engine repairs - to drop or not to drop
 

I finally have a good garage to work on the 911 and fix a number of pesky issues. The main problem with the engine is oil leaks (a small puddle of oil each time, mainly from one oil return tube). Other issues I want to address are:

1. install chain tensioner guards and replacing other c.t. components if necessary;

2. replace all vacuum hoses;

3. paint the engine tin;

4. clean the oil off left heat exchanger and generally clean up of the engine;

5. fix the heater boxes (new springs, grease);

6. check the condition of the head studs; and

5. remove engine sound pad glue and installing a new pad; and


The car runs great besides the major oil leak and I am really reluctant to start messing with a well running car. What scares me is that:

(a) I don't have a huge amount of spare time (demanding career and woman but no kids);
(b) limited engine knowledge and medium mechanical skill (not a dufus but I'm not Milt/Zeke either, regularly change oil and bleed brakes, rebuilt pedal cluster but struggled with carb adjustment);
(c) somewhat limited funds (I have the funds but saving and I want to do this for $1K or less); and
(d) I have limited tools (simple jack, jack stands, no Porsche specialty tools).

The good is that I have good friends who have more tools and more car knowledge and skill (mainly not Porsche knowledge but hopefully some of the Toronto Pelicans would help out for beer wages). Still it would be more clearcut if Milt were to move to Toronto. I don't really NEED to fix anything besides the oil return tubes and check the head studs. Hopefully no other work is required but who knows as I could have 5 snapped studs. I probably would just buy a new engine if that was the case.

I only use this car as a fun summer car but I do push her. No DEs, no autoX, no track time. Both her and I aren't up to it yet (suspension and brakes would need an overhaul for that). The leakdown on purchase two years ago indicated approx. 10% leakdown across all cylinders (which is adequate), good compression and the car pulls extremely nicely. I really like the car and I am not looking to do major upgrades.

So after all that, is the consensus that I should I pull my engine?

Is it that much easier to replace vacuum hoses, fix oil leaks, check head studs, install c.t. guards with the engine pulled?

Can I do the above for under $1K including the cost of tools? (I already have a lot of the parts including the guards, the return tubes, the vacuum hoses)

Any Toronto Pelicans willing to help and have the proper jacks and/or tools that they are willing to lend?

A few photos (I have since pulled the AC condensor):

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1163523963.jpg http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1163523972.jpg http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1163523991.jpg

You don't have to worry about the head studs on a 2.4.

Yes, most of the jobs you listed are easiest with the engine out ... especially painting the engine sheet metal and replacing the sound pad! I suggest an ATV jack for elevating the engine [while out] to a comfortable woking height.

I think I would pull the valve covers, check the headstuds (adjust valves? not on your list), and do a leakdown test now, to compare it to the prior test. If it passes, no need to drop the engine.

To answer your question: almost every job is easier with the engine out, but is it worth the time and aggravation to pull it?

Depends on your work setup, how soon you need the car driveable, etc.

If you won't be driving it in the winter and you have suitable equipment to get the car high enough to get the engine out from under and the idea of pulling it is intriguing to you, then go for it. If not, then don't.

Pulling the engine does give you a much better opporunity to generally inspect the engine, spot problem areas, and replace things that are marginal however.

In regards to what you're envisioning doing, unless you meet with some unforeseen disaster, you should not be spending more than your budget. Good luck,

ianc

Nice looking car!

1. install chain tensioner guards and replacing other c.t. components if necessary; DO YOU MEAN HYDR. CHAIN TENSIONERS?

2. replace all vacuum hoses; GOOD

3. paint the engine tin; HARD TO DO WITHOUT REMOVING THE TIN

4. clean the oil off left heat exchanger and generally clean up of the engine; O.K.

5. fix the heater boxes (new springs, grease); DO YOU MEAN FLAPPER BOXES (DIVERTER VALVES)?

6. check the condition of the head studs; O.K. USE A CALIBRATED TORQUE WRENCH AND SET BELOW REQUIRED TORQUE ~20 FT-LBS

5. remove engine sound pad glue and installing a new pad; VERY HARD WITH ENGINE IN PLACE.

TRY A PARTIAL DROP, NOT HARD TO DO.

It's really easy to drop the engine on these cars, the biggest issues are: (1) Having the proper tools, (2) space and (3) time.

For (3), it doesn't take a lot of time to drop the engine, once you have all the tools ready to go, even a newbie would get the engine out in half an afternoon. But once the engine is out, the car likely will be down for a bit while you do all the "while you are in there" things that tend to crop up when an engine is removed from an old car.

For (1), in addition to having all of the jacks, jackstands, wrenches, etc. to get the job safely done, it is REALLY nice to have an engine stand with the proper yoke to mount the engine up. Very nice to work on when you can wheel it around, rotate it, etc.

But, removing the engine from these cars is very simple. I think most first timers are surprised at how easy it is. Esp. on the earlier cars, there is very little actually tethering your engine to the chassis.

But for the tasks that you have listed, removing the engine definately isn't necessary - as Gunther suggests, all of that could easily be done with a partial engine drop (or no drop at all, even).

But you won't get everything as clean as you would if you had the engine out of the car.

Thanks for the advice guys.

To keep within budget, I plan on installing the guards on the existing tensioners and not upgrading to hydraulic tensioners. The guards supposedly prevent a complete disaster in the event of failure but still let you that you have a serious problem.

Yes, I meant the flapper boxes....

I do not plan on driving the car again at least until April-May. That said, I would like to be able to drive the car come April-May. It is also darn cold in Toronto in the winter and my garage is not insulated (yet) or half as nice as most of the garages posted on PP (no checkerboard flooring yet).

For now, I think I am going to follow dad911's original advice and pull the valve covers to see what I am dealing with. If I have time this winter, I really would like to pull the engine and do a major cleanup but it seems like inviting trouble especially when the car is running well....

EDITED

Update: All of the lower head studs are present and are tight. I didn't torque them down, just made sure they were tight and secure.

I am pretty sure that I want to drop the engine anyways. It goes against my cardinal rule of 'if it isn't broken, don't fix it' but as it is a summer only car, I don't want to leave repairs until the spring when I could actually be driving the car. Plus, while she does run really strong, there are A LOT of fixes I want to do (including removing the heat exchangers and muffler for paint/repair).

Do a "partial engine drop" and it will be easy to get to everything you need access to and it's fast and easy. Use the 101 Projects book to get step-by-step instructions. I did this a few years ago and it was easy!

I think it's easier to replace the oil return tubes with the engine in the car. Pull the HX's to clean them off. I use engine degreaser and a green weenie. While they're off, replace the oil return tubes.

Put it all back together then drop the engine for the rest of your list.

I have determined that there is nothing easy on anything to do a porsche. If its loose its suppose to be tight, if its tight its supposed to be loose. If you have anything square it will soon be round and anything sticking out will soon be broken off flush. Knowing all this buy your friends soom refreshments and drop the engine. It is really way to easy to take the engine out and soon you are sliding down that slippery slope that eventually gets us all.

I'll go with the engine drop camp. It's really pretty simple, and you'd be surprised at the little things you find wrong while you
are cleaning and degreasing.
Also, a good chance to look over the clutch and flywheel so they don't rob you of driving time during the summer. Have fun!