The demise of CA chrome platers?

Evans, Marv · 12-23-2004, 01:13 PM

Just came back from the plater I have been using for years (San Diego area). The owner told me this is their last week of
operation after more than 50 years. According to the owner, the EPA/environmentalists are attempting to do away with plating operations in California and went back to violations for the last ten years to justify closing the business. In fact this is the last week for THREE plating businesses in the area.
Anybody got any ideas about what organizations they can go to for help? I already did a search - didn't come up with anything.
Buck Knives just moved to Montana from here, because of the negative business climate in CA.

makaio · 12-23-2004, 02:08 PM

I agree that it sucks to loose a buisness such as this, but have you ever seen the chemicals they use? It's some pretty toxic $hit, and can really mess you up. They don't just give companies a violation because they spilled an ounce our two on the ground either. They were probably doing something regularly that wasn't up to code, and it finally caught up to them.

Jim Sims · 10:04 PM

"Cadmium platers" are going too and for good reason; there are much better (effectiveness versus cost including environmental costs) plating systems available now. Cheers

Joe Bob · Joe Bob's Garage

They can't compete with the imported stuff...no one WANTS to get into the business anymore due to the haz waste disposal charges.....the old timers are clsoing up shop...

When they dumped the chemicals down the drain they made money....personally I think they are blaming the regualtory community for their OWN problems. They could compete if they WANT to....but it's a nasty business.

Chrome is just not as prevalant as it used to be, less business less palters.....it's NOT the EPA...the big guys and imports are forcing out the smaller job shops.

randywebb · 12-23-2004, 04:42 PM

Holy crap! They've been breaking the law for 10 years! They are lucky it's the state after them and not an env'l group.

BTW, fines under the Clean Water Act can go as high as $27,500 per violation per day. I've never seen a company get hit with the maximum however -- no matter how many children were born with flippers instead of arms & legs.

Zeke · 12-23-2004, 04:57 PM

This is weird. A plater goes out of business in San Diego? Hell, I'd open up in a store front and send Jose to Mexico every morning with a load and bring back what is done. If a plater went out of business hundreds of miles from Mexico, I could understand.

Something else going on....

LongDuckDong · 12-23-2004, 05:16 PM

When I lived in Detroit I use to call on chrome platers. I can't undestand how someone could work in those conditions every day. The fumes were overwhelming. Half the guys that worked there didn't even wear respirators and trust me, these guys didn't have any brain cells to spare.

I call on the ARB (California Air Resources Board) and they were telling me some platers in Sacramento were having problems operating within the guidelines as well

Joe Bob · Joe Bob's Garage

Ummm, "I" am a local Investigator for the EPA...BTW...

Evans, Marv · 12-23-2004, 07:14 PM

Well, first of all the owner told me the violations they had been notified over the ten year period had been minor and corrected immediately. I don't know how true it is, but the owner is a 75 year old woman who took over the business when her father died over 50 years ago and I tend to put some credence in her word. Second, some of the workers at the shop have been working there for over 20 years. They wear protective gear and the work areas area really well ventilated. Also, many times over the past years I've taken things there to be plated, she has commented about how they tried to be environmentally conscious. So I agree that they do use caustic chemicals and it's a messy business, but I have the impression she has done as much as she can to follow the law. I also found it odd that two other area shops would be closing at the exact same time. I know there are platers in Mexico that don't give a damn about the environment, aren't as well regulated and maybe more business will be going to them, which won't help the environment overall.

randywebb · 07:49 PM

Well, I don't know the facts for that company. Of course, a minor violation to her might be major to someone who got sick.... Regulatory agencies - once they decide to regulate - usually make it look like they will do something major to the company regulated, and then wind up doing a lot less.

Some industry segments are just inherently "dirty." But companies vary within each segment. e.g. Intel and Hyudai Semi are in the same segement (same business too) - Intel has won numerous awards for being a clean/green company (tho I'm sure they aren't perfect) and EPA chose them to pioneer self-reporting and some other programs. Hynix (Hyundai) is definitely at the other end.

Anyway, I see that there are two questions for us:
1. If you want to match the older style Cd plating, where do you send it.
2. If you don't care about matching it, what are the better treatments to use (see Jim Sims' post above)? Most have used the yellow Zn, but maybe Jim knows of better surface treatments....

Jim Sims · 12-23-2004, 10:03 PM

Superior tin zinc replacement for cadmium:

http://www.burbankplating.com/salt.htm

randywebb · 12-23-2004, 10:30 PM

Thx, Jim.

rdane · rdane's Garage

http://www.techplate.com/index.htm

I have used these guys for years.

daka · 12-24-2004, 12:02 PM

OK, so now it goes to Mexico, or some other country where there is basically no inspection....where's the "saving" of pollution, we all live on this PLANET. Better to make it safe and have cost more !!! I'm not a tree hugger either.

CarreraS2 · 12-24-2004, 12:09 PM

Fuchs wheels throughout CA are breathing a sigh of relief.

Hugh R · 12-24-2004, 12:21 PM

Its mostly the Air toxics risk assessments. The unit risk values for hexavalent chromium are very, very low (meaning high cancer potential from very low concentrations in air). Like MikeZ I used to work for the local air pollution district in Los Angeles, then as an air quality consultant for about 20 years. The regulators look at the lowest published risk factors, and then set a "safe" concentration at 1,000 to 1,000,000 times below that level. The silly thing is about 70%+ of the excess cancer risk in Los Angeles has been shown to actually come from diesel exhaust.

randywebb · 12-24-2004, 12:29 PM

Thx, Hugh. If I remember right you work or worked for CARB?

BTW, the only thing we got out of Christie Whitman (former EPA Head under Bush 2.1) before she gave up on it, was to put thru the old CLinton reg. on diesel exhaust. So in a few years, that will start to clean up... Can't be too soon. I'm hoping we can switch a lot of those engines to bio-diesel.

randywebb · 12-24-2004, 12:32 PM

Thx, Hugh. If I remember right you work or worked for CARB?

BTW, the only thing we got out of Christie Whitman (former EPA Head under Bush 2.1) before she gave up on it, was to put thru the old CLinton reg. on diesel exhaust. So in a few years, that will start to clean up... Can't be too soon. I'm hoping we can switch a lot of those engines to bio-diesel.

And then tere are interactive effects.... eg. what happens when hex-Cr is adsorbed onto a tiny diesel exhaust particle and finds its way deep into the lungs of prenant woman who is immuno-compromised by exposure to pthalates....

Well, think I'll go get some used oil on my hands....

Carrera3.5L · Carrera3.5L's Garage

If you still want cadmium plating done, Reid Metal Finishing in Santa Ana, CA does it as well. Have used them for various projects over the years.

Ralph