Introducing Porsche vin# 9113112244 - The Charlie Brown Christmas Targa

Wrecked944 · 05:49 PM

Well, I may live to regret this, but last weekend I took possession of a 1973 911T Targa. The former owner is a Pelican member named mikey73 who has been trying to GIVE the car away in the Pelican classifieds for months. And last week, I took the bait. I just could not allow a sad little long hood chassis to go to the junk yard. Would no-one care for this car? Would no-one love it? So Shaun84Targa and I drove all flippin' night through CT and endured a police stop and the disintegration of our trailer on I495 to get this beauty.

But now she sits in my back yard and I am wondering WHAT THE F*CK WAS I THINKING??? Oops, I mean, "Isn't it great to have an opportunity to save such a classic 911." Anyway, I already have two (count'em TWO) perfectly lovely and wonderful Porsches in my driveway. So I wasn't exactly jonesin' for a third. I literally just saw the ad for a free '73 and said, "Sure, why not?" So I have no plans and no clue. On the drive through CT, Shaun and I dreamed up every crazy idea from converting the chassis for electric power to bolting in a roll cage and racing it to cutting off the targa top and converting to to a seedster. I'd like to remain at least minimally faithful to Dr Porsche's vision - so retro-fitting that Fiero Countach body kit is probably beyond the pale. But otherwise, I really took the car with no plan what-so-ever. So I am WIDE open to suggestions. So to get the ball rolling, here is a quick list of good and bad things I found when inspecting the chassis in daylight...

GOOD: The rear clip appears to have very little rust. The front suspension does indeed appear to be intact including a front roll bar. It also has a left front brake caliper in place. The hand brake works just fine. The rear suspension looks reasonably good (except the shocks have surface rust). The bannana arms are okay as are the rear trailing arms. The windshield is okay except for a single rock chip. The steering linkage is okay. The shift linkage is also okay. We found rust on most edges and typical places. But it was all surface rust or in relatively unimportant (read: not structural) places where I can just grind it off and slap on some bondo. There were also two rear AXLES inside the car. Woo Hoo! The CV's are probably toast but the shafts looked good. Most of the front clip looked good. The smugglers box was solid. The front suspension pan is mostly solid. The battery boxes are good. The rear fire wall looked good. The whole engine compartment looked okay.

BAD: Aside from the left front caliper, the brakes are MIA. I assume the whole brake system needs replacement. The whole floor pan is toast - way worse than it appeared when we picked up the car. The center tunnel looks good but it is toast on either side. You can actually see the ground beneath the pedal cluster. The front mounts for the torsion bars are completely rusted away. I don't recall the name of the part. But it is the sheet metal part that attaches forward of the suspension pan. It has "gone to the light" and needs to be cut out and a new part welded in place.

So there ya go. It is a mixed bag. We placed a tarp underneath the car and put a proper car cover on top. And there it will sit until I can figure out what, if anything can be done with it. More pics to follow...

Wrecked944 · 04:19 PM

This needs to be completely replaced. It is actually worse than it looks. I'll need to ask for some serious advice on procedure here. I have never attempted anything like this before. I have a book on 911 restoration which says I'll need to drill out the spot welds (whatever THAT means) and then tack weld replacement panels in. But replacement panels are damned expensive so Iwonder if I can just cut out the rusty bits with a sawzall and weld in some frickin' sheet metal.

Rusted all the way through to here...

I don't know if you can see it but the forward mounting point for the front torsion bar has "gone to the light"...I'm no expert, but I think that is an important part to fix...

WOO HOO! AXLES!!

Front and rear suspension bits all appear to be in place...

Dan in Pasadena · Dan in Pasadena's Garage

Ship it to DarylD for rust repair!

Seriously, if you're gonna bring it back? Then bring it back, but as inexpensively (in the same sentence with "Porsche"?) as you can. I don't know what your fabrication skills are but I'd use it as an opportunity to gain skills or improve them. If you don't already ahev them, scour Harbor Freight for a MIG welder, sandblast cabinet and some body tools and go at it. You got it for free, so consider the cost of the tools you need the cost of purchase - its not like you can screw it up and lose money....you'll still have the tools! I'd restore it back to stock. Look out for trashed cars you can scavenge a brake system out of and misc parts. Don't plan on getting it done too soon. Make a list subsystem by subsystem (i.e. rust, brakes, engine, suspension, electrical, etc.), make a "parts have" and a "parts needed" list and focus on getting each subsystem restored (or at least safely operable) before moving onto the next item. Hell, if nothing else you'll gain welding, body work and painting skills.

Wrecked944 · 04:28 PM

Dan, I think you've hit the nail on the head. I already have two Porsches so it isn't like I'll be missing the Porsche Driving Experience while this car awaits repairs. I figure I'll learn to weld on it since I can't exactly make it WORSE.

One of my buddies suggested I use it as a "performance art" project to see if I can somehow spend zero dollars on the resto...like maybe put an ad in the classifieds asking for parts so badly rusted that they are literally worthless and then try to repair them...I think that is an unlikely option but it gives you an idea where the discussion is going...

And don't count out the electric car idea...I actually believe it is possibly more "do-able" than buying an installing a flat $$$$$ix...

Wrecked944 · 05-10-2006, 05:01 PM

More pics...

Wrecked944 · 05-10-2006, 05:03 PM

rattlsnak · rattlsnak's Garage

Good Googley Moogley.. You have your work cut out for you!

klaucke · 05-10-2006, 05:23 PM

Janus, I can help you w/ the welding, I have experience in panel replacement. If you ever need some extra hands when working on it, let me know.

tdatk · 05-10-2006, 05:29 PM

But now she sits in my back yard and I am wondering WHAT THE F*CK WAS I THINKING???

YOU'RE A BLOCKHEAD CHARLIE BROWN !!!!!!!

No , really, I've seen worse, I just can't remember where........

Brillo · Brillo's Garage

Send it to Zeke. Wasn't he looking for another project?

bell · bell's Garage

electric track car

they'd never hear you coming

Bobboloo · Bobboloo's Garage

Now all you need is to find a wrecked Carrera you can buy as salvage to get donor parts to transplant onto that car.

By the way. You're correct. The front suspension pan is toast. The replacement kits are readily available though.

Kroggers · Kroggers's Garage

Good luck

Shaun @ Tru6 · 05-11-2006, 07:05 AM

In whatever direction it goes, this is going to be a great project Janus! Jonathan and I can help with welding, and I've got a ton of early parts from a 71 I cut up a while ago, which was in way worse condition than this pristine piece of Porsche history.

if it were my car, the first thing I'd do in the restoration is get it on level ground, take a few measurements to make sure the body is straight and then weld in a roll cage tieing the suspension points F/R into it. that will allow you to cut the rest of it up and place new panels in without much concern for warping the unibody. All we need is a tube bender, chopsaw, 60+ feet of 1.5 x .120 DOM steel tubing, sill plates, the track car to measure and copy and we're good to go with Jonathan on board.

and then cut that nasty targa bar off.

Perhaps we could start in July or so?

Maybe we can get Chris to rebuild that old 2.2 in my grandfather's cellar. Oh, and maybe an EFI conversion too.

and then...

Wrecked944 · 05-11-2006, 07:31 AM

Oh...roll cage to strengthen the chassis...I'm glad you mentioned that...I never would have thought of that...and yes, Jon, I will definitely take you up on your offer to help with the welding...

The good news is that I think/hope I have identified and photographed all of the bad stuff. Shaun looked at the torsion tube and rocker bits under the car and maybe knows more than I do about those. But otherwise, I think the only real structural problems are just the floor pan and that front suspension piece...fix those and it will at least be a relatively solid chassis with some ugly but repairable cosmetic rust issues.

And I can't stress enough how I'm NOT in a hurry...the chassis is safe and well-protected so it can wait...

Oh yeah, and speaking of protecting the chassis, Shaun and I talked about preventing further rust damage. And while the car cover and tarp will go a long way towards that goal, does anyone know what else I should do? I am familiar with POR15 but I also see that Eastwood sells other "rust encapsulator" paints and such. Would it be a good idea to coat the chassis with some sort of goop? Should I be in a hurry to grind off the rusty bits and treat them with something? I had a friend once store a car wrapped in plastic with a dessicant product tucked inside. Is that a good idea?

Tim Hancock · 05-11-2006, 08:15 AM

I think I would scrap it or save it for parts. It would seem much cheaper in the end to buy a "complete" ratty car to restore/buildup as opposed to one that was missing tons of parts. I would also have to convince myself that a '73 Targa is what I really want to spend tons of time and money on restoring, if not, why "waste" good years of my hobby time and money on something that I did not really want.

Not trying to be a party pooper, but I have had to make some of these decisions myself recently as a family member gave me a "free" Super Beetle that I contemplated restoring. Why not I thought, VW parts are cheap and I have what it takes to do the job. Well after some soul searching, I came to the conclusion that even if I spend little money on the job, I will "waste" too much TIME to do the car right and in the end, I would rather spend that time doing an rsr clone or building/restoring another airplane.

Just food for thought.

widebody911 · widebody911's Garage

Quote:

Originally posted by Shaun 84 Targa
All we need is a tube bender, chopsaw, 60+ feet of 1.5 x .120 DOM steel tubing,

Bring it on by! I have 40' of .095 DOM (PCA & SCCA spec) on-hand - enough to get started - and I got my tubing bender set up last weekend!

And I just happen to have a fiberglass top in inventory!

Wrecked944 · 05-11-2006, 02:21 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by widebody911
I have 40' of .095 DOM (PCA & SCCA spec) On-hand

PCA & SCCA spec? Can you fab your own PCA & SCCA approved cage or are you required to install one from an approved company in order to pass tech inspection for an event?

Wrecked944 · 06:55 AM

Okay, I have begun reviewing the parts list needed to get the car minimally functional. I figure that is a reasonable initial benchmark to use as a guide. Not concours. Not ready for LeMans. Just functional as a street car. Shaun84Targa has somehow already figured out where to get a set of decent fenders, doors, and a hood at a surprisingly good price. Don't ask me how he does it. I also happen to own a spare deck lid, a recaro seat, and an early 915 transmission. So if I throw in a set of font and rear bumbers, then believe it or not, the body panels will be nearly complete and the Charlie Brown Christmas Targa will look a lot like a car again.

That said, the structural issues must be addressed or everything else is a waste of time. So I think I have identified the parts needed to fix the major structural rust problems. I must stress that I am a total newb at this stuff so please correct me if I am wrong...

So to fix the rust problem with the front torsion bar mounts, I believe I need this part...

That pic comes from our host - but they appear to be NLA. Hmmm...unfortunately I know the tow hook mount is also rusted away and that appears to be on the part to the right of the one I have highlighted. So I may be wrong.

The floor pan appears to be straightforward...

Again, they appear to be NLA. So I am at a bit of a loss. I feel like the torsion bar mounts MUST be replaced with an OEM item. I don't trust myself to get it anywhere near correct if I attempt a hack job. But what about the floor pans? Do I really need OEM sheet metal or can a sheet of mild steel cut to the approx correct shape do the job? I assume the factory put all of those bumps and wiggles in the part for a reason and I fear a flat plate of steel would not properly do the job.

Oh yeah, I almost forgot. My Eastwood catalog sells a product called "structural epoxy" or something like that for afixing metal body panels.

http://www.eastwoodco.com/shopping/product/detailmain.jsp?itemID=1668&itemType=PRODUCT&iProductID=1668

And I have read that this approach is somehow "better" than welding and that Lotus is, for instance, using epoxy to assemble their cars these days. Is this for real or is it snake oil?

Shaun @ Tru6 · 05-13-2006, 06:54 AM

Janus, I'll call in a bit. Can you be in Watertown at 4 to go up to Georgetown today to look at the parts?

Floor pans are no problem... http://www.restoration-design.com/

If you order now, they may get here by July.