What exactly is the case orientation when splitting?
 

1. Is the case split in the normal "upright" position?

2. Can this be done on the floor, or on two crates?

3. Can anything fall out if done improperly?


Thanks

(just the right heads, right chain housing, and flywheel left to remove before splitting)

You really should use the correct motor stand if splitting the case. There are bolts on both sides and you need to be able to spin the case. You want the through bolts facing up with the case half not connected to the yolk up... Then it can be split and the crank won't drop or fall out... I'm sure it's possible without the proper yolk, but I don't think there are many here that would recommend a case split without it. Plus, it's REQUIRED for the reassembly...

If you would just break down and buy Wayne's Engine Rebuild book, you wouldn't have to keep asking these questions. Not trying to sound like an asss, but it really is money well spent.

Do this on the stand and adapter yoke specified in the rebuild book. As many have stated before, it's time to slow down and stop half-assing this project.

If you lived anywhere close I would loan you my engine stand with the proper yoke... you have to have it laying on one side as Geoff mentioned so that everything does not fall out and damage things futher.

Joe A

Put the case up on an old tree stump with lots of old leaves piled up on either side. Spilt the case with Lincoln's axe. The leaves will catch the internals when everything rolls out of the case.

Make sure you clean off the leaves before reassembly, however, I hear one or two in a bearing half will help tighen up a worn bearing. You should mic the leaves so you know which ones to use.

That is to funny . yeah what zeke said

CLASSIC!!!!

I agree with Zeke with regard to mic-ing the leaves, you might need an undersized or oversized leaf to make it work. You wouldn't want to be off either way...:eek:

Back on subject. The book will demonstrate all that needs to be done. You want to do it with the proper stand and yoke. You want to keep a couple of nuts on the bolts in case it lets loose and goes flying towards the floor. If you follow this, it won't be a problem.

But, buy the book. In some cases it's much better than even the Porsche shop manuals.

Michael

I posted here several days ago the picture, in hand, of Wayne's Rebuilding book I already purchased.

Just wanted to continue the project where possible. This is my first rebuild of any engine.

Thanks (I think).

Purchasing the book and not reading it is the problem. Wayne is clear on the need to use a proper stand and yolk, and goes through the splitting process... It's not hard, but you need to get the right tools to do it well.

Can't agree more....."Read" "it", but also read the ingenuity of "Evil Engine Stand" thread on this forum, but did not see any dimensions for the "yoke" on that thread.

And yes I did obtain the recommended crows foot and cam holding tool, and by posting Q & A, learned more in the process. As for example the pitfall of using the incorrect socket tool.

Assumptions vs. thoroughness, one likes to know the possibilities.

or you could maybe get the book in a library

or buy it / use it / resell it

I just don't understand the reluctance to spend a few pennies -- what are ya gonna do for parts??? You could smelt your own ore, forge the stuff, machine it....

Randy,

Its more than the reluctance to spend a few pennies. I had to pry it out of him to get a name, but now we know that its Kirk that we are trying to help with the engine. Funny but I at least like to know who I am typing with but then I am an old fart I guess...

I pretty much offered him the use of my yoke and engine stand in a post above but it would require an address and guess he is either in "deep cover" and cannot disclose that or he is not interested. I taught aircraft maintenance in a University for many years and have worked with a lot of people who want to learn, but this is a new one for me.

We do not want to know the number of warts on his Grandmothers fanny but a little more information would help. I would bet a good bottle of whiskey (or Gran Marnier) that there is someone who lives near where he is who could help but trying to find it out is like pulling teeth with some people. I fly all over the country for my living and would try to stop by and help him but its not been accepted... and I offered...

We keep trying to help and someday hopefully he will accept it. Those of us who have been there and done that know what works and what will cost more (sometimes a lot more) in the end but until he is interested in the help theres not much more we can do.

JoeA

I have the book (and the purchased receipt), and posted a picture
of it on on the spark plug thread on 11-4-04 (unedited post).

Again, just trying to be thorough and know the possibilities.

Should I join the sarcasm parade too? Sorry, I'm not an aircraft engineer, I'm interested in facts.

The sarcasm is giving way to indignation. You refuse to share such details as your name and location. Yeah, you posted a name, but I presume the fact that "Kirk" was in quotaton marks means it is not your name. For a community that's rather tightly knit here, that's a bit of a slap in the face. Call us petty, but that's how we are.

What drives the board crazy is when people ask for advice and then proceed to ignore it. You've shown a tendency toward that, but either we're misinterpreting it or you're not acknowledging it.

We're trying to help. But without your location, for example, we can't recommend a nearby machine shop for you to send your parts to for measuring and reconditioning. Nor can we supply you with a local board member for tool loans and a helping, hand during the rebuild.

So anyway, here is some help without sarcasm:

Yes, if you absolutely must, you can split the case without the stand. It isn't easy, especially singlehanded, but it can be done. I absolutely don't recommend it for a first timer. But if you must...

Once your parts are all on the table, it's time for examination! The next step is going to be evaluation of your parts...case, crank, oil pump, intermediate shaft, rods, pistons, cyliners, heads, cams, rockers, cam housings...EVERYTHING needs examination. An experienced eye helps but most will require precision measuring equipment. If you're not planning to build engines often, it's generally not worth buying these tools, and you can let your machine shop handle all the measuring and inspecting.

Especially as you have a magnesium case motor, your machine shop options are going to be limited to very experienced shops specializing in 911 and VW motors. As you'll read here on the board and in the 911 books, the mag cases are finichy and require special (and pricey) care. Without knowing where you are, you get the generic response on machine shops: EBS, Ollies, CE, etc.

Once your machine work has been written up for an estimate, you're going to have a much better idea of how much this rebuild is going to cost, as the rest of it is pretty much just straight parts replacement. At that point you'll be able to budget any performance mods you wish to make. Chances are good you'll be needing new or good used pistons and cylinders (hey, ya need at least one, right??). Costs vary greatly here and the choice was the most agonizing part of my own rebuild...as my choice in piston influenced my cam selection, too.

As mentioned above, I have left the removal of the right heat exchanger (nuts already off), oil cooler, right chain housing, and right covers/heads .

I'll look again in the book for a photo of the engine actual orientation at the time of separation (to keep anything from falling out)

I know absolutely positive, at the minimum, two pistons must be replaced.

Yes, I've already checked some addresses on machine shops specific for Porsches, and (being an early car) plan on contacting Stoddards also.

It's been approx. thirteen days, so at my pace not rushing it.

Hang on here fellas (and a few ladies at times).

Did we all get off on the wrong foot here? I know from experience that this board can be a little intimidating at times. There's a lot of experience out there, and sometimes a little arrogance. But, once you learn the folks on the board, learn who has genuine knowledge and who are just posers, you begin to trust a little more.

I found a lot of folks around the Denver area that were willing to help me during my rebuild. It struck me at first as odd that in this day and age of non-trust, you can meet a bunch of folks via the internet that share the same passion for a piece of machineary (albeit a beautiful piece of machineary). And these people not only lent support, they stopped by my house to lend tools and expertise.

So, maybe we're over-reacting a little. Porsche people, at least those that wrench on their cars themselves, are some of the nicest people I've ever met.

Michael

Are you seriously thinking of splitting the case with all of this intact? You also mentioned the flywheel still in place. It should have been one of the first things to remove. That case needs to be fully stripped before the split.

If you live anywhere near Atlanta, let me know. I just rebuilt my engine last spring...it was the first rebuild of any kind for me, as well. I have a lot of stuff you'll need, and I kind of want to participate in another rebuild.

Wayne's book is excellent. I ended up buying two, so I could get one greasy. But there are other books available as well...get all the advice you can get, I say.

Don't scrimp...once it's rebuilt you'll be glad you didn't.

Ah! That's easy. Look at the engine on the stand, from behind the stand, such that the flywheel end is facing you and the fan end is away from you. The case half to your left is what is bolted to the stand. The case half to your right is not. Turn the engine 90 degrees counterclockwise such that the right-side engine case half is pointed up.

Common fasteners to forget, which cause you to swear and curse trying to figure out why the case won't split:
-The 3 13mm nuts behind the flywheel
-The 1 15mm nut at the bearing saddle in the timing chain area
-Each and every perimeter nut (I usually miss one the first time around)

You'll also have to liberally apply your rubber mallet!

Who is H.G.P.?

That's the answer I was looking for! (The original title of the thread) Thanks!

Now it makes 2-46 and 2-47 quite clear.

1. Incidently, what is the engine apparently sitting on in 2-45 and 2-46?

2. Can I do everything with this adapter ring http://www.pelicanparts.com/catalog/images/Tools_folder/enginestand-mainely.jpg as the yoke?
What's the difference(s)?

The only difference you are going to find in using it is just the cost. About $100 difference.