3-point seatbelt in rear of a '77?

dpriebe · 02-15-2005, 07:00 PM

I'm trying to find out if anyone has installed a 3-point seatbelt in the back of a '77 911. My eldest daughter in now big enough to be using the car's seatbelts in her car seat instead of the supplied harness. I've done a search, and I'm reading conflicting information regarding whether or not there is already reinforced material in the rear deck lid, in the mounting place that the later cars used. So if you have a '77 or earlier car and have done this, please let me know. I realize that I can also add this reinforcing material myself, I'm just trying to prep for this.
Thanks,

qcwang · 02-15-2005, 07:48 PM

I am in the same situation. Hope this thread helps. My guess this applies to your model too. Let me know if you find any new info.

Rear three point seatbelt retro fit possible in 78-83 SC?

dpriebe · 02-15-2005, 08:01 PM

Yes, I saw that thread. I was just trying to get so confirmation before tearing apart the back seat.

qcwang · 02-15-2005, 09:28 PM

In my search I found that only the 84's and after had the reinforcements and the attachment point for the shoulder portion of the seatbelt. I think some drilling and welding are needed? I am not sure. I would like to do this also as I would love to take my two daughters with me to the monthly PCA Breakfast club.

Please keep me updated on your project. I am very interested in your progress.

osidak · 02-16-2005, 04:59 AM

My little guy is still in a car seat but will need this info some day so please keep me informed

911nut · 911nut's Garage

Look here: www.peparts.com

These guys make a 3 point harness for our older cars.

qcwang · 02-16-2005, 10:05 AM

Dave and Dr. Osidak,

If no one has done this recently, we may need to be the guinea pigs (or the cutting edge pioneers :-) ).

Over the next few weeks when I get the chance, I'll try to look at the rear deck and see what needs modifying.
Keep me updated on your research!!

osidak · 02-16-2005, 11:28 AM

I emailed the company listed above asking for some type of install instructions for the kit they offer for my car.

From memory there is nothing apparent to mount the belt too. I current have luggage clips on my mine and I would hope they reinforced that area considering flying luggage would suck in an accident but I may try and tear it apart in the next few nights and take another look.

qcwang · 02-16-2005, 11:35 AM

I e-mailed the rep (Trampas) at PE Parts to ask if he has any step by step instructions he could provide us. He did send pics to me before that I put in the previous thread. I'll let you know his response.

Also Dave,
For my learning, if your '77 911 does not have reinforcements, what materials were you going to add and how? TIA :-)

Edit: Dr. Osidak beat me to it!! Let us know their response.

DByers · 02-16-2005, 11:47 AM

I installed the PEP ones in my 71 2 years ago. Limited use for my two kids. Now I have taken them out since our third arrived. It is now just a 2 seater. I have the belts and hardware for those who may be interested in a used set. My kids were back there on occasion for PCA activities or summer drives with the whole family.
Click on my link below to a picture of them in the back.

qcwang · 11:53 AM

Yes I would be interested Dan.

Edit: Whoops I forgot to write, I sent a PM to you.

osidak · 02-17-2005, 08:39 AM

Ok this is what I got from them

Quote:

CAUTION: IT IS YOUR RESPONSIBILITY TO MAKE SURE THAT ALL EXISTING OR PROPOSED SEAT BELT ANCHOR POINTS IN YOUR CAR ARE STRUCTURALLY SOUND: NOT RUSTY. MAKE A CAREFUL EXAMINATION BEFORE PROCEEDING. PORSCHES RUST! PLEASE BE CAREFUL! THANK YOU.
__________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ _____________________

MODELS WITH FACTORY ANCHOR POINTS: 1967-ON
1) Remove existing seat belts if present. Note: if your car was not originally fitted with rear seat belts from the factory, it may have plastic fasteners inserted through the carpet into the threaded holes intended for seat belts. If your car does not have plastic fasteners, or has been re-carpeted, the holes are covered by the carpeting. The inboard holes can be located underneath the car, above the transmission (if no holes are observable underneath, your car does not have factory anchor points). To find the out board holes, poke through the carpet in the area opposite the holes located on the inboard with a sharp awl.
2) Create a 3/4 diameter hole in the carpet at the factory anchor point locations. Use an upholstery hole punch or Exacto knife. DO NOT try to drill through carpet.
3) Install seat belts using the hardware provided such that the push button on the buckle (female) and the plastic slide portion of the connector (male) are oriented AWAY from the intended passenger. NOTE: The lock washer provided is to be place BETWEEN THE SEAT BELT END FITTING AND CARPET. No washer is placed between the head of the bolt and belt end fitting. Discard the nut and large flat washer if provided.
4) Torque bolts to 45-50 ft-lbs.
5) Install black plastic bolt head covers provided.

MODELS WITHOUT FACTORY ANCHOR POINTS: PRE 1967
1) Raise car and place on jack stands.
2) Sit in the rear seat and choose the ideal locations for the lap belt anchor points. Ideally, the anchor point is located below and to the rear of the hip 3 to 5 inches.
3) Remove rear seat bottom cushions.
4) Using a center punch and mallet, mark the proposed bolt locations.
5) Before drilling any holes 1 keep A&B below in mind:
A) The exact location of the holes is a compromise between the ideal locations determined in step 2 above, and interference of the fasteners on the bottom side of the car:
-observe underneath the car where the impressions made in step 4 are located
-move the location of the bolt hole as needed to clear any obstructions
B) The head of the bolts are to be placed below the level of the seat cushion in order for the cushion to cover the heads of the bolts.
6) Drill a 7/16 inch diameter hole at each location determined above.
7) Install seat belts using the hardware provided such that the push button on the buckle and the plastic slide portion of the connector are oriented AWAY from the intended passenger.
8) Torque bolts to 45-50 ft-lbs.

SHOULDER ANCHOR&INERTIA REELS; ALL MODELS
The shoulder anchor or inertia reel is to be located on the rear "package tray", or upper firewall panel between the engine and passenger compartments. The exact location of the shoulder anchor point depends on the year and model, but should always be located as close to the "C-pillar" as possible. The hardware included in your kit should be all needed to accomplish the installation. The small flat washer is installed against the sheet metal on the inside, the large flat washer against the sheet metal in the engine compartment. The spacer, when supplied, is installed between the inertia reel and small washer. On late models, the reel fits underneath the upholstered panel (do not use aluminum spacer, and the exit hole for the belt has to be created and trimmed-off with the included trim pieces.
Choose a location such that:
A) There will be sufficient room for the large flat washer to lay flat.
B) The strap will be located in a comfortable location across the shoulder and chest
C) As far outward as possible; close as possible to the C-pillar

Here are the photos included. Looks pretty simple

qcwang · 02-17-2005, 10:30 AM

Thanks for posting response!!!

dpriebe · 07-06-2005, 10:35 AM

I finally got around to installing the PEP kit in my car last night. It's pretty straight forward, just as the above instructions describe. I did run into one problem, that being the actual drilling of the hole. Due to there not being much space from the window, its pretty hard to get a drill in there to make the hole. The end result looks fantastic, very professional and original looking.
As for how it works with a child seat, I did wind up leaving in the manual lap belts to hold down the seat. Now my oldest daughter can climb in and attach the 3 point belt by herself. My younger daughter is a bit jealous and can't wait until she gets her own new seat belt.
One other interesting note, was that on my '77 my speakers are below the package shelf cover. Apparently this is they way they are on later cars. PEP has two different kits, one where the reel sits on top of the shelf, the other underneath it. The above photos show it sitting on top of the shelf.