another bolt problem....wallowed-out pressure plate bolts

[cubby911T]

I swear, I am king of the bolt problems. This time I've got myself 2 wallowed out pressure plate bolts. I discovered a bit too late that it is best to loosen these 9 bolts a little at a time so as to equalize the pressure all the way around. Wayne's book did not mention this, but I read it here on the forum. Anyway, after the hex key stripped out, I tried my now trusty left-handed extractor which actually worked great on two other messed up pressure plate bolts. Not on these two, though, as the extractor stripped-out too. You can see what I'm left with in the following pics:






I have re-installed several of the other bolts to equalize the pressure, but I can't get a good enough bite on these two with my vise grips. What are my options at this point? Weld on a nut? Bigger vise grips? (I'm trying 8" vise grips right now).

[my1st911]

I havent had this problem before, but i cant believe that vice grips that are put on super tight cant get them out. I hate allen bolts. I dont understand the reason they are used by the germans so much. Give me a regular bolt anyday. Another idea is to cut the head off, and when pressure plate is off unscrew the rest of the bolt out. Should be enough meat left to do so

[dentist90]

Originally Posted by my1st911

I hate allen bolts. I dont understand the reason they are used by the germans so much.

Clearance. You can get these barrel nuts and allen-head bolts into more confined spaces as you don't have to get a socket around them.

My first plan of attack would be to re-bolt the pressure plate down with nicely lubed bolts (with good heads on them) to remove any pressure from the stripped bolt(s). Then try to get the bad ones out first. Even a little warping of the pressure plate will put significant load on your remaining bolts.
If that fails, try to get a Dremel in there and grind two sides flat so that you might get a good purchase with a conventional wrench. Won't matter if you nick the pressure plate as I'm sure you're gonna replace it. If you can't bust it that way, just cut it off and then remove the remaining bolt from the flywheel. It should be much easier with the tension of the pressure plate off.

[RWebb]

next time use an Allen socket and drive it home - tightly into the recess of the wrenching fixture

don't use an Allen key


Things could be worse...

[cubby911T]

Originally Posted by RWebb

next time use an Allen socket and drive it home - tightly into the recess of the wrenching fixture

I actually did use an allen socket, but maybe I didn't drive it in far enough.

Thanks for the suggestions guys. Good to know I have some options.

[euro911sc]

+1 on grinding the sides flat to use your adjustable metric cresent wrench

-m

[billybek]

Or cut a slot in it and use a big flat screwdriver to back it out.
Make sure it fits tight. You can wrench the screwdriver if you have to.
I hope this doesn't turn into a 4 page ordeal!!

[PCA7GGR]

air chisel?

[cubby911T]

Originally Posted by billybek

Or cut a slot in it and use a big flat screwdriver to back it out.
Make sure it fits tight. You can wrench the screwdriver if you have to.
I hope this doesn't turn into a 4 page ordeal!!

LOL, same here billybek! Hey, but I like the screwdriver and air chisel ideas!

[Superman]

Allen heads make an excellent fastener. But.....you have to clean the socket first and make sure the tool is fully seated in there before you apply force. Dude.......you need to be more careful.

I'd use my BFCL (huge channel-locks) if the vise grip didn't work. Then I would consider drilling.....or grinding the head off. And dude.......at this point you need to be even more careful than you should have been before. Do not remove material from the ring gear. Those parts sometimes spin faster than 100 revolutions per second. Removing material will unbalance the assembly.

[JeremyD]

Big pair of vice grips - as tight as you can make them.

Next time - tap the allen socket in with a hammer before loosening. You drinking and wrenching?

[RWebb]

throw that Allen socket away or get the Snap Off man to replace it.

only use SnapOn, Hazet, Stahlwille, Mac or other top quality Allen sockets

clean the recess out before using - tap the bolt; use Kroil, etc.

[RWebb]

throw that Allen socket away or get the Snap Off man to replace it.

only use SnapOn, Hazet, Stahlwille, Mac or other top quality Allen sockets

clean the recess out before using - tap the bolt; use Kroil, etc.

[billybek]

I am thinking no news is good news!

[cubby911T]

Billy (and company),

Sorry for the delayed update guys....got busy with other stuff for a couple of nights there. Well, we got 'er done! The winning formula turned out to be:

Dremel + "chisel" style impact socket

My Dremel is turning out to be a real life saver. Before I started this project, I probably only used that thing once or twice in three years and didn't think much of it. I'm a fan now though! The Dremel cut-off disc did a nice job of cutting a clean, wide slot in the bolt heads. After cutting the slots I first tried to use a big a$$ flathead screwdriver.....not a chance, way too tight. So I had to widen the slots a bit more to accommodate a large flathead impact socket from my Dad's old toolbox. Never thought I'd have an occasion to use that thing, but it was just what the doctor ordered. I guess this is what PCA7GGR meant by an "air chisel" ?? It looks like a chisel anyway.

It took some patience with the impact wrench, as the socket kept wanting to pop out of the slot....but eventually both bolts surrendered. I had put several other bolts back in to relieve pressure from the stripped bolts, so this time I loosened everything a little at a time to keep the pressure equalized. I could feel the springs releasing a little at a time with each progressive "lefty loosey" around the ring.

Thanks for the advice (again) you guys! Oh, and RWebb - I'll be keeping my Harbor Freight allen sockets . As you can see from my signature line, JW has already tried to dissuade me from cheap tools, but they work fine for me most of the time. The problem is more with the guy behind the tools....but I'm learning!!

Here are some pictures of my steps to victory. I included a shot of the clutch disc as well. It looks to me like the clutch is pretty well used up, is that correct? The rivet seems pretty close to the surface to my eye.

[cubby911T]

Oh, one more picture and a couple of questions. I got my flywheel off today with no issues, if you can believe it . Here is the flywheel/crankshaft seal before I did any cleaning at all. Looks pretty darn good to me.....I think the little streak under it is from my Liquid Wrench on the flywheel bolts. Otherwise, no apparent leaking. I'm inclined to NOT mess with it. Knowing my luck, if I try to replace it I might open up another big can of worms. What do you all think?

The other decision I need to make it whether to use the newer clutch disc from my old 2.7 engine or buy a brand new one. I haven't pulled the clutch off the 2.7 yet, but I expect it will be in pretty good shape. I have documentation from the PO that there are only about 5k miles on that clutch. Can anyone say how much value would be added to my 2.7 by selling the clutch with it? Thanks again, guys!

[SP2]

That was a brilliant solution. I thought you were going to grind the whole head of the bolt off. Nice job!

[billybek]

It would be good to do the seal, but with your luck......(don't know if it is really necessary if it looks good)
I would probably replace the disk/plate and throw out bearing... Only because I wouldn't want to go back in for something small...
Mind you, parts never seem to be free!!!
Good to see you are making progress!

[cubby911T]

Thanks Bill. I think I'm going to pull the clutch assembly off my 2.7 and inspect it. If it looks good, I'll probably use it on the 3.2 and then just buy a new pilot bearing.