Liquid Petrolium Gas question...

[mingmong]

I was wondering if anyone out there knows anything about converting their 911 to run off LPG! Yeah I know this might sound a bit mad but apparently a fuel injected engine is pretty easy to convert to run off LPG (according to the garages that perform these duel fuel conversions...but I guess they would say that!) The only big problems are where to fit the tank and a slight loss of power. Just thinking about the planet..fewer emisions..petrol running out at some point...cheaper fuel bills etc.etc...Any thoughts? Cheers M

[Wil Ferch]

Sitting here in the States..and watching an episode of "Fifth Gear" ( British) indicates this is being done to a number of cars in England and gains a nice tax break too.

Why not interview one of the more intrepid and resourceful shops that do this somewhere in the UK ?

Wil

[svandamme]

Originally posted by Wil Ferch
Sitting here in the States..and watching an episode of "Fifth Gear" ( British) indicates this is being done to a number of cars in England and gains a nice tax break too.


Wil

i very much doubt that they would do that on a 911

for one thing , you need room for a tank
for another thing , you loose some performance

[Wil Ferch]

Stijn:
The episode made it very clear that properly engineered conversions were being done for all manner of cars..including Bimmers and Rollers.

Fuel "range" may be affected but overall performance may not be adversely affected to any noticable degree......

Wil

[svandamme]

did they show a 911 with LPG in that episode??


not saying that there isn't one somewhere in the world, but saying that it's not a common or practical thing to do with a 911...
and unless there was a 911 with LPG actually in the show, or if they actually referred to a specific example of a 911 with LPG... i still would very much doubt it

you do loose performance
you do add weight
where will you put the tank? in the boot?? on your back seat??

and you will be laughed at when you pump LPG with a 911
"look at the poser ,want's to drive a 911 but too cheap to pay the gasoline" > not kidding here, you get those comments when you see LPG on a sports car...


and in my opinion , it is a very sad thing to do to a 911, no matter how you look at it...

EDIT , Will , if you remember which episode that was, i'de like to see that 911 on LPG, i could download it from Bittorent

[old_skul]

Too cheap? The 911 is "everyman's" sports car, and regarded as a starting platform from which to modify and upgrade.

Although I can't find any information on the conversion, it's certainly possible given the ease with which other FI engines are converted. The only issue is cooling; I'm not sure the air-cooled nature of the 911 motor lends itself to LPG or not as I'm unsure of whether LPG burns hotter or cooler than regular gasoline.

[Wil Ferch]

This may be true, Stijn, but some people have more focused environmental concerns and can care less about being "laughed at".

Just a data point.....in the mid 80's , the USA cars were delivered with cats....no way to avoid that. In Europe, customers had the option to go cat-less ( slightly more HP, leaded fuel) ..OR...could opt for a cat version and gain a substantial tax break.

I would put this into the same general category. Correct....911 conversions were not discussed in the context of the television program, but it was a universally applied technology that did go into a number of "types" of cars, including high-end BMW's , Jags and such.

I'm sure there is a way to fit a proper fuel tank once the original tank is gone....

The economic differences were (apparently) substantial in the UK ( mingmong? true?)...so your feelings are understandable if the same situation is not in your country.

Wil

[svandamme]

none of the LPG conversions i've seen actually do away with the original fuel system , they just add the tank and the stuff it needs on top of the car...

that's why you need a bigger car to do it...

the general idea for LPG conversions in belgium is cost saving on fuels, maybe somebody in the UK and the rest of europe can(probably) confirm , but as far as i can see, cost saving would be the same reason there..

there's other things to consider, many underground car parks won't let you park there with LPG, risk of explosion ( disputable but still )


i'm not denying that it's possible, hell , you can run a 911 engine on anything combustable, as long as it doesn't eat away metal ,gaskets , seals or lubrication... and as long as you can find a way to feed it to your engine... so if you gonna do the big conversion for enviromental reasons... , then why not go for a really clean fuel... like hydrogen ?

the cooling thing raised by old skull is probably valid , i think it runs a little hotter, usually not a problem for water pumpers, but i could imagine on a 911 that it's not good


i still stick to my feeling , that LPG on a 911 is a perfectly good way to ruin a perfectly good , fun car.

as for getting a tax break for buying a car with a cat... dunno wich country that would have been , but again , i don't think that lasted long > tax breaks in europe ? on cars? on 911's?? yeah right , tax man don't like 911's

[Wil Ferch]

Lack of Hydrogen fuel delivery and storage "infrastructure" is killing this ( otherwise good) concept today..... LPG does not suffer this in Europe.

I would think the original tax break for the Euro cat equipped cars was at least in Germany, or for some other large-market Euro country. Why would Porsche go to the trouble to offer this model option otherwise ???

Wil

[svandamme]

probably for germany .. makes sense
but to give you an idea ...

if you do an LPG conversion on your car , you need to register with the tax office, and you actually have to pay extra road tax for an LPG equipped car ..
it's like that in Belgium and in Holland as well , don't know bout UK and others

doesn't make sense, but that's europe for you