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-   -   2.7 combination (http://forums.pelicanparts.com/porsche-911-technical-forum/375903-2-7-combination.html)

Nitrometano 11-12-2007 02:52 PM

thanks for the info.

I tear down the engine today. How I know if the cylinders are Nikasil or Alusil?

Bobboloo 11-12-2007 04:23 PM

Nickasil has a kind of satin sheen like a nickel inside the bore. Alusil has a more dull gray clay look in the bore.

You can also count the fins on the cylinder. Alusil has less fins but I don't remember the number compared to Mahle.

Another way to identify is the Mahles have an M stamped on the top of the piston. It also looks like a 3 if turned on it's side. All the Mahle sets for 2.7 are Nickasil.

RoninLB 11-12-2007 04:32 PM

timecerts and casesavers are different thread into case.

Nitrometano 11-12-2007 05:31 PM

I know that the timeserts use a special driver to install it. I have use it on the past in another applications. But about the casesavers that Wayne told on the Rebuilt Book I dont know if they are better than the timeserts or only are the same thing.

Another question. I know is good to match the head to intake manifold to carburetor base to get a smooth air flow, but is good to port and leave a rough surface in the intake port of the head?

Also what is the better cleaning products that you had used to clean the greasy parts. I have used degreaser and diesel. There is another better option for this, for example like soak the parts in soap and water, etc

jtkkz 11-14-2007 07:06 PM

here is what my 2.7 sounds like :)



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kv3V_THm36M



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1dtsZlJmkJw

Nitrometano 11-14-2007 07:15 PM

I have bad news guys!!!! The engine have alusil cylinders. I will contact lnengineering.com to know if I can have the cylinders recoat with nikasil.

Nitrometano 11-14-2007 07:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jtkkz (Post 3588898)

that engine sounds powerful. What combination do you have??

mark 74 carrera 11-14-2007 08:04 PM

Here are my dnyo results from a similar set up.

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1195099419.jpg

jtkkz 11-15-2007 07:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nitrometano (Post 3588933)
that engine sounds powerful. What combination do you have??

Here are the basic specs of my motor:

JE 9:5 pistons, PMO carbs, Elgin MOD S cams, Recurved my dizzy w/petronix, ported/some polishing on heads, cross drilled cranks/micro pollished, case was time certed / shuffle pinned, etc......

We did some mods to the PMO carbs

Motor only has 2000 miles so far and so far no leaks...

Bobboloo 11-15-2007 09:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nitrometano (Post 3588922)
I have bad news guys!!!! The engine have alusil cylinders. I will contact lnengineering.com to know if I can have the cylinders recoat with nikasil.

Yes, the Alusil can be coated with Nickasil. Since your using JE pistons you can have the cylinders bored out to 92mm and then coated with Nickasil. Then get some JE 92mm pistons and you'll have a 2.8L S motor. As long as you keep the CR at 9.5:1 and don't get crazy with the advance you should be fine with the CE ring gasket.

Another alternative is QSC pistons and cylinders that Henry at Supertec sells.

Case Savers are recommended over the Timeserts by the top engine builders. Make sure you find a really good machine shop that's done this before to install them.

Nitrometano 11-15-2007 06:08 PM

For the 92mm pistons I need to bore ot the engine case?

Also, I was checking the pistons and other parts today and I found that they are 5 alusil pistons and 1 Mahle piston (this one have the skirt damage). That engine was repaired by some one in the past. For the moment I found a broken rocker arm shaft, 3 damage rocker arms, the cams have damage in the lobes because the valve was adjusted so tight, the cam housings to cylinder heads was sealed with Shellac (there was shellac everyware: on the valve retainers and springs, in the camshaft bearings, rocker arms and shafts. The valve guides are out of specs, the cylinders was honed with the one that have the grind stones (the one that is used to hone iron v8 engines). This is for the moment. I will open the engine case tomorrow.

Bobboloo 11-15-2007 08:43 PM

Ouch! Some valves are probably bent. Sounds like a hack engine builder. It was either ran with the cams out of timing or an over rev. My guess is cam timing was off.

You don't need to bore the case spigots to go with 92mm pistons. The extra displacement comes from boring the cylinders you already have.

Sounds to me like this motor is going to need everything done to it. I don't mean to scare you but don't be surprised if it runs close to $10,000 when it's all said and done.

After you've got everything apart and inspected tally the costs for all the parts and machine work before you proceed. If you don't already have Wayne's book you should get it.

Parts:

P+C's (bore and plate)
Main, rod and intermediate shaft bearings bearings
Chain sprockets for the intermediate shaft and idler wheels
Chains and chain ramps
Rocker arms where needed
Valves where needed
Gasket set

Labor:
Case (line bore, case savers, decking, bypass mod)
Re-con rods and rockers
Heads (Valve job, check springs)

RWebb 11-15-2007 10:42 PM

pull it all the way apart - you want to examine the crank and its bearings; and the oil pump

examine everything really carefully as you now know the motor was fubarred by some idiot

Nitrometano 11-19-2007 07:36 PM

I opened the case today and I found a black plastic chain ramp inside the case at the oil pump shaft. Also the person that rebuilt the engine used gray silicone on the oil pump o-rings. Also I found drippings of silicone between the bearings and the crankshaft. The bearings looks good, except that the engine was assembly with some debris that are punched on the bearings. The only bearings that looks bad was the ones at the intermediate shaft that are bad and the #2 main bearing.

If I have time I will check the measures of some parts tomorrow.

Nitrometano 11-19-2007 07:39 PM

Hey Bobby, do you know were I can send the rocker arms to be reconditioned?

Bobboloo 11-19-2007 09:07 PM

Lots of places can do the rocker arms easily. My preffered places for machine work in California are Ollies in Santa Ana, Ca. and Competition Engineering in Lake Isabel, Ca. Rocker arms are so basic any machine shop can do them though.

The most critical machine work is for your case. It needs to have the line bore checked and if it's out of round (likely) it will have to be bored. This should only be done by someone who specializes in doing this and the only two places I personally trust for that job are the ones I mentioned above. There are others I'm sure but these are the only two places, out of the different machine shops that I've used, who always get it right. See if whoever does the case will remove the piston squirters, clean out the galleys and then install new squirters for you.

All the other parts could be done by any competent machine shop. Heads are best done by any shop that's does 911 and VW motors.

That silicon that the hack builder used is bad stuff. You need to have the crankshaft examined for damage because the silicon could have robbed it of oil by plugging the galley ways. Take it to a machine shop to have it examined, magnifluxed and then polished if it checks out OK. When you get it back you're going to need to clean the oil galleys super clean to make sure nothing is left behind.

Really your whole oil system is going to need going through and meticulously cleaned inside. Oil pump, oil cooler, lines and everything. Any place the oil traveled the silicon went with it. All it takes is one lump of silicon to get trapped in a galley of one of the main bearings and your motor could be ruined.

First thing I would do at this point is get your crank examined. If it's damaged you may want to just start over with another motor.

Nitrometano 11-24-2007 08:05 PM

wow, I hate cleaning the parts. I was cleaning a few days and I didn't finish. Heads and engine case is the las ones. Another queestion: There is always necessary to use threaded inserts into the 2.7 engine? My engine block finish in 7R. I was readin that there are some head studs that have a longer threaded portion to grab more threads into the engine case. This apply only to the aluminum engine case?

Another question: What are the correct parts that I need to make the 5 blade fant o the 11 blade fan conversion. I can use the same pulley halve or I need to buy another one? Also what is the size of the engine fan?

RWebb 11-24-2007 10:22 PM

any bead blasters in PR? send the parts out...

dd74 11-24-2007 11:46 PM

Subscribing...

Nitrometano 11-25-2007 06:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RWebb (Post 3605893)
any bead blasters in PR? send the parts out...

Yesterday and today I was cleaning the garage. There is a lot of junk that I found that I forgeret that some parts exists. I found missing tools, porsche parts, RX-7 parts, boat parts and a lot of used parts that need to be on the trash can.

About the machine shop, a friend of mine have a shop and have the bead blaster machine. I will go this week to remove the exhaust head studs from the cylinder heads because they are too rusty. I will talk to him to borrow the blaster machine.

I think that a will need to buy a bead blaster machine. I was reading at the internet (I lost the link) that a homemade bead blaster can me maked using a metal container pressurized with compresed air.

Do you guys readed the following post about rocker arm bushing alternative?
http://www.gruppeb.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=4629


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