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There are several folks here who like the sunroof delete, cruise delete, and Euro power but we are the exception rather than the rule. The general buying public wants cruise and a sunroof and Oly, your competition is probably the general buying public unless someone else here wants to put up the money for the car.

Personally I like the idea of a euro car but it does not jump out at me as an outstanding example. As you have already gathered, it is priced as if it is an outstanding example. If I were to buy it, I'd immdiately need some 8" or 9" rear wheels ($1000), SSIs and one of Ben's mufflers (about $1500), a Momo Wheel ($300) and loose those cloth insert seats ($1000). Plus, those new Michelins don't look so new to me so I'd probably need new tires too ($600). So if I were to buy it, I'd have another $4200 in it in a hurry. But that is just my taste.

If you like the car, get a PPI done and start negotiating. I happen to agree with many others here that it is probably a $17K car and if a guy is asking $22.5 I'd be surprised if he'd come down that far.

Good Luck,

Don

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Old 10-07-2005, 07:35 AM
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Also remember that the euro carreras came stock with the 915 tranny cooler.

Again great track care candidate - but I'd say this should be a $15K car.
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Old 10-07-2005, 07:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by ChrisBennet
Just to be safe I looked at the on-line rule book:
(https://www.pca.org/racing/docs/pca_rules_2005.pdf)
'84-89 Carrera's run in "F"
'84-89 Euro Carrera's run in "E"
-Chris
Thanks Chris! It's good to know.
My '78 Euro SC would run in the same class with the US version (Class G). I assumed the Carreras were the same....
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Old 10-07-2005, 08:24 AM
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Eli K and rrpjr,

I was wrong, the Euro cars WERE lighter by 90 kg; I did not see the information in the Original Porsche 911 book the first time. This is what it says:

1984 Row 1160 kg
1984 US 1250 kg

I'll bet the difference was for normal options that where standard on the US but not on the Euro like: a/c, sunroof, and power windows. I'd be surprised if the suspensions were different, other than the ride height, but maybe I'm wrong.

The door beams required for the US cars probably where pretty hefty.
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Last edited by oly; 10-07-2005 at 05:58 PM..
Old 10-07-2005, 05:50 PM
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The negotiating owner (there are multiple owners) said that he turned down an offer for $20k about a week ago.
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Old 10-07-2005, 05:54 PM
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If this car was mint/cherry/perfect with 35,000 miles and ready for top level full concours, was in exceptional mechanical condition, had full records from day 1, verified original paint, was completely original with no major irreversible mods and had zero flaws other than some normal wear, then $22,500 might be realistic.

It looks like a decent example overall, but this car is dirty in places, needs tires and could need a clutch soon. It's not the lightest car you can buy due to the A/C. That would have to go for a gain of ~40 to 60 lbs. This would all be non issue stuff if the price was $17k. But the price is $22.5k. Big difference. At that price, the car has to be perfect and could not be nit picked much.

I can't see this car breaking the $20k mark when you can pick up just as nice cars for $18k (though maybe US spec cars with sunroofs). This is all speculation since none of us have actually seen this car in person, inspected the records or driven it.

You have to decide if the Euro spec and lack of a sunroof are worth $3000 to $4000 to you (not us, you). If it is, then pay the piper and get this car if you REALLY want it. If you have any doubts or don't like this or that, then pass on this car and let the seller's hold out for that one buyer they feel they will get someday (which is entirely possible if they are patient - I've seen very overpriced cars sell after 2 years of holding out by owners for just the right person).

I think I've seen this car for sale for awhile on this board... Am I wrong?

Jay
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Last edited by Jay H; 10-07-2005 at 06:45 PM..
Old 10-07-2005, 06:16 PM
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Eli K and rrpjr,

I was wrong, the Euro cars WERE lighter by 90 kg; I did not see the information in the Original Porsche 911 book the first time. This is what it says:

That is before it was federalized. Some material will be added to a Euro car to get it through inspection, They may end up heavier than a USA car depending on who and how the car was brought up to USA codes. If it went through an inspection process it gained weight for sure. Kevin
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Old 10-07-2005, 07:04 PM
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Jay H,

You are right, the first post that I could find is in this thread:

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/search.php?action=showresults&searchid=1487122&sortby=lastpost&sortorder=descending

on 03-09-2005. Interestingly, asking price is $21,000.

Art

Quote:
The color is a metalic grey with black interior.

No sunroof. 81k miles. Euro Carrera with no sunroof. Interior is excellent with 2 exceptions: 1) 1/2" crack on dash leading from defroster vent. I will replace the dash to fix. 2) seam seperation on front seat. This will also be fixed. There are the normal amount of stone chips. No dents/dings. No apparent accident damage. Have leakdown/compression results and ppi results. Car runs extremely smooth and stong (real strong top end pull). New Bilstein Sports Front/Rear. Fuch 6/7. H4 upgrade. 4 spoke steering wheel upgrade. Brakes good/Rotors Good, Tires 40%, Tranny shifts perfectly, zero oil leaks, no smoke/oil consumption. $21k

The car is going to get taken to California Speedway on March 18-20 for the PCA Speed Festival as the beginning of the attempt to sell the car (if you're in the area)

03-09-2005 08:24 PM
Old 10-08-2005, 01:57 AM
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Check out the driver side interior pic....there's a blue Carerra in the background and this pic looks like its a white car.......
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Old 10-08-2005, 05:12 AM
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oly oly is offline
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That is an unsettling picture for the reasons that you said. But I think that the other blue car is just a coincidence. The previous picture with a slightly different view shows that it is a blue car AND all of the interior features match the picture that you pointed out. At least it looks that way to me anyway.
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Old 10-08-2005, 12:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by oly
The negotiating owner (there are multiple owners) said that he turned down an offer for $20k about a week ago.
yeah/hmmm ... ask him what he bought it for. Or, check the state records. Though, it really doesn't matter. If the seller wants to hold on to it at 20k (or whatever) then no deal.

I drove that car when it was on a lot in LA. Denis (Speeder) also drove it. I thought it pulled as a euro should, Denis thought it a bit lagging. I don't remember it being particularly uber-clean . . . split seat (cloth/vinyl) for example. But certainly not beat-up .. . somewhere better than average , all in all.

I remember lookng for any euro/US conversion hacks, but found none.

personally I think it's a bit high on price, but can also see that it has some unique pluses.
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Old 10-08-2005, 02:58 PM
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US model '84 carreras with 80-100k mi. on them are listed on Autotrader.com and other places all the time for about $15k to $18k.

In my opinion anything over $20k w/that kind of mileage should be a G50.

Also, are we all sure that's Venetian Blue? I thought this below was Venetian Blue. Maybe I'm wrong though. Looks a lot different to me.

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Old 10-08-2005, 04:53 PM
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This cutout from his trunk photo below does not say "Veneziablau" - it says "Schieferblau", which is slate blue.

Maybe the seller just doesn't know what color his car is.

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Old 10-08-2005, 05:03 PM
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island911,

Thanks for the post. That is interesting that you've driven the car. How long ago was that?

Art
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Old 10-09-2005, 01:59 AM
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JR_NYC,

I came to the same conclusion; that it is slate blue. According to "Red Book" and "The Original Porsche 911" Venetian Blue was not available until 1987.

Art
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Old 10-09-2005, 02:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by oly
island911,

Thanks for the post. That is interesting that you've driven the car. How long ago was that?

Art
Jan/Feb 05. The car was on ebay at the time. Another Pelican (out of state) asked Denis (Speeder) to check it out ... I went along.

Somewhere (I think) I have pict's of every little problem area that stuck out. If I can find them, I'll email them to ya.
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Old 10-09-2005, 08:02 AM
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You don't know the actual mileage. When it was imported the Speedo and ODO were swapped out.

Unless you have 100% all DOT documentation, and reciepts and it all jives then it doesn't matter what the odo is saying now- it's probably wrong.. For the price difference between what that car is really worth and what he's asking you can have one hell of a USA spec car with upgrades. You can buy someone's sorted track car for that kind of money.

I say pass.

rjp
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Old 10-09-2005, 08:58 AM
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pict's taken 1/25/05

antenna hole in roof


dash_crack starting





more holes


bad lens seal?
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More information is available as my professional opinion, which is provided for an exorbitant fee.
Old 10-09-2005, 09:21 AM
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island911,

Thanks for the pictures! Except for the seat, the seller did not mention any of the other stuff. He said that he had the seat repaired. Were those the only problems that you found? Other than the car pulling well, did it drive okay?

Art

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Old 10-09-2005, 09:37 AM
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