Advice for 911 SC..Please help!

[Plecostomus]

I'm currently looking at a "near-mint" SC with 49,500 miles. Its claimed by the dealership to be a single owner car with no issues whatsoever...not one ding/dent etc. I've seen a few pictures and it looks like a 9/10 in and out. He wants a lot for it...
I asked him that if he would accept my offer of $22k (incl shipping 900 miles),assuming PPI is OK, I would pay the $450 to fly out and see it as well as the $300 for the PPI. Assuming the car is in stellar condition, is this an acceptible offer to the dealership? Thanks if you can advise,

Regards,

C

[Cdnone1]

I'm not sure what advice you are seeking. The dealership will let you know if your offer is acceptable. I've owned a few SC's in various states but I guess I'm not to sure what your asking about
Steve

[Plecostomus]

Thanks for your reply. I'm asking if my offer seems reasonable or will it be laughed at!
Thanks

[1973911s]

That is top dollar for an SC, and if the car is that nice and you like it it is worth your offer.

What are they asking for the car, any pictures you could share?

[GothingNC]

Congrats on locating one.

Make sure you have the PPI check for broken head studs.
I've noticed they seem to snap on cars that are not driven enough and are located in areas with high humidity.

Also the fluids will probably need to be changed if it's been sitting around for a long time.
Check to see if the rubber centered clutch has been replaced and the age of the tires.
I think $22,000 is a bit high and if you will take a big hit if something comes up and you need to sell it quick.
Did you check this one out?

http://www.cars.com/go/search/detail.jsp;?tracktype=usedcc&searchType=22&pageNumber=0&numResultsPerPage=50&largeNumResultsPerPage=0&sortorder=descending&sortfield=PRICE+descending&certifiedOnly=false&criteria=K-%7CE-ALL%7CM-_41_%7CH-%7CD-_386_%7CN-N%7CR-250%7CI-1%7CP-PRICE+descending%7CQ-descending%7CY-_1983_%7CX-popular%7CZ-27616&aff=national&paId=203453292&recnum=0&leadExists=true&sellerFirst=true

Mileage is higher but paint seems nice in the photos (Photo's can hide lots of flaws) and maintenance/upgrades are all up to date.

$5,000 cheaper or more depending on what offer he takes and you could use the money to pick up a set of nice 911 sports seats.

[GothingNC]

Is the dealership Victory?

[sammyg2]

That is twice what an average SC would cost, so if I were to pay that much it would have to be perfect, not just near mint.

[GothingNC]

Values from "the Gold book"

82 SC Coupe

Fair 8,000
Good 15,000
Exc 18,500
Show 22,000
Loan 13,500

[vash]

a perfect, MINT sc will pull 22k. i think you made a good, fair offer.

[Plecostomus]

1973- I'll try to get a pic up soon, thanks.

John- I saw that car two weeks ago and its not at the level that I'm looking for, but a decent car nonetheless. and btw, its not victory (I don't trust them for some reason). Thanks for your lead

Sammy- True, but top SCs fetch a higher price over here because they are usually driven in inclimate(sp?) weather, but then again they shouldnt be over $22k!-- Thanks!

Vash, thanks for your input!


I just got an email from the seller who stated his $24k price was firm especially due to the voluminous number of emails he's recieved thus far. I told him that 99.9% of these contacts want to drive him down into the teens for price. He suggested I give him my credit card for deposit and its mine today I told him the most I've ever seen a prime SC sell for is $21,800 and that I need for him to be a little flexible. I told him I can give him a check for the car in the next few days, but would need his guarantee that a post-sale PPI would be clean.
I'll be going to see an SC in Boston this weekend that has 66k miles and is selling for a negotiable $19,900, so I will keep you guys posted. I'd hate to lose this one since its one of the best I've seen, but there's going to be near-future "investments" that are going to be needed in the car. Thanks again for your feelings on this,

Kurt

[GothingNC]

If you wanted the car I would place a refundable deposit with the Seller and then have a PPI completed and then negotiate the price more for any issues that come up.

[hytem]

Expect a dealer to pad the price 10-20%. Maybe they've put some work into it. A private seller wouldn't get $22K for a 50K mile car. I saw an 81 targa with 49K listed for $15.5K privately.These old low miles cars have never really been driven much, so a lot of the maintenance is probably ahead of you if you turn them into an everyday driver. That's OK, but you will depreciate that $22K rapidly. The price-mileage curve drops very steeply above 50K miles--especially above 80K. Offer them 10% less--around $20K, if you really like the car. It's a buyers market with these cars--look at the Panorama magazine listings. Plenty of them. And most on ebay don't sell at the reserve price.

[Plecostomus]

You read my mind, John. I wasn't quite sure which was the best way to do this, so thank you again..

Hytem- He keeps telling me its a once in a lifetime one-owner car with under 50k miles. I really appreciate your insight and it makes me feel better about my offer.

I just told the seller that I am moving on! Lets see how the Boston SC pans out...Thanks again guys!

[GothingNC]

Your inbox is full.

I noticed that the Dash is extremley warped in one of the photos on the Ebay SC you were asking about.

[Plecostomus]

John- Just remembering--Yes, as I remember it was warped! How could I forget. You are really sharp with your eyes. I was told that the AC does work. Thanks for the info

Kurt

[anthony]

As said, $22K should buy you a show car. Do you want a show car? Are you willing to drive a show car and turn it into a driver and lose money on the depreciation as you pile on the miles?

[Plecostomus]

Hi Anthony,

I wouldn't mind a show car, but I'm not sure what a "driver" specifically means. My intention is to take it out for a little cruising occasionally and on the weekends--no track or racing whatsoever. I never felt the necessity to take a car out to a track or street and beat the hell out of it pretending to be a F1 pilot!
Thanks for your input!

[anthony]

What I'm getting at is that a $22K SC should be a show car. By that I mean a close to 100 point concours car or a #1 on the 1 to 5 point scale. It should be flawless, inside and out.

Most people will look at a #2 condition car and call it mint and be dazzled by it's shininess but it's far from being a show car, would never win a concourse, and that should be reflected in the price. A #2 condition SC should sell for mid-teens. If you take a #1 condition car, drive it 3K miles a year for 4 or 5 years you may turn it into a #2 in short order. If driving and not preserving is the intent then it's best IMO to start with a #2 car in the first place.

Here's the five point scale:

Vehicle Condition Scale for classic car values:
1
EXCELLENT: Restored to current maximum professional standards of quality in every area, or perfect original with components operating and appearing as new. a 95-plus point show car that is not driven.

2
FINE: Well-restored or a combination of superior restoration and excellent original. Also, an extremely well-maintained original showing very minimal wear.

3
VERY GOOD: Completely operable original or "older restoration" showing wear. Also, a good amateur restoration, all presentable and serviceable inside and out. Plus, combinations of well-done restoration and good operable components or a partially restored car with all parts necessary to complete and / or valuable NOS parts.

4
GOOD: A drivable vehicle needing no or only minor work to be functional. Also, a deteriorated restoration or a very poor amateur restoration. All components may need restoration to be "excellent," but the car is mostly useable "as is."

5
RESTORABLE: Needs complete restoration of body, chassis and interior. May or may not be running, but isn't weathered, wrecked or stripped to the point of being useful only for parts



The car in question actually sounds like a #2 but is priced like a #1. My "driver" I mean #2 and lower versus a #1 (show car).

[Plecostomus]

Wow, thanks for educating me on this classification system, Anthony. Very kind of you!

I would agree that this car is more a #2-3. I thought it was going to be a real catch, but it has real issues!
1)No engine upgrades(CTs, airbox, etc.)
2)No headstud replacement (Its from the rainy NE area)
3)A/C nonfunctional
4)front air dam damaged probably from towing
5)Very warped dashboard
6)Original clutch
7)Who knows what else!

This car is definitely not a $24k car. I now feel uneasy about offering $21,500. I'm sure some emotional guy will end up buying it. Thanks again you guys,

Kurt

[nostatic]

I have to disagree with a lot of you guys. The days of getting a low miles near mint SC for the teens are gone imho. Sure, the rare find is out there, but not like it was 3-5 years ago.

Here's my take on it. You are looking for a very specific car (color/condition). The general rule of thumb is cheap/ideal fit/now, pick any two. I paid $17K for my 40K mile "perfect" SC. But that was over 4 years ago. There are less examples now, so the prices are up from that.

imho if the $22K car is well documented, checks out clean, and is EXACTLY what you want, then go ahead and buy it. BUT, realize that you are paying a premium, and every time you drive it you are losing money. And every ding or scratch is costing you money. The question is, do you care? Once my car got whacked by concrete, I enjoyed it a lot more because I didn't agonize about every little issue. imho these cars are to be driven hard, not put in a garage and polished all the time.

If you can't deal with that, then look for a more "experienced" car. Or if you don't want to drive it much, but just admire it in the garage, then buy the nicest one you can find.

In the end, I think it is a waste to look, look, look when you could be driving. Paying a couple $K more than what people here think is a "good deal" ends up being a wash in the end, especially compared to how much money you'll likely sink into the car if you keep it for any length of time.