Cayenne Ad very funny!

[Quicksilver]

The Cayenne is an exceptional example of what we call an "SUV". The handling is amazing. The acceleration is astounding. On a very short Auto-X course I was able to come within 1.5 seconds of my Carrera, which was on A032Rs. Amazing. BUT...

The Cayenne isn’t the problem. The problem goes by the name "SUV". What is the point? An SUV is a design solution for a problem that doesn’t exist. A supposed reason for an SUV is to go bouncing off through the boonies. I bet no one here has seen anyone take their personal luxury SUV off into the brush, rocks and mud. If someone has any intention of seriously going off road then they get a Jeep, Bronco, Blazer, Range Rover, etc. and they will generally get a used one. So off hiway use isn’t the real reason, unless you are trying to convince someone you are outdoorsy.

Seeing as off road performance has been crossed off the list... If you really wanted it to perform then you must be talking about on-road performance. Hey, lets make it heavier and raise the center of gravity! Oops, well there goes the on-road performance.

The reason must be the ability to carry passengers. Hmmm. That could better be done with a station wagon or a minivan. You wouldn't be sloshed back and forth by the high seating position either. The station wagon and minivan would have a lower center of gravity and the station wagon would definitely weigh less which would make it a better form factor to design performance into..

Safety is a good reason... except increased chance of roll over and the example of a Volvo wagon kind of stomps that into the ground.

Another reason someone chooses a vehicle is fuel economy! Oh yeah, we’re talking about "SUV"s here.

The only reason that I can see that is left is "Cool". "Cool" is a term that describes trying to impress other members of the herd. It comprises self-image and popularity. Well you’ve got me there. Even though only one in a thousand people has a non "Cool" related reason for having an SUV for some reason they have become very very cool.

The part about this that makes me want to get an Uzi is every idiot in a polished up SUV will come to a complete halt to go over a speed bump in a parking lot. AAARRRGggghhhh....


Wayne
(Ok, I held out on a good reason. The high seating position lets you look down on the blonde in the car next to you when you are stuck in traffic!)

[adscab]

What's your reason for having a 911?

Let's see, on road performance? No because you can get waxed by a $30K American sedan or a couple of $30K Japanese sedans or ??? Gas mileage? No because you can get the same Japanese sedan that will wax your car, can also get 30 mpg's. Carry 4 people? No, same Japanese sedan, 4 people, no problem. Safety? No. Off road? No.

Therefore, it must be the "cool" factor. "Cool" is a term that describes trying to impress other members of the herd. It comprises self-image and popularity. Well you’ve got me there. Even though only one in a thousand people has a non "Cool" related reason for having a 911 for some reason they have become very very cool.

(Ok, I held out on a good reason. The low seating position will have blondes looking down at you while they are next to you when you are stuck in traffic!)

Seriously, I have an SUV, a Cayenne S. It gives me the utility and power I need when I head to the mountains. It will be a tremendous vehicle this weekend as I anticipate a couple of feet of snow in Mammoth. Try that in a station wagon, or al 911. It is also one of the smoothest and most comfortable vehicles I have ever owned. It is also very quiet. In many ways, it is just a big sedan. I also have a 911 with a couple of blow dryers.

Think what you want. I chose my vehicles for me, not for what you or that blonde thinks.

[geof33]

My only beef (wife's too) is the Cayenne need a bit more cargo space in the back. We seriously considered trading in out Toyota 4 runner for one, but the available space is less in the C... Personally, I'd own one in a heart beat. The TT is on Bad Motor Scooter... FAR cry from the VW version...

[jmshepard]

I am surprised that nobody on this thread has addressed the true cost Porsche assumed in the bringing this SUV to the marketplace. Discussion about company profitability and vehicle capabilities are well and good. However, the fact that Porsche withdrew from top line racing to cover development costs of the truck is what irks me about the Cayenne. Every Cayenne SUV I see on the road reminds me of this. The car company that I watched compete for the podium every year is now living off its' reputation with no apparent desire to return to a factory racing effort.

[jluetjen]

[Wil Ferch]

And....it turns out that the "reason given" ( developing and bringing the SUV to market).....was the BIG LIE told to us by Porsche over the last 8 years.....

I hate being lied-to... and being made a sucker for... believing this in the first place. How many times have we heard this lie at every end-of-year pronouncement by Porsche with the teaser "Wait till next year"......or "not until we're done with the SUV"?

Well....next year ( at least) is NOW........

The SUV......you're DONE......................

JMshepard and quicksilver echo my feelings most closely as I watch my favorite sports car company changing drastically right before my eyes.....the goodness of the Cayenne vehicle notwithstanding.

Wil

[Quicksilver]

Originally posted by adscab
What's your reason for having a 911?

Let's see, on road performance? No because you can get waxed by a $30K American sedan or a couple of $30K Japanese sedans or ??? Gas mileage? No because you can get the same Japanese sedan that will wax your car, can also get 30 mpg's. Carry 4 people? No, same Japanese sedan, 4 people, no problem. Safety? No. Off road? No.

...BZZZzzzt,No,thankyouforplaying.
You can get waxed in a straight line but I got bored with straight line performance 2 weeks after owning my first car. This car talks to me in the corners in greater and finer detail then anything I have seen with a license plate. If I make a mistake in a corner this car will slap me up side the head and keep me honest. It will not tolerate mistakes.
Safety? The 911 is a very safe car. Yeah it doesn't have the safety of a Volvo wagon but it has a wonderful crush structure and a very strong roof. (The wife uses the Volvo wagon)
I tend to drive things as hard as they will go and this is the only vehicle I can imagine that will let me run it to its limits contantly and only ask that I add gas, oil, brake pads, and rotors. Oh, and it isn't losing value as it sits there.

Therefore, it must be the "cool" factor. "Cool" is a term that describes trying to impress other members of the herd. It comprises self-image and popularity. Well you’ve got me there. Even though only one in a thousand people has a non "Cool" related reason for having a 911 for some reason they have become very very cool.

I agree that 90%+ of the people who have 911s get them for this exact reason. Most of them will never get anywhere near using the braking and cornering of this car and most of the 911s driving around Socal are status symbols with a seat. (How about a requirement of beating a certain autox time before being allowed to buy a 911?!)

I have found it useful to use "the cool" when doing things like test driving new cars. If I show up in the beater pickup they aren't as likely to just throw me the keys.
I really don't understand why the average person thinks it is "cool" though. They aren't going to use anything that it offers.

(Ok, I held out on a good reason. The low seating position will have blondes looking down at you while they are next to you when you are stuck in traffic!)

Ha! I wish this one worked but I'm afraid that the 911 didn't change meeting woman except two little details. I had a woman become MUCH friendlier after seeing the car. "That is a very nice car. What do you do for a living?" (Ahhhhh, run away...) The other detail is the ability to sit in the passenger seat and be comfortable while I am wringing the car out. (No screaming allowed!)
Found one so that is handled.

Seriously, I have an SUV, a Cayenne S. It gives me the utility and power I need when I head to the mountains. It will be a tremendous vehicle this weekend as I anticipate a couple of feet of snow in Mammoth. Try that in a station wagon, or a 911. It is also one of the smoothest and most comfortable vehicles I have ever owned. It is also very quiet. In many ways, it is just a big sedan. I also have a 911 with a couple of blow dryers.

Think what you want. I chose my vehicles for me, not for what you or that blonde thinks.

Not sure what "utility" is but I never found a need for extra power when I'm in the mountains unless I'm playing canyon racer. Extra power is a negative on snow.
Somewhere I have a great picture of me 'plowing' 18" of snow with my lowered 72 Vega. The snow is blowing over the hood and the wipers are going. It's pretty funny. Narrow tires are the key.
The Cayenne would be good on snow IF it had narrower tires. (For that matter my 911 would be good on snow if it had narrower tires!) The PSM will greatly increase the traction. The only bad thing is 4 wheel drive doesn't really improve handling in snow. It lets you accelerate in marginal traction but it also lets you slip all 4 wheels at other times. Most people would be much better off if you simply taught them driving techniques.

The ski rack is on the 911. (Thank you Mark Wilson! Sorry Nostatic, I got there first!) Need to go spin donuts at Mammoth. Slideways, WEEEeeeee!!

Wayne

[911teo]

In principle I am against SUV. As Quicksilver points out they are quite useless...

But the point is that there are more SUVs on the road than anything else..
So yes from a theoretical safety stand point a wagon is better, but would you have your kids sit in the 3rd row of an E-class wagon with the possibility of a H2 (or Sub or Sequoia or whathever u like) hitting you from behind?
And let's look at the minivans... Have you driven an Odissey (Caravan or name any other MPVs)? Trust me the Cayenne is dynamically way better than those. Imagine trying to avoid an obstacle on the highway doing 80 mph with an MPV and with a Cayenne.... (by obstacle I mean anything from a blown tire to a car accident to a dog etc).

So yes... SUVs suck, but the Cayenne is a better compromise than most other vehicles out there.

Maybe we need a Porsche wagon... (flame me now pls!!!!! a P wagon?!?).

[Willem Fick]

The Cayenne is a case of horses for courses - you'll always have those who like it, and those who don't.

Fact is, it's probably here to stay, no matter how often its purpose, aestethics or whatever is discussed on this board, so we had better get used to it. What I think we need to do, is give lots of credit to Porsche for being able to take the bland concept of an SUV, turn it into a very sporty package by comparison to what BMW and Mercedes are offering, and sell more than we ever could have imagined.

Besides; Who knows, in time it might actually become a classic of sorts as has the IMHO ever so ugly 928, that is today still regarded as one of the ultimate GT cars...

Lets face it, as many people objected to the "water cars" when the first water cooled 911s appeared, but now that the whoo-ha has died down, many of these initial sceptics have come to agree that these aren't really bad cars, even though you still come across people who wouldn't have one even if they could.

Now:

I personally wouldn't go out and buy a Cayenne, cause I don't have a need for an SUV, and couldn't afford it if I tried. If however someone was to force me to drive around in one of those 700-odd Hp Gemballa ones, I guess I could come to kinda like it!

Willem Fick

[geof33]

I find it interesting that when the topic of the Cayenne comes up the issue of "factory" racing comes into play... Are we forgetting the GT2's and 3's??? Not factory, but factory set...

The reality of Porsche not being in the factory game... is the FIA mostly. Porsche pulled out ofter the homologation rules made doing a "road car" race car impracticle. This has been weel documented over the years.

The reality, like it or not, is the new product line of Porsche benefits us all, by keeping Porsche the ONLY privately owned sports car company... Keeps US in parts etc... It's cool to know that these things will be available for a long time...

[Willem Fick]

Quick thought - didn't a Cayenne lap "the ring" faster than an M3 recently? I seem to recall reading this somewhere. If so, I guess a lot can be said for the overall package!

Still not buying one, but just wondering!

[911teo]

Geof

I agree with everything you said apart from the Porsche being independent is an advantage fo us...

I actually think the opposite. Look at Fiat/Ferrari, VW/Lambo etc...
Yes profitability is important for everybody... but the financial strenght of a parent company would be important for developing new products without the cash constraint.

[Quicksilver]

Maybe the concept is unclear.
Saw this on the 405 this morning and it should clear it up.


I think this guy is pretty clear on what an SUV should be used for in Socal. Bouncing over sand, sage brush and chipmonks!

Wayne
(flameon!)

[Overpaid Slacker]

Hell, I'd buy a Cayenne if I needed a vehicle with its abilities; I'd buy it before I bought any of the other SUV's out there.

I agree with Quiksilver's points (especially about the Blondes...) but there is another reason I'd buy an SUV -- I'm 6'5" and 250#; it's a lot easier/more comfortable for me to get into a larger vehicle (as a rule) than a smaller, lower-to-the-ground car. Having said that, for some reason a number of vehicles calling themselves SUVs do not have nearly enough room up front, especially Jeeps.

Would you rather have "Trail Rated" or "Nurburgring Rated" for your SUV, given what 99% of the use is going to be?

On the OT board there was a discussion about the new Toyota FJ (or something) and a Pelican made a point before I could -- namely, that there will be no mass-market purpose-built true off-road vehicles any longer. If someone is in the market for such a thing, they're not going to go plunk at least $35K down on a new toy; they'll buy an older Jeep/LR/Toyo and build it up to what they want for less than $10K.

I'm waiting to take the 930 against a Turbo Cayenne... That'll be fun.

JP

[Texas Turbo]

Originally posted by cegerer
That spoof ad has been posted a dozen times over the past year. And the only thing funny about it is the Cayenne TT would, without breaking a sweat, wax nearly any car I see listed in the replies to this thread .....

Not here, there are a couple here in Austin that I've had the pleasure of running with... Cayenne TT is wicked fast for sure, but a modded 930 does just fine, thank you. But one thing I learned early in life, there will ALWAYS be someone faster. In fact, where I live there are PLENTY of faster cars, and maybe even a modded CTT or other SUV! Besides street racing is dumb and that is what Track Days are for. BUT, it is amazing to see such a big vehicle scoot like that!

My view is the same as many on this thread. I am a "horses for courses" kind of guy myself. I made a great buy on a used Range Rover for running around ranches here in Texas and the quarterly trips to Colorado for some fresh mountain air. I have no problem taking the RR off road, and it goes WAY FARTHER than any Cayanne I have seen, but then I have mine set up expedition style for that very purpose.

On the other hand, the 930 is built to suit my track day and sports car needs, raw and exhilerating. I guess you could say that I like things purpose built and the RR and 930 is a great combo for me.

I could see picking up a Cayenne for a daily driver in a couple of years because, as someone said above, it makes a great sedan. However, I bet I'll end up with a 3.6L Boxster conversion first and leave the off road, people hauling, and SUV duties to the Rangie.

No offense intended to those with the Pepper Wagon, on some levels I am quite jealous as I am sure they are much better around town than my Rover which basically drives like the pig of a truck that it is.

TT

[Wavey]

Originally posted by adscab
What's your reason for having a 911?

I bought mine to compensate for my exceptionaly small penis.

[Todd Simpson]

Well, I hate all SUV's with a passion, Cayenne included.

I appreciate the family safety angle, but at the same time I don't want to compete in the "SUV arms race" whereby I now have to drive a 2-3 ton sloppy machine just because everyone else is.

I'm also insulted by the front bumpers on these things, some with brush guards that are so unfriendly to the outside world. In a minor T-bone that bumper is right about the height of my head in a normal car. Driving some of these things is like walking down the street swinging a baseball bat, no regard to the world around you.

Throw in the propensity to roll over and the laughingly small back seats and I'll take a car or wagon any day.

OK, rant off. I told you I hated them, right?

[adscab]

This has got to be one of the "nicest" spirited discussions in a long time! The Cayenne isn't for everyone, neither is a 911. As said by someone earlier, the Cayenne R&D was not the demise of Porsche involvement in racing.

[tc-sacto]

Well, I for one love my SUV.(not a pepper). I can through my kayak/Mountian bike on top without worring about damaging an expensive porsche. Drive off road to the river/lake with no issues about puncturing a low profile tire. I can thrash through 3 feet of snow with no worries (try doing that with a cayane that has low profile tires! I see them slip and slide all the time up in Tahoe.). I mean really, If porsche acutually made an SUV instead of a tall sports car I might have considered buying one, but the pepper is a poser as far as SUV's go. Not to metion how much better my diesel is at pulling the race car trailer.

Makes me laugh when I see all those SUV's with hooptie rims and tires. I mean whats the point. Get a sedan if you want low profile tires. They are useless off road or in snow!

I love my porsche sports cars, but think the pepper, as good as it is on the road is just a glamor ride. No real capabilities for the design of an SUV. I would rather have seen porsche build an M3 competitor than a useless SUV. That, I would buy.

[adscab]

So do you routinely carry 7 passengers in you Sequoia or Suburban? Do you also enjoy getting 10 mpg's? Being in Sacramento, I bet you utilize your "offroad" capabilities 100% of the time. Now who is a poser?

At least I realize my car is going to get used 90% of the time on road and maybe 10% offroad (snow). So for me it is convenience without having to worry about chains on a sedan. I also have snow wheels and tires as well as street wheels and tires. Seems to make sense as I have a set of street wheels and tires as well as track wheels and tires for the 911.