G50 v.s. 915 trans

[adeihl]

Hey guys,

I am on the hunt for my first porsche, and fould an 86 that i am in love with. Although the seller says it shifts fine, i wanted to know what all the hype was about the g50 trans? Is it really THAT much better then <87 cars?

Up side?
Down side?

THanks! as always,
Andrew

[asphaltgambler]

Definitely an improvement over the 915 in every way.

Except: It is a lot heavier (60-70lbs?) and consumes more horse power by @3 %.

Still I think the market bears better for the G50 equiped cars because there is less breakage, the trans shifts more like a modern trans and it will take some abuse.

[adeihl]

As i have been reading, you can swap trannys for a g50 correct?

[JonT]

Difficult to generalize here. Some 915's shift quite well and others not so well. With some upgrades $ ranging from a simple gateshift by Seine or Robotek around $150 to Wevo $500 + can make for a very nice shifting 915. You really have to look at the car as a whole--and get it inspected by a mechanic that knows Porsches. Take your time! which might be difficult since you're in love already...

[Zeke]

Originally posted by adeihl
As i have been reading, you can swap trannys for a g50 correct?

Not too easily. The G50 cars have a differnent torsion tube and rear t-bars (shorter) which allow the beast to fit up in there. The easiest way to install a G 50 in an earlier model is to convert the rear suspension to coilovers and cut the tube out in the center to make room.

[Drago]

Originally posted by adeihl
As i have been reading, you can swap trannys for a g50 correct?

Not ea$ily.

[adeihl]

I know what you mean when you say take your time. I actually alsmost dove into a car for 12k to find out that the new owner just blew the engine only 1k miles after owning it!


This is a pic of the car in question

c2 conversion sunroof 86 ( with no heat ..wtf?)

[the]

I've owned both.

I think when both cars were new, there wasn't a huge difference in shifting. Some difference (G50 is better), but not huge.

But the cars aren't new anymore.

On a 15+ year old car, the G50 has an inherent advantage because it is less "fussy," less things to adjust and go wrong. It has a hydraulic clutch, which is always in adjustment. The 915 has a slightly Goldbergesque cable shifter, with helper springs, etc. that is almost never in completely perfect shape and adjustment. I bet on 50% of 915 911s on the road, it is way out of adjustment, or has a worn cable or other parts, etc.

You add that to a midadjusted shift linkage, worn synchros, etc. and you have a lot of really bad shifting 915s out there.

A freshly built 915 with all new clutch, cable, and linkage parts, all properly set up, is a very decent shifting car. But you won't find many like that.

But you will find that most G50 911s currently on the road do shift very nicely, both because they simply are newer and because of the reasons above.

[Por_sha911]

Drive a G50 and see!

[dean]

Originally posted by asphaltgambler
Except: It is a lot heavier (60-70lbs?) and consumes more horse power by @3 %.

Wrong, the G50 is exactly 20 lbs heavier. And where did you get the info on the loss.

[DARISC]

I'm a relative newbie having owned my 82 SC RoW for about a year and a half, and I really disliked / didn't bond well with my 915 until I put a few miles on it and read up on it, and the G50 trans as well. My previous car was a 99 Vette musclecar hardtop that could be snapshifted pedal to the metal, so I had to adjust my attitude.

I was originally shopping for a Carrera then learned that the SC was lighter, its engine commonly described as bullet proof and that it was generally more raw and visceral with fewer creature comforts and a less refined feel than the Carrera, which is my personal preference for a fun street car daily driver that I don't race (but relish that it feels ready for the track!).

Most enlightening to me were two lengthy conversations I had with Hayden (WEVO) wherein he graciously took the time to answer my newbie questions, the answers to which may be of interest to you regarding the differences between the 915 and G50 as I understand from those conversations (advance apologies to Hayden if I've misunderstood).

1) 915 is lighter. weaker, less expensive to rebuild than G50

2) G50 is heavier, stronger, more expensive to rebuild than 915

3) 915 has "vague" ungated feel until muscle memory takes over
and this becomes a non factor (unless tracked, in which case
the G50's gate can help prevent expensive mis-shifts in the
heat of competition, I've read).

4) G50 has a more contemporary feel with positive gates
between gears, allowing a more relaxed (!) shifting technique.

5) 915 requires more than casual attention to shift properly (a oneness with the machine, to wax Zen like).

6) regarding 3) & 4), above, Hayden told me that neither trans shifts quicker than the other and that his gate kit for the 915 is desired by many for the feel, but does not enable the trans to shift quicker than stock, and that the 915 shifts as quickly as a G50.

Given all the above, Hayden agreed that if I can find the gears in my stock 915, his shifter kit is really just very nice icing on the cake which makes shifting a 915 more pleasurable to some and is a high quality upgrade if missed shifts are a concern.

I've grown to thoroughly enjoy the challenges (now second nature) of my 915 and being a proponent of light weight and a feeling of direct mechanical connection to the car, I'm quite happy with my 915.

Hope this helps.

[MRM]

Get one with a 915. If mere mortals were supposed to be able to shift 911s consistently without grinding the gears and wearing out the 1-2 synchros, the good Doctor would have designed the G-50 and installed it in 1965 when the 911 was born.

Don't believe the rest of the people on this board. Most think that real Porsches ended with the last of the air cooled engines. Others argue that the 89 Carrera, the last of the orginal platform, is the line that divides real Porsche 911s from modern pretenders that are currently being foisted on unsuspecting yuppies who are looking for the most fashionable cup holders to transport their double no fat mocha lattes from the golf course to the kids' soccer match.

But no, we 915 drivers know that 86 was the last year of the true Porsche and the last of the real 911s. Once it became easy to shift and tranny rebuilds were no longer included as routine maintenence, the 911 lost what it was and became something else.

So, the question is, do you want a real, true Porsche 911, or do you want some modern car that any fool can shift without wincing and counting the days and dollars till he has to break down and rebuild the tranny every time he shifts from first to second at more than 3500 RPM?

Be a man. Spare no synchro. Learn to double clutch, how to shift without engaging the synchros to spare wear and tear on the tranny and memorize UPS shipping cost from your zip code to Gary Fairbanks.

Live dangerously. Get a 915 Carrera.

[adeihl]

Originally posted by MRM
Get one with a 915. If mere mortals were supposed to be able to shift 911s consistently without grinding the gears and wearing out the 1-2 synchros, the good Doctor would have designed the G-50 and installed it in 1965 when the 911 was born.

Don't believe the rest of the people on this board. Most think that real Porsches ended with the last of the air cooled engines. Others argue that the 89 Carrera, the last of the orginal platform, is the line that divides real Porsche 911s from modern pretenders that are currently being foisted on unsuspecting yuppies who are looking for the most fashionable cup holders to transport their double no fat mocha lattes from the golf course to the kids' soccer match.

But no, we 915 drivers know that 86 was the last year of the true Porsche and the last of the real 911s. Once it became easy to shift and tranny rebuilds were no longer included as routine maintenence, the 911 lost what it was and became something else.

So, the question is, do you want a real, true Porsche 911, or do you want some modern car that any fool can shift without wincing and counting the days and dollars till he has to break down and rebuild the tranny every time he shifts from first to second at more than 3500 RPM?

Be a man. Spare no synchro. Learn to double clutch, how to shift without engaging the synchros to spare wear and tear on the tranny and memorize UPS shipping cost from your zip code to Gary Fairbanks.

Live dangerously. Get a 915 Carrera.

a single tear just rolled down my cheak. I'm sold on the 915.

Andrew

[JeremyD]

Go to uhaul and get one of their manual transmission 24 foot box trucks - drive it around for the afternoon.

That's the best way to simulate a 20 year old 915 tranny.

[Gordo2]

Originally posted by JeremyD
Go to uhaul and get one of their manual transmission 24 foot box trucks - drive it around for the afternoon.

That's the best way to simulate a 20 year old 915 tranny.

Add a short shifter to the box truck, then we have something worth comparing.

[Joe Bob]

G-50s don't break as easy as a 915....

[algs911]

I've got to chime in here. I have an '86 coupe, the last of the 915s. My tranny shifts VERY well and even goes in to first when rolling. I've been autocrossing the car for two years now without a hitch.

The 1-2 and 3-4 planes are totally sloppy, but I installed a WEVO shift kit in it (not a short shift) and it's GREAT! Well worth the money. A very good Porsche mechanic in my area got in my car and asked "what year is this?" He said it was the best shifting 915 he'd ever shifted.

I like the less weight (esp. out back). So, I'm VERY happy with my car and the 915 and would not trade it for a G50 car.

Al

[hytem]

The SC transmission takes some time getting used to--you really have to watch your synchros and shift deliberately and smoothly. And keep your mind on what you are doing. Downshifting from 5th to 3rd is easier than 5th to 4th. That seems to be well known. The best trannies I've driven are BMWs. The transmission and the too-common oil leaks are probably the weakest mechanical links in the SC. The handling is superb--about the best I've experienced.

[rteague]

As long as YOU drive the 915 it's cool. Look out for the smog guy, car wash, wife, son, daughter, and the ultimate 915 killer the valet. I have almost quit missing gears after 5k miles. Don't grind into 1st anymore.

[M491driver]

I've got both 915 and a G-50. I like both but its the clutch in my G-50 that I've fallen in love with.