Opinions for 70S Targa project

[BK911]

I asked this question before. But things change, so I wanted some current opinions…

The car is a numbers matching Euro 70S Targa in pretty bad shape. Originally silver. It would need a TOTAL restoration. Both fenders, hood, doors and front pan are all rusty. But the torsion tube area and floor pans look fine. Interior looks OK, but would need a lot of attention as well. It did not come with sport seats. Supposedly the engine had all the machine work done but wasn’t assembled very well. It would need a total rebuild too.

It does have a front heater, rear window wiper, front oil cooler, deep 6 fuchs, and metal front spoiler.

I see three options:
1. Part her out
2. Restore her myself
3. Sell her as is

I can not part her out. I just can’t do it. She needs to be restored, so option #1 is out.

Let’s pretend that I could do all the restoration work myself, minus the paint. About how much would it cost for a decent restoration? How much would she be worth afterwards?

How much is she worth as is? There’s a lot of good stuff there!

[Jim Richards]

BK, it all depends on the quality / thoroughness of the restoration. I wouldn't be surprised if you spent at least $50K for the restoration, and then you'd have a nice $3?K 911S. Maybe you could save some on the restoration assuming work you can do. It would be great to save another long hood, especially an S.

[Peterfrans]

For the money that went into my targa I could have bought a much nicer, more original car to start with. Yours looks even worse than mine did. I would sell her.

[W Scott Shores]

Even if you restore most of it yourself, I doubt the numbers will ever add up right to justify the effort economically. It would have to be a labor of love.

You have a soul, so Option #1 is out. That's a good thing. If you choose #3, hopefully you'll be able to vet the potential buyers and sell it to somebody ready to embark on a long (and expensive) labor of love himself.

[Shaun @ Tru6]

Most of that will just buff out!

the best thing to do is put it up on eBay with lots of pictures and a reserve high enough that you know someone won't part it after purchase.


Can I send you down a set of 14's in exchange for those wheels though?

[dmcummins]

If you do all the work yourself and take pride in restoring something it can be done. Your not going to make money on it but you will know whats been done. Its not hard to replace the fenders, doors and hood. I don't know about replacing the suspension pan but it a common fix. You need to start tearing it apart to make sure you don't have any other supprizes. Start keeping a eye out in the classifieds for parts. Make a list of everything you need and price.

I have done mostly cosmetic repairs on mine so far but its a blast to drive. I need to redo the top, fix some oil leaks, and the trans whines in 5th gear. I'll get to those when I get my 73 back together. I did everything except recover the sport seats myself. I spent about $8000 so far and Im guessing about 150 hrs.

[dmcummins]

Here's some pics. I stripped the car and removed all the glass and interior. I had the seats redone and replaced most of the interior and seats.

[SandyI]

Well, if you're going to take on a complete restoration, a 70 911S is a great car to save.

But I have to agree that you could purchase a car that's complete and restored for much less than it's going to cost you to fix that one.

[Shaun @ Tru6]

You know if you can do all the rust work yourself, this may be a worthwhile endeavor depending on your timing and your goal.

Assuming you need to buy all new body panels:
pair of fenders: $500
hood: $150
pan: $250
doors: $500

so rounding up, you are into sheet metal for $1600 tops.

You disassemble and grind the car down to bare metal yourself and give it a $6000 paint job.

Now you are up to $8000 but you've got a beautiful roller.

Pull the engine and store it, find a nice 2.0 E or similar for $2500 and throw it in. 2.2 T's are a dime a dozen.

New dash: $1000
New winshield: $350
Nice carpet: $500
Good used interior panels: $500 or have them professionally redone for $1000

Doing the work yourself, total suspension rehab: $2000 in parts.

What have I missed?

Addiing it all up and a solid 1 year later, you'd have a gorgeous car for $15,000.

[SandyI]

Originally posted by Shaun 84 Targa


Pull the engine and store it, find a nice 2.0 E or similar for $2500 and throw it in. 2.2 T's are a dime a dozen.

Excuse me but putting an E or T engine basically kills the resale value of the car. In my opinion, the only reason to refurbish this particular car is to drive one of the greatest 911 engines ever built-- the 2.2 S! I mean, there's a reason you can find plenty of 2.2 T engines around.

[Porsche Doc]

I will give $1000 bucks for it.
And restore it!

[Shaun @ Tru6]

Originally posted by SandyI
Excuse me but putting an E or T engine basically kills the resale value of the car. In my opinion, the only reason to refurbish this particular car is to drive one of the greatest 911 engines ever built-- the 2.2 S! I mean, there's a reason you can find plenty of 2.2 T engines around.

Sorry, should have finished my thought on that. Swap the engine out just to make it drivable and get some enjoyment out of it.

Put $8K into the S motor while you are having fun.

BTW, not sure if you'll agree, but I like E engines better than S's.

[SandyI]

Originally posted by Shaun 84 Targa
BTW, not sure if you'll agree, but I like E engines better than S's.

I agree. My 2.0 E rocks. I'd never trade it for a 2.0 S.

[BK911]

Awesome, I appreciate all the input. If I did restore her, it would be as a driver. I would want to enjoy her without being too scared to go anywhere. $15k is the number I am hoping for, including paint.

What do you guys think about putting the original engine on a shelf and building another one for driving? That way the original case should stay in one piece, and could always be built up later.

[zotman72]

Part it out. Rust never sleeps. The front tin VIN plate might be worth holding on to.... Take everything to an unrusted '70 T body.
As one who did a full body restoration on my '72T, it is a labor of love, do you feel the "luv" from this car back to you right now?

[svandamme]

restore the snot out of it

911's are easy to take apart, and welding don't cost much
the most labour is stripping that under coating

4 words for that > stripper + wirebrush + Makita

then a good paint job and you have a rolling chassis that is the bizniz

the engine is another story, see my signature... it ain't cheap , but it's definately worth it...

[SandyI]

Originally posted by BK911
$15k is the number I am hoping for, including paint.

Personally, I'd find another project. You're going to be spending way over $15,000 just to get that car safe. And if you plan on driving the car fast or turning it right or left, I'd have another $15,000 ready to go.

[svandamme]

Originally posted by SandyI
Personally, I'd find another project. You're going to be spending way over $15,000 just to get that car safe. And if you plan on driving the car fast or turning it right or left, I'd have another $15,000 ready to go.

it's not a generous budget to do it , but it can be done if you have time, patience, and can do most of it yourself
how about painting it yourself ( read steve's book )
you mention that the engine machine work is allready done ( if well documented, and well done, then that saves you about 3 grand right there if it includes case, crank and valve heads + valves )

but i agree, you don't have any room for any extra's , or for any catastrophic things like an mfi pump that needs a full rebuild , tranny problems, or full interior / roof refurbishment
little room for errors within that budget,

but it can be done in it's basics > chassis fixed, engine rebuilt , drivable, but not ful cosmetics

[Shaun @ Tru6]

I humbly have to disagree with you guys, clearly we aren't shopping at the same stores! If he wanted a garage queen or show winner in 3 months, I would agree, but he wants a solid driver and can take a little time, find good used parts here and on eBay, it can be done.

Example: I picked up a set of "new" Bilsteins, front and rear, on the board for $150. What does "new" mean? 500 miles on them, they were brand new when I opened the box with 3 grease fingerprints. There is tons of that stuff like this on the board.

Assuming he can weld and isn't in a hurry, this can be a good driver for $15K.

[SandyI]

Originally posted by Shaun 84 Targa
Assuming he can weld and isn't in a hurry, this can be a good driver for $15K.

So we can agree on something. If he can't weld, he'll never get that car close to a quality driving experience for that money.

Hopefully, BK911 will keep us updated on the restoration progress.
Good luck.