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Quote:
In order to remove the wheels, you need one of these devices. It's a planetary gear reducing mechanism that allows you to torque the wheels to something like 300-ft lbs.
Is that part of the 959 toolkit?

Brian
Old 12-04-2007, 07:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wayne at Pelican Parts View Post
Complicated yes, but it's still only 1987 technology. A 997 Turbo is probably 100 times more complicated than the 959 is, electronics-wise...
Yeah but........ This is the allure of the 959. At least, to someone with a certain type of thinking. It is certainly not fair to call this "1987 technology," though this is the date of production. The 959 is not my favorite, but I certainly understand why it is for some. It was perhaps the one moment when Porsche pulled out ALL the stops and elected to develop and stun the world with a car so advanced it was difficult for the rest of the automotive world to comprehend. Porsche was showing off its engineering and automotive development muscles, and the result was fully intimidating to say the least.

On that shock thing Wayne, perhaps you could find someone with an interest in engineering. Perhaps someone who attended MIT. Either that or, as Zman says, look into trading up to a 944. Okay not that funny. What I think I know about shocks is that they are all hydraulic, even the "gas" ones. The "gas" ones use a pressurized gas system to avoid bubbles in the hydraulic fluid during times when the shocks are being tortured. I think. And so, you may find that the pressure and/or volume of gas is not critical to performance. Maybe.

Thanks for the ongoing documentation. By any standard, this is a special automobile.
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Old 12-04-2007, 08:18 AM
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Using the key to unlock the wheels - very cool.

"....allows you to torque the wheels to something like 300-ft lbs."

I read somewhere that the centerlocks on a Carrera GT need 450 ft lbs!
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Old 12-04-2007, 08:19 AM
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It is just amazing how some one let a 959 go into such a state of disrepair. Where did that car get so abused? How may miles are on it I didn't catch that.

Nice to see it getting saved !

I agree, pop for a full set of wheels! You get them cheap !
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Old 12-04-2007, 08:29 AM
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As far as the shock canisters go, I would guess that pressure would have a bigger effect than volume. Would it be possible to rig a guage to test the pressure in each canister and compare?

Also - what makes you think that the existing canisters need repair?
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Old 12-04-2007, 08:53 AM
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Wayne,

Save time and worry and use the Porsche pressure reservoirs. You may save a whole bunch of money by adapting something else, but the potential damage to the car if the alternative isn't identical in function to the original far outweighs the cost. Expressed more directly: suppose you're taking a corner quickly and the car hits a bump and the shock rebounds strangely and you leave the road and hit something, would you pay $10,000 to have The Spirit of Ferdinand come down and make everything right again? I sure would.

Imagine the irony if a guy who OWNS one of the most popular Porsche parts businesses in the world damaged his 959 by trying to avoid the high cost of the original part. Knock on wood, we hope this will never happen.

My contrarian .02.
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Old 12-04-2007, 09:20 AM
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>On that shock thing Wayne, perhaps you could find someone with an interest in engineering. Perhaps someone who attended MIT.

Um...Wayne IS an engineer who went to MIT if I recall correctly.

He has the two things necessary to own and keep a 959 in roadworthy condition: an engineering degree and access to wholesale Porsche parts!

John Cramer, if you read the thred closely...I don't think the cost is the issue for Wayne so much as the shelf life of the original components.

Last edited by jkarolyi; 12-04-2007 at 09:24 AM..
Old 12-04-2007, 09:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wayne at Pelican Parts View Post
As I stated in previous threads, I'm wary of buying original Porsche parts, knowing that these may be NOS parts from 20 years ago. These canisters don't have a terribly long shelf live, and the OEM 959 ones cost $3800 or so each retail. I get them at wholesale pricing, so it's less, but still, that's $16,000 worth of parts retail. That's a lot.

-Wayne

Counselor, are we reading the same thread?
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Old 12-04-2007, 09:32 AM
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Originally Posted by Grady Clay View Post
Wayne,

Im uncomfortable with the 959 up in the air just supported by just the hydraulics and the wheels off. Is there a mechanical stop? How about setting it on four jack stands and leave the lift as a safety?

Best,
Grady

Grady,
The lift has a ratcheting mechanical stop.
Good eye, though,

Wayne,
good luck, I think the cost differential and age of NOS Porsche ones makes this worth some exploration. Can you setup a simple test rig for those accumulators?

Doug
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Old 12-04-2007, 09:42 AM
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Check this out...

http://yhst-76231485467161.stores.yahoo.net/index.html

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Active_suspension
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Old 12-04-2007, 09:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wayne at Pelican Parts View Post
Complicated yes, but it's still only 1987 technology. A 997 Turbo is probably 100 times more complicated than the 959 is, electronics-wise...
I am not trying to hijack this thread, but this quote makes me realize -

There are going to be a lot of Really Nice Cars that are basically worthless in 20 years. Owners that can't afford the upkeep plus unobtainable parts plus obsolete software.

Thanks for the great words and terrific photos, Wayne. What a great car.
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Old 12-04-2007, 10:21 AM
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Could someone explain that suspension to me? Or point me to an article so that I might know what I'm looking at?
Old 12-04-2007, 10:23 AM
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The funny thing is when Wayne drives around Los Angles in one of the worlds best cars a lot of people are going to be saying "Isn't it a shame what that chaps done putting a body kit on a perfectly nice 911".
Old 12-04-2007, 10:37 AM
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The funny thing is when Wayne drives around Los Angles in one of the worlds best cars a lot of people are going to be saying "Isn't it a shame what that chaps done putting a body kit on a perfectly nice 911".
You think? You know here in SoCal when we see a rare car, we tend to assume it's a rare car. I've seen so many Mercedes 300 SL Gullwings that I was fooled by a kit once. The funny thing is, I have only seen the one kit (and I'm pretty sure about that). It was on the docks about to be shipped and I realized it at about 5 feet. The other clue was the group of cars around the thing. All pretty much thrashers.
Old 12-04-2007, 10:45 AM
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Regarding the nitrogen pressure reservoirs. The first generation BMW M5s had the self-leveling rear suspension that used a very similar nitrogen charged canister. A friend of mine has one on which the self-leveling suspension failed due to the canisteres losing pressure over time. Pretty common on M5s.

Anyway, to cut to the chase. He retrofitted a standard Shrader valve fitting on each canister and had a hydraulics shop recharge them to his specified pressure. They still leak down over the course of a couple of years but when they do he takes them to the hydraulics shop and has them recharged to the tune of $15.

Maybe an option for you?
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Old 12-04-2007, 10:49 AM
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I bet there are more fake 959s on the road than real ones.
Old 12-04-2007, 10:50 AM
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Wayne,

Just my thanks for sharing the info and photos. Its always a real treat to read one of the threads about this fine machine.
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Old 12-04-2007, 11:21 AM
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Originally Posted by JackMan View Post
Wayne,

Budget concerns aside, I'd order a complete set of wheels, front/rear. Complete sets command significantly higher dollars than odd lots of wheels. Plus, you need track wheels don't you?

wj
Budget concerns aside, I think I'll order a Carrera GT in seven different colors - one for each day of the week!

I just wish to order the vital, essential parts that cannot be remanufactured easily if one gets damaged. That protects the value of the car...

-Wayne
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Old 12-04-2007, 12:36 PM
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Originally Posted by Grady Clay View Post
Wayne,

Im uncomfortable with the 959 up in the air just supported by just the hydraulics and the wheels off. Is there a mechanical stop? How about setting it on four jack stands and leave the lift as a safety?

Best,
Grady
It's on the mechanical stops right now - the cylinders are simply backup. Should be perfectly safe.

-Wayne
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101 Projects for Your BMW 3-Series 101 Projects for Your Porsche 911 How to Rebuild & Modify Porsche 911 Engines 101 Projects for Your Porsche Boxster & Cayman 101 Projects for Your Porsche 996 / 997
Coming in 2014:
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Old 12-04-2007, 12:36 PM
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Originally Posted by 1982911SCTarga View Post
Is that part of the 959 toolkit?

Brian
Yes. Believe it or not, the factory workshop manuals were part of the toolkit as well!

-Wayne
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101 Projects for Your BMW 3-Series 101 Projects for Your Porsche 911 How to Rebuild & Modify Porsche 911 Engines 101 Projects for Your Porsche Boxster & Cayman 101 Projects for Your Porsche 996 / 997
Coming in 2014:
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Old 12-04-2007, 12:37 PM
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