Hi-Intensity Xenon Lights in 911SC?

[suavedr]

Hey guys, as usual your advice/info breeds more questions from a newbie like me.
Has anyone seen or tried to modify a 911 (78-89) and add bi-xenon, hi-intensity discharge headlights? I think you can just change the bulb and use a kit to modify from the halogen but I never know what I'm talking about. I am assuming ofcourse that all of the housing and headlight hardware stays the same except for the new bulb and hardware. I think it would really turn heads when a 911 storms on you with the brightest headlights on the market.

[javadog]

If you want bright headlights in a 911, install a set of Bosch H1 lights, with the appropriate bulbs and relays. Forget the newer technology stuff; without changing the reflector and lens assemblies, you are essentially peeing into the wind.

JR

[Blue3.2]

From comments on other threads, it seems that adding HID to H-4 lenses is not a good idea b/c of the beam pattern blinding oncoming drivers. I haven't tried, so I could be wrong. BUT...

With so much interest (and perhaps demand) for HID why doesn't someone create a projector HID system for these pre-993 911s? Any lighting engineers out there?

[BeauBlues]

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[Craig 930 RS]

Three words:

H1 or H4

[spiff]

I've been meaning to do this. There was someone who posted an ad in the classifieds to see if anyone has had interest, but I'm not sure how far he got. I'm at the point where I've found sources for the ballasts/bulbs and know which bi-xenon unit I'll be using, but it's just a question of finding the right supplier (ie. reasonable enough). Here's what it will comprise:
- HID Ballasts
- HID D2S bulbs (~4300K color, pure white)
- Bi-xenon projector w/solenoid
- Mounting adaptor to fit the projector unit into the headlight housing
- wiring with adaptor plugs to mate to exisitng wiring harness and appropriate current protection (relays, diodes, etc)
- Clear headlight lenses

If I do this, then people would need to have euro H4 style headlight units or at least the retaining rings/springs/screws and reflector housings for the projector with adaptor to mount into.

Aside from attaching the ballasts to the car in some fashiion, the rest should be fairly bolt-on and plug/play.

Unfortunately, I've only got the early style '66 headlights that have the separate 7" sealed beams, but already have the euro lense shape and retaining rings. When I finish everything, I'll post some pics. It should be fairly easy to modify the adaptor plates to the euro H4 units though.

The question I have is would people be interested in the complete kit or just certain components?

Is it better to make the kit as an upgrade for US style sugar scoop lights/lenses or more for people that already have euro H4's, or both?

I'm planning to use Hella projectors and Asian sourced ballasts/bulbs (come with 1 yr warranty) to keep costs reasonable.

Exisiting kits out there do not replace the fluted glass lense and do not include a new projector beam unit. Some have a bi-xenon function built into the bulb, but it's marginal at best. Those kits typically consist of the ballasts, bulbs and adaptor wiring/plugs.

Vertex sells them for 911's on ebay for $250 - $280.

What I'm looking at would additionally provide the projector beams, clear lenses and adaptor plates/hardware to mount the units.

What do you guys think?

[Blue3.2]

Sounds great. This could really look sharp. I'm more interested in the complete package. Please post pics when you're finished!

Will high and low beams be incorporated in the one projector? What about creating a light like the new 911s which consist of projector and halogen+reflector (not sure if halogens are low beams, high beams, or fog lights).

[Craig 930 RS]

Why? So you could say you have them and have cute colored lights?
Really, what a waste of money. IMO, of course. I've the H1s and they put out shedloads of lumens, more than enough.

[axvel]

Originally posted by spiff
I've been meaning to do this. There was someone who posted an ad in the classifieds to see if anyone has had interest, but I'm not sure how far he got. I'm at the point where I've found sources for the ballasts/bulbs and know which bi-xenon unit I'll be using, but it's just a question of finding the right supplier (ie. reasonable enough). Here's what it will comprise:
- HID Ballasts
- HID D2S bulbs (~4300K color, pure white)
- Bi-xenon projector w/solenoid
- Mounting adaptor to fit the projector unit into the headlight housing
- wiring with adaptor plugs to mate to exisitng wiring harness and appropriate current protection (relays, diodes, etc)
- Clear headlight lenses

If I do this, then people would need to have euro H4 style headlight units or at least the retaining rings/springs/screws and reflector housings for the projector with adaptor to mount into.

Aside from attaching the ballasts to the car in some fashiion, the rest should be fairly bolt-on and plug/play.

Unfortunately, I've only got the early style '66 headlights that have the separate 7" sealed beams, but already have the euro lense shape and retaining rings. When I finish everything, I'll post some pics. It should be fairly easy to modify the adaptor plates to the euro H4 units though.

The question I have is would people be interested in the complete kit or just certain components?

Is it better to make the kit as an upgrade for US style sugar scoop lights/lenses or more for people that already have euro H4's, or both?

I'm planning to use Hella projectors and Asian sourced ballasts/bulbs (come with 1 yr warranty) to keep costs reasonable.

Exisiting kits out there do not replace the fluted glass lense and do not include a new projector beam unit. Some have a bi-xenon function built into the bulb, but it's marginal at best. Those kits typically consist of the ballasts, bulbs and adaptor wiring/plugs.

Vertex sells them for 911's on ebay for $250 - $280.

What I'm looking at would additionally provide the projector beams, clear lenses and adaptor plates/hardware to mount the units.

What do you guys think?

I'm already interested for the entire kit, those who dont want it dont flame those who try to actually creat something!!!

[Craig 930 RS]

Flame? Education.

[Blue3.2]

With the right bulb, the H1 and H4s work great, but the advantage of the HID (notwithstanding the disadvantages described by DS in the link above) is MORE light with LESS energy.

Another alternative might be LED headlamps, but that's a few years out for even the car manufacturers.

[Craig 930 RS]

Then spend away.....

[RSBob]

Go with either H1s or H4s - I upgraded to H4s with relays with 80/100s at it made a WORLD of difference. On my Audi, Euro lamps are pretty much NLA, so I went with bi-xeon - yes they are bright, but they are not suited to the lamp shape and throw the light everywhere - including into oncoming drivers eyes. Also the supposed Hi-beam are a joke.

[spiff]

RSBob,
Which bi-xenon's are you referring to? The ones built into the bulb as a "retro-fit" into existing H4 headlights or the real projector bi-xenons found in OEM (predominantly) german cars eg. Mercedes, BMW, Audi and, of course our marque?

I figured if it was good enough for OEM's to use these projectors, both in terms of light output and beam pattern (in both low AND hi), then it's good enough for me.

By the way, a typical Halogen 100W bulb puts out about 1500 lumens. HID's in steady state at 35W put out more than 3200 lumens (light output) and last about 4-5 times longer.
In addition, projector units only rely on an integrated reflector and lense built into the unit itself. That's why headlights with these units don't actually have a reflector, but more of a "shroud" purely for cosmetic reasons. This is why it's ideal to adapt them. It no longer matters what type of housing they go into, as long as the lense in front is clear.

I definitely don't mean to say everyone should get them. Craig911 is right that H4's and H1's are MUCH better than US headlights. I appreciate any feedback people would have to offer. This really comes down to personal preferences. It's just when I saw the last thread about a set of H1's selling on ebay for $1100, authentic and period correct is one thing, but that is crazy. I know I can put a kit together for way less than that....

Cost is a factor, but for what you get in performance, and knowing you've got a superior system, isn't that why we own Porsches in the first place?

[87coupe]

I'll preface this by saying "This is only my semi educated opinion".

The problems I have with the idea of putting HID in a pre 993 911 is even if you performed the HID upgrade properly and used a projector behind a clear H1/H4/H5 looking lens (are these even available?), the look is way too modern for the car. If you just use a normal H1/H4/H5 lens you will not have the proper focus / light pattern for the HID's. I can't think of a single car that has factory HID's that is not in a projector behind clear lens configuration, there is a reason for this.

[javadog]

A couple of thoughts;

Have you considered whether or not there is enough fore/aft room in the headlight buckets for such an installation?

I own several cars fitted with the factory xenon lights and I can't say I've been very impressed, especially sice I'm stuck with what the factory decided was a proper difference in aim between the low and high beams. If you adjust them for good low beam operation, the high beams stink, and vice-versa. I'd wager that my cars with the H1 lights perform better and the ones I have that have H4s aren't far behind. Seems like a lot of trouble for not much gain.

JR

[ischmitz]

JR,
if you happen to have an ML 430 or 500 with bi-xenon's you can twist my arm and I could be persuaded into trading you my regular candles....

[movin]

Regarding the comment no OEM manufacturer ever provided a HID set-up with a difused glass lense is not quite right. Mercedes had done this for years. Go for it. I've heard of others doing exactly what you're doing. It's work but it will pay-off in the end.
On another note, I thought HID was dead because GE found a way to shape and coat halogen bulbs that reflects the infrared waves back into the bulb's core boosting temp's into the 4K+ range. That's HID territory. All this with standard wiring, no ballasts, no relays, etc. This technology is on the way now!

[javadog]

Sorry ischmitz,

I had an M-class but got rid of it in favor of an E-class wagon. Too many rattles.

JR