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Project **G50**

Well, after a year and a half of having no running car. I have finally made some headway for this project. First of all, let me formally introduce what I am doing. About a year and a half ago, my 915 went kapput, actually it kind blew up from the inside. Lets just say the case actually suffered a structural crack at the nose. The transmission had been rebuilt before this, about 30k miles. Call it bad driving or bad rebuild or even might be that this transmission was rebuilt through motormeister,...whatever.

Anyway, after assesing the damage: destroyed transmission, oil soaked clutch(bad flywheel seal, I think), bad CV with torn boot, and other little tidbits here and there, I thought why not start a project I have been thinking about for a while now.

I found a low mileage G50 for 2k and slowly started gathering info and parts. I just about have everything now. For those who do not know the nature of retrofitting a G50 trans in an earlier car, there are three possible ways of doing it.

1, transplant a G50 torsion tube in place of what your car originally had. Doing this method allows you to keep the car on torsion bars in the rear.

2, Shorten the bellhousing of the transmission. I considered this method but deemed it way too impractical. When you shorten the amount of space for your clutch, you have to use a different flywheel, in my case a custom flywheel specifically made to use the carrera 3.2 reference and speed sensors, which maybe all of one or two people in the world make.

3, Cut the center of the torsion tube and reinforce the crap out of it to accept the longer transmission. Doing this requires the use of Coilovers in the rear due the lack of rear torsion bars. I addition the shock towers have to be reinforced as well. I chose this method.

Other modifications required are as followed: Replace pedal assembly to G50 style with clutch master cylinder, replace clutch cable with hydraulic lines, replace shifter with g50 style with linkage(also you have to hammer out the pan below the shifter because it sits lower than the original), Need to obtain G50 flywheel and clutch along with longer case studs for mounting the trans to the engine, I think thats it, or thats all I can think of at the moment. I have also decided to upgrade the suspension while im in there.

Anyway on to the project....

Here is the car at TRE for the 2006 new years run

Here is Milt helping getting the car ready for welding

Here are the shock tower braces welded in

We welded in this square tubing on both of the outer sides of the tube to support it

And here are the plates we welded to the rear seats for even more support.

Point of no return

I designed this bracket, this should hold it together

Bottom view of the bracket to see the extra clearance we created


Well thats it for the moment... Im getting a little tired as its late. My next posts will show some more G50 stuff and cool suspension parts. Stay tuned!
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1995 993 Guards Red
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Old 08-14-2007, 11:13 PM
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Old 08-15-2007, 04:07 AM
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1978 911SC 3.6 | 2001 Boxster S Racing Car | 1966 912 based 911 RSR replica racing car (for sale!)
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Old 08-15-2007, 09:05 AM
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Interesting job!
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Old 08-15-2007, 09:15 AM
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will you prime and paint all the welded stuff nicely to make it last

what are you going to do for springs? Coilovers?
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How about a NoBadDays DualChip for 964 or '95 993
Old 08-15-2007, 10:50 AM
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very nice project.
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Old 08-15-2007, 11:10 AM
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I'm in.
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Old 08-15-2007, 11:53 AM
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This'll be fun to watch. Keep up the good work.

Also, I have a few spare G50 flywheels if you need one. They're in good resurfaceable condition and you're welcome to one of them for $25 plus shipping. Not trying to jump on this topic as a means of making $- as evidenced by the cheap price for the flywhee.
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Old 08-15-2007, 02:37 PM
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Subscribed - very interested in seeing more of the project as it evolves. I love stories like this!

ianc
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Old 08-15-2007, 07:15 PM
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I'm in as well. Can't wait to see more photos!
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Old 08-15-2007, 07:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ischmitz View Post
will you prime and paint all the welded stuff nicely to make it last

what are you going to do for springs? Coilovers?
I made Beau buy a can of cold galvanized primer for starters. Plus some Must for Rust phosphoric acid to prep the new metal and welds.

Beau is rather modest. I want you all to know HE designed everything you see. Of course, he had some qualified influence. He has been spending his days at TRE Motorsports in good company of the maestro modders.

I just welded it up. I think the penetration and overall strength is very good. If I learned anything at all on this project, I want a better welding machine. No, I won't blame the machine for what you see, but I have done some very nice and even welds using high end equipment. Being a portable entity, I can only take so much gear. In this case, it was a Lincoln 135 MIG. I did have the sucker up on the dial welding on the torsion tube. I know I got it firm at the loss of it being pretty.


With the right setup, you can and should have both.


Beau has lot of room to fit that G 50 in there and as a back up plan, he can take some material out of the horizontal brace crossing between the tube caps to clear any interference with the G 50 nose.. The whole ass'y is tacked to the bulkhead right where all the pieces come together. Short of Tyson's diagonals completely thru the bulkhead, this should be a strong modification. I'd be real surprised if anything ever moves under there.

He is just waiting on his custom trans mount to finish up.
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Old 08-15-2007, 08:24 PM
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Well I'm glad so many of you are interested in my little project. Anyway, I'm currently trying to fit the hydraulic lines in the center tunnel and mate them to the new pedal assembly. I'm still just mocking them up. I'll get some more pictures up when I get them settled in.
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Old 08-15-2007, 11:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KTL View Post
This'll be fun to watch. Keep up the good work.

Also, I have a few spare G50 flywheels if you need one. They're in good resurfaceable condition and you're welcome to one of them for $25 plus shipping. Not trying to jump on this topic as a means of making $- as evidenced by the cheap price for the flywhee.
I thought that G50 flywheels couldn't be resurfaced.
-Chris
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Old 08-16-2007, 04:38 AM
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Milt not going to coment on the welds Good job you guys I have thought about doing this project at some point.. Good info.. Now need to start searching for my g50
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Old 08-16-2007, 05:01 AM
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Nice work guys! I was "lucky" enough to have a shop with a shortened G50 on hand and the conversion is 95% done on my 930 (they have to figure out how they will get the eng/trans moved back 1/2"). Look forward to seeing this progress!
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Old 08-16-2007, 06:26 AM
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Milt not going to coment on the welds Good job you guys I have thought about doing this project at some point.. Good info.. Now need to start searching for my g50
Like I said, I know we got good penetration because I ground down a couple to see how the fusion looked and it looked fine. Just not enough current and/or control in out-of-position welds, which I know you know take quite a bit of practice. Before I started on the car, I got some settings dialed in on some horizontal welds and ran some nice beads to show Beau that I wasn't a hack. But lying on the floor under a car with hardy enough room to cuss a cat without getting fur in your mouth is another ball game. I did the best I could and it will hold, that I'm sure of. And, there's nothing down there that a little grinding couldn't make a whole lot nicer.

When I did the welding school, I used some very nice MIG units. Both Miller and Lincoln to see which I like the best. The real world welders seem to have a slight preference for Miller. I think this comes from times past when Lincoln was a bit behind on technology. Anyway, one day the instructor pulled out a Lincoln 135 for me to use. After getting like straight A's on my projects. I totally sucked at the little machine. All I can say is that welding is discussed a lot here on Pelican and people want to know what to buy. It's a lot like buying a used Porsche. Buy all you can afford.
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Old 08-16-2007, 09:32 AM
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just busting some chops my man
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Old 08-16-2007, 10:21 AM
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Quote:
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I thought that G50 flywheels couldn't be resurfaced.
-Chris
They can be resurfaced if a spring centered disc replaces the OE-type rubber damper disc. The reason for the caution by Porsche as to the resurfacing of the flywheel is due to the possibility of the clutch housing assembly contacting the top of the rubber damper when the clutch housing sits lower in the flywheel. The contact/interference area is probably the back side of the spring fingers or the release bearing area. The housing sits lower because the flywheel resurfacing procedure requires both the disc contact surface and the "step" for the clutch housing be cut.
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Old 08-16-2007, 01:29 PM
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Well, here's another little tip for those contemplating the job. If I would have cut over another 1/4" on either side of the tube, I would have been able to remove the last of the spline casting. As it was, the thickness at the tube ends was probably 3/8" of solid steel. A 110v MIG just won't do justice there. I had it spooled up to as high as setting as you can get on a 135. We were using 1/8th plate steel to fabricate the cross piece.

If this car was in my shop instead of his, I would have fired up the arc welder for the end caps. Or, I could have switched over to .030 wire, but I didn't think to bring the larger insert cable and end piece for the gun. As it was, we ran out of wire and had to make a Sunday dash to a couple of stores before we found some .023, which is what I'm set up for. Lastly, I could have reversed the polarity and turned off the gas and used some flux core wire. (I still would have needed my bigger cable.) That stuff really burns hot and gets down in the metal (from what little I know).

So, take these hints forward when you do your job.
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Old 08-16-2007, 02:49 PM
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Well, here's another little tip for those contemplating the job. If I would have cut over another 1/4" on either side of the tube, I would have been able to remove the last of the spline casting. As it was, the thickness at the tube ends was probably 3/8" of solid steel. A 110v MIG just won't do justice there. I had it spooled up to as high as setting as you can get on a 135. We were using 1/8th plate steel to fabricate the cross piece.

If this car was in my shop instead of his, I would have fired up the arc welder for the end caps. Or, I could have switched over to .030 wire, but I didn't think to bring the larger insert cable and end piece for the gun. As it was, we ran out of wire and had to make a Sunday dash to a couple of stores before we found some .023, which is what I'm set up for. Lastly, I could have reversed the polarity and turned off the gas and used some flux core wire. (I still would have needed my bigger cable.) That stuff really burns hot and gets down in the metal (from what little I know).

So, take these hints forward when you do your job.

just a quick note thicker wire only gives you higher deposition rates not hotter welds. .o23 was the best choice for the tools you had to work with.. I would not worry one bit.. Of course ther are always more expensive options but for the most part the hobbist will be using the exact type of machine you did the job with.. also the flux core option really is not a good option as this introduces porosity which is no good for strength anyhow.. now dual shield is a whole different game.. Again you did a nice job looks great ..
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Old 08-16-2007, 06:23 PM
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