rusty front pan
 

Do you have to remove the gas tank to weld in a new front pan? If so, how do you remove the tank. Does it come out with bolts or is there sheet metal cutting involved? I'm contemplating my first 911 purchase. It's a 1968 model. When I first saw the suspension rusting apart I walked away from it; after reading several posts I found out that this is a common problem with the older models. I'm now rethinking my decision. TIA

Yes, you must remove the gas tank to replace the "suspension pan". Removing the tank is an easy matter as it is bolted in placed with hold down clips. This is also a foam gasket that goes with it. Actually I had to replace the same peice of metal on my '72 but had it down by a very competent mechanic. Cost was about $1,200 including the needed parts. Note that I think he under estimated it and it may be more expensive. I watched the entire process and it involves a lot of cutting and welding. But done correctly the car (and driver) will never know the difference.

Try check out the tech articles in this month's issue of European Car. There's a article about welding in a new suspension pan on a (I think) '68 912, which I believe is pretty much the same from a 911. It doesn't seem too difficult, but to me $1200 seems kinda high, although it is a very important part of your suspension. If you're competent enough, do it yourself. If you have any doubts, I'd find someone who is a pro. I too have to do the same; am debating what do to also. Good luck.

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Jeff
1976 911S

I had the front suspension pan done by a porsche mechanic in Long Island, NY.It cost about $1,400 but that was long island prices!. It was on an 86 Carrera (Battery acid damage)
I seem to be plagued with expensive mechanics!
86ragtop

probably gonna get a lot of flak for this
but... you can fix it yourself without too
much welding, pull the tank, if badly rusted
put a cut out area and put a sheel metal patch, pop rivetor tack weld, ant smaller
areas of cancer you can put some wire mesh and
fill with a product called bondo hair.. this
stuff is tough!! drop a small glob on your concrete and try to remove the next day. if area around tank is rotted as to not be able to properly attach tank by all the brackets
do as many as possible then apply expanding foam. the tank will be solid. if while putting pressure on susp/front you don't think it is sound enough, add some L or angle
iron along beam or beams going toward front.
i know this isn't the proper way but i really didn't know you could buy front pans at the time. obviously more enthusiasm than brains.
It is also surprising the porsche tools that can be made with torch braze, or even just a vice!! for some of us it is the only way we can afford a porsche. bruce, fleet white
1970 911E. 1500.00 car up until the motor
that i am taking to macine shop tomorrow..

I'm getting ready to tackle this project now on my 72 911E. Wasn't sure where I was going to get the front suspension pan and gas tank support until I saw a posting (Jack was that you?) about Doc & Cy's Porsche Restoration Parts (www.docncys.com) They have a great website with exploded views of the various components of the car. Looked like they had a great price on the parts so gave them a call. Ended up talking to Robert for 20 minutes. Before I even talked about ordering any parts he had taken me step by step thru what I needed to do to replace the pan! Great guy and of course I purchased the parts from them. His advice on how to do it is as follows: First I only needed the short front pan, not the complete pan. Remove battery!!!!! Jack up the front of car and place on jack stands. Remove front wheels Take out bolts holding front of torsion bar housing to suspension pan. Remove gas tank. Drill out spot welds on gas tank support and remove support. Drill out spot welds holding front of pan. Cut the suspension pan as close as you can to the seam welds on the sides without cutting into the seams. Using new pan mark where you need to cut out rest of pan leaving enough for an overlap or butt weld depending on your welding expertise. Using a grinder grind out remaining part of pan on sides where welded. Drop pan into place. Line up using torsion bar brackets. Using vice grips or other fastener, clamp pan into place. Using a MIG welder, weld pan. Weld in new gas tank support. Using new gas tank seal reinstall gas tank.

I just finished doing the same project only my car war rusted from front to back. I bought the pan, tank support and floor pans from Restoration design (good stuff) and replaced the floor completely. The area around my suspension pan was rusted beyond the area covered by the new part, so rather than use it, I bought a wrecked but unrusted body and cut the entire areas I needed as one piece with a measured overlap (about an inch). After carefull alignment I mig welded everything in place, inside and outside. It's very strong and You'd have to be an expert to spot it. I also cut the entire back seat out of my donor and welded it in too. You can't buy that piece anywhere. Now my body shell is tight complete and rust free. I tried the method they show in the European Car Magazine- drilling the welds and separating the seams, but it was HARD to do. I ended up sharpening a wood chisel and surgically cutting the metal that way. It's quite easy. Much easier than a torch or saw.I'm helping my buddy do the pan on his 68 now. Please email me if you have any questions.
Alex 70 911T-GT

Just a hint:

If you want to drill out welding spots, purchase a special drill! They are usually sold at body shops and make life much more easy.

Thank god I still have no need to do it on my baby http://www.pelicanparts.com/ultimate/smile.gif http://www.pelicanparts.com/ultimate/smile.gif http://www.pelicanparts.com/ultimate/smile.gif

Jens

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Hey Rufblackbird, which month's issue of European Car Magazine had the suspension pan article? I went to the bookstore yesterday to pick it up, but it looks like a newer issue is on the shelf now. I would like to order a back-issue because I'm planning this job myself if Santa leaves a MIG welder under the tree.
Thanks Brad

Follow up to my previous posting. 6 days after I talked to Robert at Doc & Cy's my front pan and gas tank support arrived, well packed and appearing to be of excellent quality. I've been waiting on them before I cut out the old parts. Whoo Hoo! I know what I will be doing tonight.

Kurt V
72 911E

Kurt, do you have a digital camera? I'd love to see some pictures of your project underway. Good luck and keep us posted!
Brad

The front pan is not being replaced in my car, but if you would like some good pics of what all this looks like in bare metal to get a better idea, check out my site.
go into the "Project Car" area and poke around in the reassembly stage.

-d

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Dave
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http://members.nbci.com/dtwinters/garage/

Update on my front suspension pan replacement for all who are interested. Got down in the garage last night around 7 p.m. A couple of weeks ago I had drained and removed the gas tank, so I was ready to start cutting! First the gas tank support has to come out. I placed the new support over the old one to make sure I would have a good fit and got the right part. Appears to be a good match. I took a marker and marked where the edges of the support mated up to the rest of the body so when I went to weld in the new support I would have a reference point. Now the hard part. Both the support and the suspension pan have what appeared to be undercoating sprayed on them. I got out the heat gun and a putty knife and went to work on removing this stuff from where the spot welds on the edges should be. Not sure if this coating is from the factory or not. It is black but as I dig down I see what appears to be the factory yellow color of the rest of the car. Gunk removed and now to try and drill the spot welds out. Damn but that was hard work!!! Some of the spot welds drilled out easily, but my drill wouldn't even cut into some of them. Ended up having to use my 4 1/2 inch angle grinder and a cutting wheel to get through some of them. I would cut/grind/drill 3 of the welds then use a chisel and pry bar to pop loose the edge I was working on. After 3 hours of work I finally was able to get the support out and could more closely inspect the suspension pan. More rust than I thought, but still within the areas I thought I would have to cut out anyway. Well that is all for tonight. Brad, I don't have a digital camera, but I am taking pictures as I go along. Used the last of a roll last night. Will try to get them developed ASAP and post some here. Now for two questions. The pan and support came painted in a green, semi-gloss paint. What I am thinking of doing is painting them with black Rustoleum and then instead of using undercoat, using spray on truck bed liner leaving the outer 1-2 inches bare metal until after I weld the parts in then spray painting and coating those edges. Any thoughts on this? Next question, where can I buy POR-15? (is that the right nomenclature?)

Kurt V
72 911E