buy 1977 911?

[jakemu24]

Hi, I have an 85' 944 and am thinking of buying a 911. here is a link to the car:

http://www.autabuy.com/Vehicles/Details.cfm?VID=29860

I know nothing about these cars. What should I look for when test driving it and where can I find very detailed info on this car? Any help or thoughts on this car would be appreciated. I can probobly buy this car for 8-9K and it has 107k miles.

Thanks

Jake

[SLO-BOB]

You're not the only one who knows nothing about these cars. Neither does the seller. V6? Targa? Power steering? They're full of crap. That car looks very messed with but can't tell for sure. Why is the back end so high? Looks like it's w/o a motor.

Edit-Ok. I see the price now. That is low, but if the car is a nightmare, not low enough. The interior looks weird and the wheel, seats, wheels, are not original. Still get a PPI. If it checks out, that's a decent price.

[anthony]

Originally posted by jakemu24

I know nothing about these cars.

Start educating yourself. Don't buy the first car you look at and have any car you are seriously considering checked out by a qualified Porsche mechanic.

The '77 is known as a mid-year 911. Every 911 has it's faults but the mid year had magnesium 2.7L cases and reactor mainfolds. Porsche later changed to aluminum cases because those magnesium cases had a tendency to pull head studs out of the case. The was magnified by the later 2.7 cars witht he reactor manifolds. Now, if this car has already had an upper end with the head studs deal with and back dated heat exchangers, it could be a nice car to have.

If you step up one year to an SC for example you get a generally bullit-proof aluminum cased 3.0L engine, more horsepower, broader torque curve, fender flares for wider wheels, most likely 16" Fuchs, etc.


Here's a site that runs through all the model years with nice descriptions:

http://www.idee.demon.nl/inh-story.htm

[Bobboloo]

This car looks a bit scary. It would be money well spent hiring a reputable Porsche specialist to examine the car before putting down any money on the car.

The car looks like it's worth $4500 to $7500 tops judging from the pictures.

[SLO-BOB]

Read these threads on 77s. LOts of great ifo in there from people that actually have the cars. Don't believe all the hokum you'll hear from non-mid year owners about the "perils" of mid-years. The bad usually has been resolved by this time because the necessary updates have been performed. The mid-years can be an ideal first 911. Not sure about the red one though.

PS-The SCs are certainly not w/o flaw. My 77 S is in the shop way less than my buddies 81 SC. INstead of pulling head studs they break off in the case. They have more HP, but weigh more. Carreras are more $$ and a different driving experience.

My advice-drive them all, buy what you like best for the money, and get a ppi. They're all great cars.

Feel the mid-year love!

Do you feel it?!?!

An actual mid-year website!!

[86 911]

Check out these links that include the mid year 911:
http://www.idee.demon.nl/
http://www.sikhworld.co.uk/Porsche%20911/Porsche911page7.html
http://www.pelicanparts.com/911/technical_specs/911_guthrie_faq.htm#Q0

If it were me, I would run away from the car that is listed. The seller does not know what he is talking about. The rear end height looks way too high, and the car looks to have been messed with in general.

Hope this helps.

[Dan in Pasadena]

Jake,
For what it is worth, I just - less than a month ago - sold my PERFECT '87 944 and bought a '76 911S. Paid $8500 which included over $3000 ofrecent engine work AND a paint job that it was(is) already in the shop for. I had shopped for a long time. I was told all the horror stories about mid year (74-77) 911's too. They CAN BE a bargain, but you've got to understand what you are dealing with.This car doesn't appear to be it. RUN from a seller that doesn't know his own car - period.

As has been said, the thermal reactors (certain of those 4 years and sometimes only in CA), the copper valve guides, 5 blade fan and the stud pulling were the issues. But these are 30+/- year old cars, most of these issues have likely been dealt with. Make CERTAIN you know (receipts) or make a deal which includes them as a consideration, if you don't?= lots of $$. Get a PrePurchase Inspection no mattter which 911 you buy, bar none. Find a GOOD Porsche shop locally - do that FIRST.

You'll LOVE the 911 experience but only if you do it right. If you ain't up to it, stay with the 944. Excellent cars if properly maintained,they're just not a 911. One last thing, a mid year is ten years older than your 944 - a rear drive car of a completely different era, don't expect it to be your 944 - it ain't. It's not the 911's fault if your expectations were unrealistic. They are an icon for real reasons.

[SLO-BOB]

True enough in many cases, like this one maybe, but doing your homework can yield you a nice mid-year.

[Dan in Pasadena]

Brian, I think those of us with the mid year cars understand that there really is some truth to the idea that the mid year cars bear some extra scrutiny, but I differ sharply with the idea that a newbie should just be warned off them in total. That's tantamount to people that say, "Oh Porsches? My friend had one once and it just cost her a fortune, I'd never have one". Why not just avoid Porsches completely if the concern is that they are expensive to maintain? They ARE expensive cars, always were. They were NEVER intended to be "everybody" cars.

As you note, ANY old car has issues. SC's have Dilavar studs that are prone to breakage due to corrosion. If you wanted to buy an SC, that's one of the things I'd tell you about.

But it really IS true that if the thermal reactors have been dumped and the fan swapped back to the 11 blade, the car may be just fine. The early cars that are all the rage and commanding outrageous prices right now have?....Magnesium cases. It ain't the case material per se that is the problem, it is the friggin HEAT from the Thermal Reactors and 5 blade fan. How many 25-30 year old cars haven't had a valve job? Not many,& if done by a half way reputable Porsche shop with ANY desire to make some money, they advised the valve guides had to be done.

Bottomline to me is that THIS car he posted appears to be a shaky bet, but don't warn him off 74-77's as a group, you're doing him a disservice. Just my $.02

[H20911]

I don't think that you would want this car. The rear is too high (it must be fast) and that alone would raise flags for me. the rest is just only 5-7K car.
It looks like an old DP tail on a none flared car.
The BBS wheels scream welcome to the Eighties "cue Duran Duran's PLease Please tell me now." "not that there is anything wrong with that" just dated...... not classic Fuchs.

You might want to pic up a copy of "The Porsche 911 Buyers guide" by Leffingwell and the "Porsche 911 Red Book" by Paternie. both very good.

[ejames19]

I have to agree with all the above. I have waited for a 911 for, well all my life, I finally purchased early last spring at the ripe age of 31. I read everything and anything I could get my hands on that dealt with the best years, best body, engine, costs and what to look for when purchasing. I searched out and saw 12 cars in 10 months, patience! Finally found exactly what I was looking for and not a bad deal. The reading over the time I'll tell you (a long with finding Pelican half way through this) is worth it, honestly I knew exactly what to be looking for from the late sixties up to mid eighties when looking at a 911. Study. It will pay off large and you will be very pleased with the knowledge and your purchase. Everything here at your finger tips.

[jakemu24]

The person who listed the car is a friend of the owner so he made a few mistakes on the description. I'm waiting to see all the maitenance records still. So besides that, how reliable are these cars? Are they hard to work on? Plus the gear shifter felt real vague, is that normal?

[SLO-BOB]

shifting is another sore point for 911s. To say the 915 gearbox takes getting used to is being kind. Don't compare it's shifting to your 944. Like Dan said-Don't compare anything on a 911 to your 944.

[anthony]

I'm new the 911 but have had two 914s and wrenched on BMWs and I find working on the 911 fairly easy. It's great that you can search here first before you tackle something and then see all the problems people have encountered.

Reliability: a well maintained car will probably be very reliable. My SC has been rock solid so far. That red car though looks to be anything but well maintained. Straightening out the suspension and ride height could cost you a couple grand at a shop unless you can do it all yourself.

[gatotom]

all I can say by looking at the ad for the 77 is that is sure ain't stock. For 12 -15K you could do alot better than that.

Be patient, the one with your name on it will appear.

IMHO, a p-car can't be had for less than 20K that doesn't need massive work to it. Remember these cars are driven hard, yes, they can take it but there are too many short term owners out there that don't have a clue how to care for them, that's why they get rid of them.

[NY65912]

Run Forest! What's up with the air shock look in the rear?

You can do MUCH better for that kind of money........as was said in previous posts.

Good Luck