911 + rain = "Bad Day!"

Okay, So I let her sit out in the rain last night.
This rainy afternoon got in her and she started fine, got 3-4 miles on the outskirts of town and then 'Dead'.
She would then not even fire!.
Got out the trusty WD-40 and sprayed the dist cap and leads, plug caps, every plug and socket in sight.
Still "nadda".
Sprayed fuel pump connections, nothing.
Then checked fuel pump relay, swapped for new, DME relay- swapped for new, nothing!. Sprayed even more in the engine bay cursing the day I ever bought her! and she muttered a little life. Just enough to give hope only to dash them and infuriate me even more!
She once or twice fired up, I revved her hard and she just died?
Removed cover for coil and sprayed even more.
Then noticed a 3 prong plug similar to the connection for O2 wire (circular socket) mounted above the idle speed control valve?
Anyone know what that does?
It didnt have a cap? so sprayed the f*@k out of it and either that or the coil did the trick.
She started and did'nt miss a beat?
I drove home without delay and covered her quick!.
So I guess the mistery is: what do you think caused it?
Or if you all come up with different answers then I guess it means she is a dry day car!!!
This escapade does little to fuel my confidence in 911's and as a result have had to rent a Ford to drive 3hrs to JFK and back tomorrow.
This is NOT 'the reason why I bought a Porsche'!!!
I do love her but she tries my patience sometimes!

[This message has been edited by 86ragtop (edited 05-23-2001).]

Hey 86, keep the faith, things will get better!

I've got an 88 so the cars are very similar. When I first got the car several expensive items failed right away. And I bought the car from a guy who was wonderful about maintanence! Found a good wrench and kept taking the car to him. In short order he had the car in great shape. Now with each oil change he does a once over and we schedule the car for whatever it needs. Really, things don't "break" on 911's they fail with age. The cars got over 200K on it and runs like a top, very reliable. Get through your teething pains and you'll end up loving your car!

Still "nadda".
Sprayed fuel pump connections, nothing.
Then checked fuel pump relay, swapped for new, DME relay- swapped for new, nothing!. Sprayed even more in the engine bay cursing the day I ever bought her! and she muttered a little life. Just enough to give hope only to dash them and infuriate me even more!
She once or twice fired up, I revved her hard and she just died?
Removed cover for coil and sprayed even more.
Then noticed a 3 prong plug similar to the connection for O2 wire (circular socket) mounted above the idle speed control valve?
Anyone know what that does?
It didnt have a cap? so sprayed the f*@k out of it and either that or the coil did the trick.
She started and did'nt miss a beat?
I drove home without delay and covered her quick!.
So I guess the mistery is: what do you think caused it?
Or if you all come up with different answers then I guess it means she is a dry day car!!!
This escapade does little to fuel my confidence in 911's and as a result have had to rent a Ford to drive 3hrs to JFK and back tomorrow.
This is NOT 'the reason why I bought a Porsche'!!!
I do love her but she tries my patience sometimes![/B][/QUOTE]

I think the three prong thing above the ISV is for testing and setting the Idle speed. Spraying it to get it dry should have had no effect.

I suspect your spraying your Coil had the effect. This begs the question, does your coil have the large rubber boot covering it? Mine has a large rubber boot covering not only the spark plug wire but the two low tension lead connectors as well.

Also check the ground wires where they connect to the #1 intake runner. These have been known to corrode and cause similiar problems. Your Coil grounds here if I am not mistaken.

Good luck

------------------
Nick Hromyak
'85 Carrera 7 & 9 Fuchs
Havin' Fun in Sacramento

Thanks for the vote of confidence Twin911, but I am way passed the 'teething trouble' stage.
In 18 months, replaced/repaired- faulty (myself or garage):
alternator (twice)
Headlight switch (failed 40 miles from home in dark)
Battery,
Fuel pump (brokedown 20 miles away in dark)
Clutch release support snapped imobilising car
Accelerator lever and attchment snapped off accelerator cable also immobilising car same day/location
Fan housing cracked- replaced with used one
Flywheel sensors
New sway bar brackets
new front section under battery- rust
Fresh air fan- still broken
hot air fan - Broke 2 days ago
a/c fan-replaced
sticking front brake calipers- rebuilt
New front brake pads
New gear shifter bushings/couplings
New cam tower oil lines
Valve adjustments
Repack CV joints and reboot
New windshield seal

Improvements include:
recon Vertex gearbox- synchro in 1st was gone
new corbeau seats
new Toyo proxy tires all round
used 8" Fuchs for rear
new ignition wires, plugs, dist cap, rotor
new fuel filter, K&N cone air filter
All new fuses and relays
New rear shocks - to be fitted
Now I know this investing does not guarrantee trouble free driving but the car has broken down 2 times after washing the exterior and once in the rain. I has then broken down twice due to electrical problems.
This is in 5,000 miles and 18 months!.
Now my maintenance bills have exceeded $9,000, so you may have a deeper undestanding of why I may be losing the faith and straying from the flock.
I test drove an S2000 the other day and the $32,500 does not seem so expensive for a reliable fast car that can give a Boxster s a good run for it's money!.
I know this sounds depressed, but standing by the road in the rain and lying underneath the car in the wet spraying everything in sight in the hope that I don't have to walk home and leave her there, kinda has that effect!.
Phew, thats better, shall have a cup of Camomile tea and all will be better!

Thanks Nick for the advice
I shall check the coil more closly once this damn rain stops (4-5 days if forcast is right!)
Are the grounding wires you talk of, obvious?
thanks



[This message has been edited by 86ragtop (edited 05-23-2001).]

Holy Cats!
No wonder you're lookin' at a Honda.
The partsman must roll out a red carpet when you come in!

------------------
Doug
'81 SC Coupe (aka: "Blue Bomber")
Canada West Region PCA
members.home.net/zielke/911SC.htm

Yikes... I know the feeling. Experienced lots of problems 20 years ago with my 914... if I could keep it from having a problem for 2 weeks at a time, I felt lucky.
I'll have to say, though, that my '85 Carrera has been absolutely trouble free since I bought it one year ago. Have less than 50,000 miles on it though... maybe trouble's lurking. Feel really confident in its ability to get me there, although I do have 3 other vehicles to call on as backup.
Good luck.
regards,
jlex.

Jeeeeeezz,

My 84 Cab has given me absolutely no trouble in the 6 years I've had it. In 30,000 miles, I've had to replace the battery once. That's it.


------------------
-Richard
'84 Carrera Cabriolet
'74 911 Widebody 3.6 Project

86Rag,

Have to agree with Richard. My 85 model has not let me down ONE time in the last three years of driving. Have done a clutch (knew it was coming when I bought the car) and small things but absolutely no problems like you have had.

Am not real happy with hearing that you put two alternators in the car, something else is wrong there. I had mine overhauled after I noticed that the voltage was going to 16v at times (headlights got brighter at times and tipped me off that something was not good in the system) and have had no problems with it afterwards at all. Replacing two of them within a short time period points to other things going on... bad overhaul (if it was not a new unit) or mechanic. I would wonder about the cracked fan housing as well. Mine did have a chip/crack on it when I did the alternator and was welded up for $20 locally.

Look at it on the bright side, there is not much more left to replace, you have done most of it already! I have had it miss from time to time in a heavy rain, but never fails to start. Just did 1300 mile trip (NRA national convention) from Dallas to KC Mo and back and not one hiccup and 26 mpg to boot.

Keep the faith and hold off on the Honda for a while!

JA

I drive my car at least 350 days per year in Western Washington, so she gets plenty wet and I have had no trouble. I understand your frustration and my point is the car should not act like this.

I've heard of a n air handling attachment for some later 911s so the distributor is blown dry by the big fan.

------------------
'83 SC

Oh hell!

Your problems are really unlucky, or there's some deeper cause of the trouble.

You are the first Porsche owner I've ever heard of who's had to replace/repair an alternator twice in such a short time. Normally the electrical components are Bosch, horrifically expensive, but very reliable indeed!

You may want to investigate things further, such as grounding straps and so on. Two alternators is unacceptable. Thanks for sticking with the car so long - I'd have given up in disgust if I'd have sunk that amount of time and effort in the damn thing and it was still causing trouble.

Best of luck to you.

- roGER

i'm not sure if this will help, but i had this identical problem when i was a kid and had an 84 Fiero (c'mon i was a kid )
it did the same thing as you describe when it got wet. a new set of plug wires fixed the problem. i know the cars can't compare, but it has to be electrical and related to spark.

------------------
Daryl 964 Targa

The ground wires (all brown) connect to the #1 intake runner. These are all behind the aux heater blower tube. You should be able to trace the ground wire from the coil to this assembly of wires.

Clean them up, and as mentioned above, check your transmission ground strap, and battery ground strap for corrosion, clean as necessary.

I did not see you mention if the Head Temp sensor was updated or not. I don't recall when this sensor was updated in 86 or 87.

It should be a two wire head temp sensor. This could be compounding if not creating your problem. I understand if the head temperature is too hot the computer shuts the engine down. So if this sensor gets a bad ground (single wire version) it (intermittently) shuts down the electronics.

My experience was a popping ignition when the motor was warm-hot. My mechanic recommended replacement when I had the engine out for clutch job.

Good luck.

------------------
Nick Hromyak
'85 Carrera 7 & 9 Fuchs
Havin' Fun in Sacramento

[This message has been edited by nhromyak (edited 05-24-2001).]