what to do with 1969 911e targa?

[mattdlmn]

Hi there folks, my name's Matt from SLC UT. I'm on here trying to get some advice on what to do with an old car of my fathers. It's a 1969 911E targa.
The story is that the car was wrecked into the Great Salt Lake in about '85, and a friend of my Dads actually died in the wreck, so at the time my Dad gave the car up to a junkyard because he wanted nothing to do with the car anymore as you could imagine.
Well to get to the point, the car was recently towed out of a nearby city here in the valley, and the title was never changed so we got a letter saying we could claim the car from this tow-yard. I went and looked at the car and the engine is gone, but there are many panels that are salvageable, it also still has three of the original fuches wheels. My father is debating whether he wants to pay a $300 storage fee to get the car back. My only question is would it be worth getting back. I tell my dad that he's crazy not to with the value in all the parts still there, but does anyone out there have any good advice for me, or even any interest in the car as a parts car?

[MrBMW2002]

Check your PM or email me at MrBMW2002@aol.com

[fierochris]

i could use some early 911 parts. I need a decent drivers side fender, and some other small things as well.

[jkarolyi]

Original fuchs from that year would sell for around $4-500 apiece if they are genuine '69 6" fuchs wheels. If the car has a soft rear window, the parts from that are worth quite a lot. So yes, pay the storage fee.

That said, seeing and working around a car that a good friend died in...seeing blood on the interior, etc. would be rough on your father. Maybe you could talk him into letting you get it and parting it out. If it were me I wouldn't want to see that car again either.

[matt13421342]

Originally posted by jkarolyi
Original fuchs from that year would sell for around $4-500 apiece if they are genuine '69 6" fuchs wheels.

????huh??? Those Fuchs aren't worth that in restored condition. After sitting in a junk yard for 15 years not even half that.

Don't get me wrong, it's still worth pulling out of there for a cheap $300 storage, but if you start getting numbers like that in your head you'll have a rude awakening. There's a guy who has been trying to sell an entire rear clip from a soft window for a very reasonable price and he is still sitting on it.

I'd rescue it, if for no other reason than to save it from the crusher and the fact that its parts can give life to so many other P-cars!

[EarlyPorsche]

Don't be fooled, those wheels are not worth anywhere near what you were quoted, that was a foolish estimate. However, the vehicle on the whole is worth $300. The panels will only be worth selling locally but the little pieces that are all over that car other than the engine are all valuable. Buy it back.

[jkarolyi]

Just sold an unrestored set of three for $1200. Deep sixes with the hearts bring big money nowadays, you old geezers. This aint the '90s anymore. Do some research in the classifieds or on ebay before calling me foolish. And I'll buy all the '69 deep sixes with hearts in restorable condition you can find for $200 each and pay you a $50 finders fee.

[matt13421342]

I think adding the specifics of deep sixes with hearts in restorable condition means there is an 80% chance that it doesn't apply to this guy's wheels. But $500 per wheel is absurd even if it's the sunniest day on ebay. The only wheel I've seen go for close to that in unrestored condition would be a 15x5.5 or a 16x9. I think we would all buy deep sixes with hearts in restorable condition for $200 each, but I think you're comparing apples to oranges.

-- Matt, age 34

[jkarolyi]

Note in my original post: "if they are genuine '69 6" fuchs wheels". I'll stand by my original price estimate based on my personal experiences.

[competentone]

The deep six Fuchs have been going up in price -- at least from what I've seen. I'm not sure what the exact prices would be -- since their condition is not known, but if they are original deep six Fuchs in OK condition, it is well worth paying the $300 to recover the car.

As for the emotional issues associated with the car, your father will have to make his own decisions on that -- I would say, though, that after 21 years it would generally be considered "psychologically healthy" to be able to deal with the car in a "dispassionate" manner.

If he doesn't like the idea of "making money" on the car (I don't know the details of the accident; maybe he was the driver and feels some level of guilt about the accident?) he could always part the car out and donate the profits to a charity.

If he does nothing about the car, someone else is going to make money on it -- right now, if he chooses, he can see that what value is left in the car can go to a good cause. (That cause could be his son too!)

[911roman]

I'd be interested in those front fenders if they are in good shape - i.e. little or no rust and are straight with no dings.

rough situation for your dad though. I agree with everyone, take the project on yourself and maybe donate a portion of the sales to your dad's friend's family as a gift. This might help your dad feel better about it.

[Rouxzy]

Not all 6" Fuchs from '69 are deep dishes. I presently am trying to sell one that is a '69 and one that is a '70 for $250.00 and have had no offers.
Tom

[dcautomotive]

you think $500 for hearts is too much? we had 5 of them, and they sold for $700 EACH, they were pretty nice though.

Its a worldwide market and the us currency is on sale

rob

[matt13421342]

Originally posted by dcautomotive
you think $500 for hearts is too much? we had 5 of them, and they sold for $700 EACH, they were pretty nice though.

Its a worldwide market and the us currency is on sale

rob

[jkarolyi]

>Not all 6" Fuchs from '69 are deep dishes. I presently am trying to sell one that is a '69 and one that is a '70 for $250.00 and have had no offers.

Actually, all '69 (and '70 for that matter) produced 6" Fuchs wheels are known as "deep sixes". They don't really look deep dish like the 7" wheels, but look more so than the '71-up Fuchs produced 15x6s known as the "flat six". The late '68 and '69 date stamped 15" Fuchs are especially valuable due to the "heart" shaped opening by the valve stem.

They did make a 5.5x14" Fuchs as well during those years for the 911E/Comfort package, and these aren't worth much. If you have 15" wheels with those date stamps, you have deep sixes, and I'll gladly pay $250 for them. Take a few pics and PM me.

Matt, are you seriously rolling your eyes at DCAutomotive? They are a big time Porsche dismantler and they know what they're talking about. I think you just got schooled, take it like a man.

[matt13421342]

Originally posted by jkarolyi

Matt, are you seriously rolling your eyes at DCAutomotive? They are a big time Porsche dismantler and they know what they're talking about. I think you just got schooled, take it like a man.

Actually, I think the problem with all of this "schooling" that's going on is the lack of a firm grasp on reality. Hear me out and you'll see what I'm saying. I have sold a lot of very rare Porsche cars and parts so believe me, I am speaking from experience.

While I find it a little hard to believe, it may be fact that DCAutomotive sold some Deep Six wheels for $700 each. If you had an absolutely immaculate, date-matched set of wheels, a buyer who was not concerned with price, the benefit of a lousy dollar/euro exchange, and the planets were aligned in your favor, you might be able to get that much. The problem lies in the fact that people are using these prices as a benchmark for general values! I've sold two sets of deep sixes in the past 6 months. One set was average and had black painted centers, these sold for $1200. The other set was in very nice condition with no blemishes and almost no wear on the inset. They were in the correct original finish with matching dates. Very nice set. These sold for just over $1600. If I held out for the right guy, I might have been able to get a little more. The point is that this was the nicest set I have seen for some time that had not been completely restored, and you would be very hard pressed to break the $2000 barrier. So to suggest that all deep six Fuchs are worth $500 each as in the original post is quite misleading.

Another example of the same phenomenon. I recently unearthed a very early Speedster, it was Speedster #243, the 243rd car of regular production ever. It was in horrific condition really, but it was still in one piece. At auction this car sold to a German restorer for $63,000 but you cannot use this as a benchmark price for a rusty Speedster shell. The same car but with a build date of 1956 would fetch less than $30,000. This being the case, if I were to tell a fellow Pelicanite that his recently unearthed Speedster was worth $60,000 "because I sold one for that once," I would be doing him a disservice.

One more example for the books. A couple of years ago I found a 1951 356 coupe. It was missing lots of very hard to find pre-A parts -- things like the wooden door panel trim pieces and bumpers. But since it was such an early car, a collector in Holland bought it for $17,000. Again, if I were to tell somebody that I sold an incomplete pre-A coupe with rust for $17k I would be grossly misleading them since 99% of pre-A coupes in that condition would be worth in the neighborhood of $10,000.

I understand that we all want to think that our cars are worth lots and lots of money, and in almost all cases they are! But we seem to always want to creep the value up by little increments until people are quoting prices to others which are very unrealistic in a practical arena. This is the only reason I argue these cases. I've seen people buy cars or parts based on the lore of the moment only to realize they grossly overpaid or worse, as can be the case if somebody decides to do a little investing on the side only to discover they are actually upside down.

All told, the discourse is beneficial to all, and I'm glad we have this forum to mount our disagreements! Believe me, I will always admit I'm wrong and have no problem taking it like a man when I need to. But in this case I am sticking to my guns based on what I feel is a good amount of personal experience.

[matt13421342]

Just for some visual candy, here is the '51 we pulled out of the woods with a blue '58 ex-racer visible in the corner of the shot.