable exceptions are the Carreras though, but I won't discuss them here.

Noah's right - to a degree. The problem with the 1974-77 cars is two-fold: no galvanized protection on the boddies (actually, I think they started mid-1977, but I can't recall off the top of my head), and the 2.7 engine. The 1974s are definitely the best with respect to the engine. 2.7T motors from 1974 seem to avoid the pulled head stud problem much more than the later cars (due to the fact that the later cars run hotter because of all that emissions stuff). But this is stuff you guys all know...

It's tough to put values on these cars because they are squeezed by the "Porsche premium" for parts and service. While $10K sounds a bit high, $3K for a good, running car is too low as well. The cars are butting up against the lower end of the price range (where the parts of the car are worth more than the whole) and are limited by the top end of the range (where too much paid, may not cover potential engine problems). So, the cars trade in a very, very narrow range.

My advice? If you only have $3K to spend, then find a good driver with some semblance of mechanical maintenance. I've known 1974-77 cars to run for years with no problems (but these are the exceptions). At around $3K for a car like this, you really can't get hurt.

On the other hand, $8-$10K should get you a pristinely maintained car with good paint, good interior and good maintenance records. Because the cars trade in this narrow range, you can get a good deal on the top end (where more money was put into the car than it's worth) or the bottom end (where the parts are worth more than the car itself). What I don't really care for are the $6K cars that need work and hence are not worth it if you part it out, and also will require $10-$15K worth of work to bring back to "really nice condition."

My point? If you're trying to conserve capital ($$$), buy an excellent condition 1974-77 car that needs nothing for $10K, or buy a heap for $3K and drive the heck out of it until the engine blows up, and then part it out.

-Wayne

[SLO-BOB]

Jay,

Where in Wisconsin are you?

I bought my 77 911s in Milwaukee a few months back. I paid 10.5k for it, but it's from Arizona and it shows. Also, it's been pretty much recently restored-paint, motor, etc. Basically it looks/runs like a new 77. I may have paid a bit too much but the car needs nothing and as has been noted, finding a good, rust-free, vintage 911 here in Wisconsin isn't easy.

Any classic car I've owned (there's been a bunch) have either been recently brought here from a southern state-no Wisconsin winters, or I flew over to get it. If it's a native Wisconsin car-I'de pass regardless of price, except for parts value maybe.

Re: 2.7 mtors. Is there a motor that hasn't been upgraded yet? I've been told they have probably all failed and been junked or improved by now. Also, most have had their emissions stuff removed . I wouldn't, or should I say didn't, get scared off by the 2.7 problems.

[bigchillcar]

jay,
glad to see people willing to pay a little more for a well-sorted mid-year car. as you and i know, they can be a well kept good secret of sorts. kudos...

ryan

[Jay H]

Originally posted by Wayne at Pelican Parts
What I don't really care for are the $6K cars that need work and hence are not worth it if you part it out, and also will require $10-$15K worth of work to bring back to "really nice condition."

Wayne: Thank you for your post. Just from the pics and limited info I have, this car might be one of those $6000 cars you speak of...

Ryan: Thanks for the A/C info.

Sebring: I'm just north of Milwaukee. I wonder if your car was the one I saw for the $14k asking price a few months back (Sebring White, Saddle leather, $8k rebuild...seems to match your user ID!)? Regarding WI cars, I agree that they are not desireable if they see salt. My 964 has never been exposed to salt and limited rain (though it's originally a N Carolina car) and there is not even one corroded fastener on it's undercarriage. As I mentioned earlier, my '86 was a different story...

If I learn more tomorrow, I'll post what I find out on this '74...

Thanks to all again,

Jay
90 964