Banana Arm bushings

[nigel911]

Went to get car aligned after fitting new spring plates and Neatrix bushings, alignment guy tells me the trailing/banana arm bushings pretty much on their way out - may as well get them replaced before alignment.

Wasn't too keen to replace these bushings myself as it looks like the engine/tranny has to be moved to get access to the fittings. Got a quote from the local independent P-Car guy, yowzer! Nearly $700 bucks! I know it's quite a big job but I haven't got that kind of cash hanging around right now.

How hard is this job on a 72 911? Any pointers?

Heard the poly bushings are best avoided on the trailing arms and can't run $350 for Elephant monoballs - what should I use?

Beginning to think I'm too poor for a Porsche!

[Pat S]

I went against the grain and used poly. I'm not a good driver yet so I don't notice if they hurt me or not.
On a 74 it wasn't too hard, just time consuming. You do have to get the eng/trans out of the way though. Then it's just a matter of disconnecting the brakes, spring plates, and shocks. Then the arm bolt.
I melted the old rubber bushing out and pressed in the poly bushings with a vice.


Pat

edit: removed a link to another site when I realized the items are sold here...

[Jim Sims]

Having done this job I can understand the quoted cost. The engine and transmission almost always have to come out and often the trailing arms (banana arms) have to be removed complete with the rear hub assemblies. I recommend the stock rubber bushings. Jim

[nigel911]

Pat,

What did you disconnect in order to get the engine/tranny out of the way. Did you completely drop the engine? Beginning to think I should have done this while I was replacing the spring plate bushings...

[rs911t]

Just finished this job myself. Yes, the engine and tranny must come out. Removing the old bushes and installing new Netrix from Pelican wasn't that big of a deal. Followed up with an alignment and weekend at Mid-Ohio Sportscar course. The car felt just fine to me!

[Az911]

Im doing this right now and I too had to pull the motor/tranny.

Thinking about it now why not just cut the old banana arm bolts and buy new ones? The time savings would be well worth the price of the new bolts.

[Pat S]

I pulled it all.
If you follow the arm forward you might be able to see the nut, but you can't get to both sides.

[MichiganMat]

For those who have changed their bushings, was there a noticable affect in the feel of the car afterwards? Its almost for sure that mine are shot, but I wonder about the worth of the procedure.

[Chuck Moreland]

Originally posted by nigel911
Heard the poly bushings are best avoided on the trailing arms and can't run $350 for Elephant monoballs - what should I use?

??????

Elephant Racing rear monoballs are $237 / set from our host, part number ERMP-2020900.

That's a small premium over the factory rubber bits that run about $180 / set of 4.

[nigel911]

Many apologies Chuck,

Realized my mistake by the time you posted. Makes you feel any better I imagine a set of your monoballs will be heading my way at some point in the reasonably near future, discount for poor people? I jest.

Wish I'd never asked, now I have 3 problems instead of one: the 'while you're in there' problem, the 'how much more is this going cost' problem, and the 'where the hell do I find the money for this lot' problem.

Not too clever having a 32 year old car as a daily driver.

[Randy Webb]

I'm a little confused -- what options are avaialble for the bushings that mount the rear banana arms to the car (near the torque tube)? Are the polybronze bushings available at that joint? All I can find in the Pelican catalog is ERMP-2061000 which is apparently for the spring plates -- the lack of pics/diagrams is not helping either....

Also, are the polybronze bushings a good thing to use on a 100% street car for this joint?

[Schrup]

I used polygraphite for all my bushings & they work great at a fraction of the cost of OEM. They were easy to install, espiecally the trailing arm bushings. Cars nice & tight with no squeeks.

[dd74]

How can one tell when their bushings are about to go south? I'm installing new torsion bars in the back soon, and was wondering if I should look into this as well. But I don't know if I need to do this. My car "feels" fairly tight. How can I tell if they need replacing?

Also is it absolutely necessary to remove the engine? My wrench charges $500 to do that!

[Schrup]

I had a R Gruppe guy show me that my rear bushings were sagging from migration (or whatever they call it). After I took them apart, I probable could have gotten to another 50k out of my bushings. They had mild deforming, but my shock & struts were toast. When you take your spring plate cover off you'll see what shape they're in. I would suspect your shocks need replacing/revalving. Superman has 250k on his suspension & says it feels very unsettled, I think we'll be rebuilding his soon.

[dd74]

Originally posted by Schrup
I had a R Gruppe guy show me that my rear bushings were sagging from migration (or whatever they call it). After I took them apart, I probable could have gotten to another 50k out of my bushings. They had mild deforming, but my shock & struts were toast. When you take your spring plate cover off you'll see what shape they're in. I would suspect your shocks need replacing/revalving. Superman has 250k on his suspension & says it feels very unsettled, I think we'll be rebuilding his soon.

Tyson put adj. springplates on my car and didn't mention these bushings. So maybe they're in okay shape. Is it "apparent" to the trained eye if they need replacing?

[Jdub]

It is not readily apparent if they need to be replaced (that is, by sight) -- generally you do this based on how long the bushings have been in the car. If you have paper that says they've been replaced then go with that.

Gravity and age do just as much to degrade these bushings as driving the car.

The early cars need the trans/eng removed, but the later cars (when? someone help me here...) do not need this done. Just lay in wrench on either side and have at it.

I went with OEM. Along with everything else the difference is huge.

John

[Mike Bonkalski]

What is the difference between the early and later cars that requires the engine drop?

If an early car has a newer Carrera rear suspension will the engine have to be dropped?

[dd74]

I have a '74? Would that constitute a later car in this regard?

[911pcars]

"What is the difference between the early and later cars that requires the engine drop?"

Maybe somebody can verify, but I believe the difference between early and late is the orientation of the bolt head. On early cars, the bolt head is on the "inside" of the control arm, thus requiring drivetrain removal. On later cars, the bolt removes from the "outside". The idea of cutting off the head of the bolt has been suggested for awhile. Has anyone ever successfully removed early control arms using this method?

Sherwood

[Jdub]

Sherwood:

Thanks - I was standing on thin ice there, but was pretty sure there was some design characteristic. I was wrong: as simple as a bolt orientation?

John