997 Turbo... What am I missing?

[Moses]

The other day a friend brought his new 997 turbo cabriolet over. He wanted me to drive it. I took the car out for a while by myself and had the opportunity to drive it pretty aggressively on some empty back roads.

I was a little worried about being seen it the thing. It is a guards red cab with 20" HRE deep dish wheels and a bright red console and red belts, red stitching on the seats and dash. You get the picture... It looks like it should belong to a 20 year old dot-com millionaire.

To put it simply, a 997 turbo is no longer my dream car. For a car with about 470 HP, it felt incredibly tame. The car weighs 3,700 pounds and it feels like it. Perhaps the Porsche "stability management" is what I can't get used to. I thought punching the throttle at 4,000 RPM in second gear would be a thrill. Not so much. Although handling is precise and stable, I felt very little connection to the road. Even the exhaust note seemed sedate. I kept thinking; Is this really a Porsche? I'm sure the car is wildly fast, it just doesn't feel like it.

I was feeling pretty low about my driving experience so the next day I took out my little SC. It has a '97 3.6 motor and a custom suspension put together by Tyson Schmidt when he worked at TRE. The car weighs 2,600 pounds.

I swear my little car feels faster than the 997. I know it's not, but it feels like it. I feel much more confident in a high speed turn because I can feel everything. Unlike the 997, these old cars talk to you. You get constant feedback. When I punch the throttle at 4,000 RPM in second gear the car leaps forward. I can feel the texture of the pavement and feel the rear tires grip when I press on the gas through a turn. Grinning from ear to ear, flying down the road with your hair on fire... that's what a Porsche is supposed to be.

I guess my dream car was sitting right there in my garage all the time.

[Rory Mckenna]

I hear ya.. but in a perfect world we could own the old car and a Newer one.. I'd saty with the 79 930 and a 997 GT3RS hahaha

[David]

I agree. I'd like to get a 996 or even 997, but it would be a DD and pretty much an appliance. The 930 would still be what I take to the track or out for fun runs even though a stock 996 would lap about as fast as my 930.

[Wayne 962]

Turbo car versus normally aspirated - big difference. You would probably feel different driving a GT3RS. I've driven a bunch of cars and the later-model turbo cars are fast, but they don't punch you in the back with low-end torque like the NA cars. I think you'd probably really like a GT3...

-Wayne

[oregonmon]

Good short story and a happy ending.

[mkossler]

Moses,

Here, here!

I expressed much the same sentiment in a recent thread, but sure didn't see a lot folks agreeing with me (could be I didn't do as good a job getting my point across as you did, Moses). You know, for me it's not just the power band - it's the whole package - steering input, seat-of-the-pants feedback, suspension feedback, the works. Power, I could definitely use more of .

By the way, the Zinc Metallic really makes the car anyway ...

I'd really like to try the GT3 as Wayne suggests and see if it still has that visceral feeling after all of the refinement. I'm thinking I'd pretty much have to be invalided or dead not to love that ride...

Cheers,

[Wayne 962]

That said, I do enjoy driving my '72 RS clone a bit more than the 959. Totally different experience, but the RS is just loud, rough and raw, whereas the 959 is more refined. Two different tastes, like red wine and white wine - you almost can't make a direct comparison...

-Wayne

[Wil Ferch]

I mention the same thing in one of these posts about driving a friend's X50 996 Turbo.

Fast, solid and stable ( AWD) , but weighty in a big-'ole Merecedes- Benz sort of way. Quiet too.

Altogether...not terribly impressed from a twisties driving experience standpoint, although when I checked the speedo on the back country roads I was driving, I almost crapped myself !

[Britwrench]

997 Turbo cab is knocking on 4,000 pounds, that makes a difference too.

[Moses]

Originally Posted by Wil Ferch

Fast, solid and stable ( AWD) , but weighty in a big-'ole Merecedes- Benz sort of way. Quiet too.

Exactly! My daily driver is a Mercedes E55. The 997 turbo feels a lot like the E55, fast and stable but NOT like a 911 should feel.

Originally Posted by Wayne at Pelican Parts

I think you'd probably really like a GT3...

-Wayne

My daughter plays soccer with a girl who's dad is a car nut. He's owned loads of exotics. He traded his 997 turbo in for a GT3RS. He loves the GT3. He has not yet offered to let me drive it, though.

[JeremyD]

The turbos are sure fast at the track. They can make an average driver look like Scott Dixon.

[rnln]

new car go fast but feel slow. Old car go slow but feel fast

[Les Paul]

I've seriously been thinking of selling both my Porsches to move up to the 997 Turbo. My wife will go for rides in the 356 but hasn't been in the 930 in 4 or 5 years. No air, pitiful heat, and all it wants to do is run like a striped ass ape. Should I just keep them forever?

[juicersr]

Felt the same way about the cayman s and 996tt i drove. I've got exactly the two 'slow' cars i want

[89911]

It comes down to what they do now a days to make cars so incredibly fast but also drivable by drivers of limited abilities. You are not going to find cars now like the Ferrari F40 that can switch ends in the blink of the eye if you do something dumb. The price you pay is your lack of abilities over the car and the sensations it returns to you. In the end, the new turbo will kill your best ever lap time in your older car and the guy driving will be not even taxed. When they make a car that isn't too overburdened by interfering driving aids (Carrera GT) many are wrecking them or labeling them way too dangerous for the general population.

[jwasbury]

Amen Moses.

The first porsche I drove was an '86 3.2 Targa. It was my step father's. He traded it for an '01 996 Cab. It was a step down IMHO. I got to drive a 996tt. It was deceptive as you say. Fast as hell, but in a clinical, boring kind of way.

I drove my '79 930 down to visit my cousin in DC a month back. He's got an '03 BMW M5. Nice car...400hp V8. We went for a ride in the 930 and I let him take a spell behind the wheel. He raved about the feedback through the steering wheel. He said maybe he would sell the M5 and buy an old turbo because its "more fun." When we got home, he told his wife he wanted a Porsche.

[1980 911 sc]

300 hp 2600lb road tuned car vs. 470 hp 3700lb car? 8.6 vs 7.8 lb/hp? not even looking at the torque curve or how well your car handles vs, that fat pig... I have a similar set up as you Moses (targa with chipped varioram) and would never trade it for a new one. my 2c...

[mjshira]

thanks for sharing. I am not surprised at your experience. Money has become the price of ownership not driving ability and passion as in the past (in my view).

[JV911SYDNEY]

Originally Posted by Les Paul

I've seriously been thinking of selling both my Porsches to move up to the 997 Turbo

dirve a GT3 first...in "standard" guise they are still civilised

Originally Posted by Wil Ferch

when I checked the speedo on the back country roads I was driving, I almost crapped myself !

Originally Posted by rnln

new car go fast but feel slow. Old car go slow but feel fast

bingo!

i've driven a few 996 & 7's on the street and on the track. seriously quick cars but so refined and quiet that you dont realise how fast you are going

for me cars are just toys, not daily drivers so i prefer a bit of a stiffer ride, louder exhaust etc like the 76 and GT3

[ZAMIRZ]

Moses, you drove the car in the worst environment. The turbo is not the best backroad stormer, it's more of a top-end highway bomber. If you get it out onto an empty stretch of open road with long, sweeping corners, it really shines. Furthermore, you drove the heaviest 911 Porsche makes, the coupe gives (and always has IMHO) a much better driving experience for the sporting enthusiast.

For those back roads and 2nd gear punches, try a GT3. Or next time you're in a turbo, get it out onto an empty highway and above 120mph. The poise and agility will blow you away.

Originally Posted by mjshira

thanks for sharing. I am not surprised at your experience. Money has become the price of ownership not driving ability and passion as in the past (in my view).

Money is always the price of ownership when cars new, including the time when ours were too. As the next latest/greatest model comes out, the older cars begin to either fall into various states of disarray or into passionate enthusiasts hands.