Excellence early car values

mikes72t · 03-07-2005, 03:32 PM

So I got my Excellence tonight and it is the early 911 value issue.

My God, Are those prices accurate, my 72 T jumped $3000 this year? Are things really going up that fast for the early cars?

Thanks

Mike

LeeH · 03-07-2005, 05:06 PM

I e-mailed Bruce Anderson a question right after I bought my car... he asked for a market report on the purchase. He said that there had been a big increase in early car values.

So... is there a reader's sales report on a '72T in this issue? Is my car famous?

cegerer · cegerer's Garage

Not sure if it's an increase or Excellence simply catching up with where early car prices have been for the past 3-4 years ....

Lukesportsman · 03-07-2005, 06:07 PM

Appearance, Legislature, Coolness, BB2, RS$$, affordable, lightweight, 3.6 swapability, Cd, no rubber blocks, 17"Fuchs......Rust is Cool

Glad I have mine!

mikes72t · 03-08-2005, 02:52 AM

I haven't read through the reader sales reports, I will today and let you tonight. The E's and S's also went way up, but since I have a T, that is what I focused on, seems to be pretty consistent $ wise.

Just skimming the read sales reports I didn't see any early cars.

I will check more carefully today.

Mike

Willem Fick · 03-08-2005, 04:00 AM

Mike,

$3000US is still a huge bargain, at least in these parts (South Africa)!

I paid the equivalent of $17000US for my 1970T, and still got it at half price, given that they often sell for the equivalent of around $30000US. An unmolested '72T will set you back closer to $35000US, and an RS replica closer to $60000.

Over here old p-cars are regarded as being so collectable that its quite easy to get bank finance on even the worst of them!

Before you get any money making ideas though - same as the Brits, we drive on the left, and the importation of left-hand drive vehicles is illegal...

Cheers!

Willem Fick

mwbaum · mwbaum's Garage

356 values are skyrocketing.....makes sense the early 911s are following suit.

Plavan · Plavan's Garage

Like many have said many times before, take Bruce Anderson's "pure speculation" and unethical "Market Reports" with a grain of salt. My 1995 993 I bought in 1998 in which I sent a buyers report to Bruce with my rare options, super low mileage, and price showed up 2 YEARS later in Excellence exactly word for word. Kinda defeats the purpose of current "Market Reports" doesn't it???
He should just stick with motors.
If you want real Porsche market prices stick with PML (Porsche Market letter). PML is real world pricing...Not a crap shoot.
No affiliation.

pwd72s · 03-08-2005, 09:42 AM

I haven't seen my copy of the magazine yet, but I suspect some of it may be that Sweet Old Bruce is desperately trying to catch up with reality...

ubiquity0 · 03-08-2005, 09:55 AM

So now you can get an excellent 2.4S for $15,000 instead of $12,000??

Deschodt · 10:13 AM

Having looked at 356s for friends and early 911s for myself lately, I can confirm the prices are going thru the roof since about last year. Less and less "Deals" out there. I am glad I secured one of each before this happened..

It's practically impossible to find a decent 356 coupe <18K now, and I mean decent, not a bondo bucket, or a cabriolet <45K...

911 wise, I thought I got lucky when I got a 73.5 for $11500, but then it just cost me $6000 in repairs, so.... no free lunches !

pwd72s · 03-08-2005, 10:16 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by ubiquity0
So now you can get an excellent 2.4S for $15,000 instead of $12,000??

Laughing my rear off....yup, that's about it...

randywebb · 03-08-2005, 10:27 AM

There is bound to be selection bias in these reports - if a buyer gets a good deal he is motivated to send in the info, but not if he paid a high price. I doubt too many sellers bother to send in their info at all (tho I did).

IMO, he should provide some statistical info. on what he is seeing.

But there is nothing _unethical_ in BA's market letter, and it is wrong of you to attack him that way.

epbrown · 03-08-2005, 12:22 PM

Will Fick has it right - the weak dollar has the US being cherry-picked for early cars. Rarely do you see a decent longhood on eBay that doesn't have a question about international shipping at the bottom.

LeeH · 03-08-2005, 12:35 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by randywebb
...if a buyer gets a good deal he is motivated to send in the info, but not if he paid a high price.

When BA asked me to send in the market report on my car I hesitated BECAUSE I felt I got a good deal and didn't think it was a fair representation of the market. He assured me that the good deals don't lower the overall value for a particular car. Bruce said he would specifically state that I paid under market for my car.

Deschodt · 03-08-2005, 12:52 PM

RE: the US being cherry picked... I don't think that is THE cause. It helps a bit to explain Europeans buying at what we consider high prices, but this happens everytime one currency is undervalued. In the 80s the cars were leaving Europe towards the US, now they're going back, in the next decade I betcha it'll reverse itself again, and again...

I don't know that this alone contributes to the price hike... The trend started last year in my opinion, before the dollar tanked. I think it's also a result of "rolling" trends and speeding laws.

Rolling trends? You know the theory that people buy cars they could not afford when young? Well, looks to me like the early 70s cars (presumably lusted after by 1950s and 60s people who would now be 45/60 year old and have disposable income and no more kids to pay for) are now "it". Look at the american iron at Barrett JAckson too ? unreal numbers for cars which do not corner...

Also I think speed restrictions in Europe and to a certain degree in the US have made people turn back towards cars which are FUN at legal speeds. Modern cars are too good for their own sake, they shelter you from any required driving skills. A 356 or early 911 is fun at 60 Mph, hell, it's fun at 20 !!! A 997 is kinda boring at legal speeds and gets fun at twice the limit ;-)

Last but not least, in my case, BMW's I-drive, Audi's Command and all those computer operated cars electronic BS irritates me. I had to take a 2 hours roundtrip to get the dealer to reset my Mini Cooper's airbag light after I swapped seats in the car... On the other hand, yesterday I fixed the loss of my first 2 forward gears on my 356A with a 14mm wrench, 2 minutes of observation of the linkage and minimal swearing. Also fixed my oil temp sender on my 911T with a wiring diagram and a $15 part. Any more modern than this, I have to call the dealer and book an appointment.. Pah !!

sixbanger · 03-08-2005, 01:22 PM

I'm getting rich just looking at them.

Plavan · Plavan's Garage

Quote:

Originally posted by randywebb

But there is nothing _unethical_ in BA's market letter, and it is wrong of you to attack him that way. [/B]

Unethical- adj 1: not conforming to approved standards of social or professional behavior; "unethical business practices" [ant: ethical] 2: not adhering to ethical or moral principles; "base and unpatriotic motives"; "a base, degrading way of life"; "cheating is dishonorable"; "they considered colonialism immoral"; "unethical practices in handling public funds"

I think that sums it up. So your saying what I paid for my 993 in 1998 should be the same for the year 2000? So it's OK to deceive readers of a national magazine and lie about what is really going on in the Porsche market (Tell that to Dan Rather)??? He is in a way messing with "OUR" money, buying or selling... It's as simple as that. The BA market reports are complete BS. No integrity/confidence.

-off soapbox

LeeH · 03-08-2005, 02:07 PM

Here's where some of the early 911s are going:
http://m-house.m78.com/
This is the same guy who's buying early hood crests at a premium on Ebay.

GIBSON · GIBSON's Garage

Deshodt makes a good point. My 73 911 is fun at much lower speeds than my 993. I drove it yesterday for the first time in a while and had a great time. On paper, it no longer looks like much of a performance car when compared to some of the new stuff out there. Behind the wheel, it's a total blast. I never get tired of driving that car. Lots of noise, plenty of feedback, a twitchy back end, shifting frequently, that's what driving is all about to me. Looks like I'm not the only one.