the truth about 3.2 turbo conversions

raceman · 01-16-2006, 01:35 PM

l`ve driven it!! Finally got the craft out on the open road to test the various systems,log boost,fuel pressure and air/fuel ratios. The results? truly awesome amigos.Well worth the money. l`m using a .5 bar spring in the Tial wastegate to start off with and l`m seeing just under 7psi on the boost guage tell-tale which is about right.Fuel pressure tops out at approx. 44 psi and the wideband shows 12-14.My ex.temps are at about 1200' after running wide open and cyl.head temp shows maybe 200-300' at the most.The oil temps are on the cool side and in fact the car isn`t getting close to hot at all.That`s pretty low boost though so l don`t expect heat problems with the huge intercooler l have. l get full boost by 3000rpm if l`m wide open and the car is VERY fast. How fast? A lot faster.l will log some 0-60 times once my tranny loosens up a bit since it`s just been rebuilt and has only 1000 miles or so. pics to follow

ben parrish · 01-16-2006, 02:44 PM

Congrats.!! I hope to do the same in the future but I would prefer to buy a "kit" from someone who knows what they are doing. Keep us posted.
Ben

masraum · 01-16-2006, 02:56 PM

Yes, we need more info and stories. Since I no longer have my 3.2L or and 911 I have to live vicariously through people like you.

RickM · RickM's Garage

Race, great to hear. Which Tial did you go with? Also, whos BOV did you use? Thanks.

raceman · 01-17-2006, 01:43 PM

thanks amigos. l ended up with the 46mm Tial which is the priciest but it`s a bolt on replacement and looks great. The blow off valve l got is not up to par however and l`m looking for a replacement. l`ll get something brand name and proven to work,unlike what l have now which sounds like a bird fart. This conversion is not hard to do and uses available 930 parts,new or used. l understand l can boost as high as 10 psi with my current configuration ( 4-1 FMU and huge intercooler) perhaps even higher. l installed all the guages to allow me to safely find a reasonable maximum threshold and so far zero problems at .5bar. l`ve overboosted cars in the past though, before all the parts and info were available to us tuners.l think my system could be recreated for less then $5000.00 including buying the chip from Promotive.

bigrubberjeep · 01-17-2006, 01:52 PM

I have a couple of questions -

How many miles did the 3.2 have prior to the Turbo conversion?

Do you have a list of parts that you have used and the sources for them?

herman maire · 01-17-2006, 02:15 PM

Can't wait to see the pics.

Show the exhaust, intercooler ect..

I take it you are running stock 3.2 compression?

YermanCars · 01-18-2006, 10:37 AM

Your fuel pressure should be at 60 psi.

What turbo are you running?

raceman · 01-19-2006, 09:48 AM

l`ve got 94,000 miles on the car and it`s in mint shape with the engine never having been apart.The turbo is a split volute Garrett T4 60-1,.72 a/r which seems perfectly matched to the engine.l`ve bought or built several turbo cars and the lack of lag with this set up is incredible.l`m a little concerned with the fuel pressure readings though.l`m running a Vortech 4 -1 FMU which should at 7psi boost bump the fuel pressure 28lbs.The static fuel pressure is about 30 so l should see 58lbs but l see only about 43. The AFR`s look okay at 13-1 but l think l`d like to see lower at WOT and full boost.The fuel pump is new...

YermanCars · 01-19-2006, 09:56 AM

Yes you should read about 60psi on the fuel, be carefull you should be at 12:1on your a/f or you may blow it.

raceman · 01-19-2006, 12:51 PM

Yerman are you using a fuel pressure guage? and do you use the FMU (boost actuated rising rate FPR) because from talking to the tech support at Vortech what l`m seeing is normal. The fuel pressure builds UP TO 4-1,it is not at 4-1 until about 11psi of boost. l know Promotive uses a 3.82-1 rising rate unit so l should actually have a richer running system at WOT,10psi boost. The PLX wideband seems accurate but looking at the guages while wide open is somewhat tricky so l`ve seen readings down to 11-1.. l think...l really need a passenger to monitor while l drive. My exhaust temp/cyl head temps show no danger so far and even my oil temps are low at about 180'. l`ve got lots of testing still to do,like a pressure check of the entire intake from turbo outlet forward.l cap the turbo outlet and pressurize with the brake bleeder checking for leaks with ear and soapy water spray.Anyhow any help appreciated by other 3.2 turbo converters

WydRyd · 06-25-2006, 08:08 PM

raceman, how are you going with your Vortech 4:1 FMU?

Have you had a chance to verify your A/F readings under boost using this FMU?

My RR FPR is dead and I'm looking at replacing it with the Vortech one. I don't really want to spend USD$475 for a new Proto one

I'd be interested in your experiences with the Vortech unit.

raceman · 06-26-2006, 06:41 AM

hey Merv,good to hear from you.My tuning experience led me to a FULLY adjustable unit from BEGI/Cartech.This is what you need.Period.The adjustments are incredible:Gain,Rate of Gain,Boost onset.This unit allowed me to tune out the dreaded lean spot of"boost onset" that plagues users of other FMU`s. l spoke with Corky Bell several times before,during and after the tuning process.The car is an absolute rocket.The rears break loose in second gear if l mash it at 4k rpm.This car scares people.l`m running the Promotive chip with the most modest(safest) timing,the stage One.Later stages advance timing more so although my car runs out of steam near redline as a result of this l have no discernable detonation and cool running temps.Honestly,things couldn`t have turned out better.l`ll give you the rundown on all the operating systems if you like,l seem to have built a very safe balanced system.

sammyg2 · 06-26-2006, 06:47 AM

There is a myth floating around that you have to hit very high boost numbers to make significant power, it just aint so.
As you have testified, .5 bar makes a huge difference. I can almost see the smile on your face from here

I'm running .5 bar and love it.
My A/F ratio is rock steady at 12 to 1 under boost according to my LM-1, anything leaner than that would make me nervous.

jbrinkley · 06-26-2006, 07:26 AM

I like to see a build list and sources if you got the time.

WydRyd · 06-26-2006, 08:02 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by raceman
hey Merv,good to hear from you.My tuning experience led me to a FULLY adjustable unit from BEGI/Cartech.This is what you need.Period.The adjustments are incredible:Gain,Rate of Gain,Boost onset.This unit allowed me to tune out the dreaded lean spot of"boost onset" that plagues users of other FMU`s. l spoke with Corky Bell several times before,during and after the tuning process.The car is an absolute rocket.The rears break loose in second gear if l mash it at 4k rpm.This car scares people.l`m running the Promotive chip with the most modest(safest) timing,the stage One.Later stages advance timing more so although my car runs out of steam near redline as a result of this l have no discernable detonation and cool running temps.Honestly,things couldn`t have turned out better.l`ll give you the rundown on all the operating systems if you like,l seem to have built a very safe balanced system.

Awesome stuff raceman. Well done! I may consider the BEGI/Cartech FMU if Proto don't come to the party and supply me a rebuild kit for my existing RR FPR. I'm trying to get away with a simple bolt-in fix, instead of tuning a whole new adjustable FMU on the dyno

Sounds like you've done a good job of tuning the Cartech unit, so if I do go down that path, I may seek some tuning advice from you

Are you running the Cartech FMU as a standalone unit, or in series with the OEM regulator?

Which model did you get? The 2025 or the MR2035?

The description for the MR unit is:

"Multi Role Regulators
The new Multi Role regulator from BEGi is designed to provide complete adjustability to your fuel injection pressure. The MR series takes all of the features found in our rising-rate regulators and adds the extra functionality and convenience of allowing you to adjust your base fuel pressure (the fuel pressure at fuel rail during idle conditions). This allows you to replace your factory fuel pressure regulator with a fully adjustable, easy to mount, single unit."

It seems like the 2025 unit is designed to be used in conjunction with the OEM regulator? Is that the case in your setup?

Thanks

david.avery · david.avery's Garage

Hmm... love to see some dyno #'s Raceman

My car is running great, but it doesn't really scare anybody, it feels like a mellow 3.2 on the low end, and then crisply accelerates. I can't imagine it breaking my 255*17 tires free though, it hits softer than that.

raceman · 06-26-2006, 02:57 PM

hey amigos,thanks for the interest.Merv l have the 2025 and the factory FPR unit stays in place.The 2025 is plumbed into the fuel return line and l get my boost signal for it from a short pressure line plumbed to the T-body.l`ve got a .5bar spring in the 46mm Tial but l installed a MBC in the engine compartment that l`ve dialed to add another 1-2 lbs. As for the great power l seem to have over a Proto stage1 and l think there are a lot of reasons for that. My turbo is a bit different,more like their stage two unit.l have 930 headers,a trick exhaust,larger T-body and high power spark system.My intake uses the very minimum of silicon plumbing,instead using hard tubing to reduce lag.All boost reference lines are swell resistant accurate signals. l think my fuel system and guages allow fine tuning of power beyond what a kit can offer.l`d love to see dyno numbers too,everyone always does with Proto chipped cars...but l live in Santa Fe,New Mexico and there are no dynos here.l think Albq. may have one or two but l`m not sure about letting my car out of my hands to someone l don`t know.lf l ever need to dyno the car l`ll post the numbers,good or bad.l would say based on my personal experience and the comments from various HP experienced passengers that the car has over 300 Hp,maybe up to 350.lt`s A LOT faster then both the other Porsche turbos l`ve driven lately,a 78 and a 94 C2.One other thing to consider-the car is pretty light.Lots of CF and fiberglass...

WydRyd · 06-26-2006, 03:32 PM

Great to hear you're loving the boost

OK, now I understand how your FPR is installed. See, my Proto RR FPR replaces the OEM regulator, and is stand-alone.

If I replace it with a BEGi/Cartech unit, I may have to go with the MR2035 unit, which sets the base idle fuel pressure too. A bit more expensive than the 2025, but still cheaper than a replacement Proto unit

raceman · 06-26-2006, 10:12 PM

hey Merv,do you still have your stock FPR? or did Proto use it as a core?because you could reinstall it and go with the 2025. You`re going with twins turbos next? Just buy the guages like l did and tune it yourself.l bought my Cartech 2025 off Ebay for about $100.00 used and really shopped around for the rest of the kit.The only Proto part you need is the chip and if Steve W.gets into turbos we`ll all be set.