Transmission rebuid - Car coming home

[Trog]

I'm pleased to report that my 915 tranny rebuild is complete. Through the efficiency of our host, and a few other part suppliers, we managed to get all the bits and pieces we needed and had the project finished within 8 working days. Not bad, not bad at all. I pick-up the 911 tomorrow afternoon at which time I'll report on its performance. However, my mech states it's the best tranny rebuild he's done to date.. and he's done plenty. I hope I'm not disappointed. BTW parts alone set me back $6000.. ouch!

Here's a few of the goodies installed:

[Trog]

And here's the bits that came out. Criteria, any irregular wear, replace the part with the hope that with proper treatment, the tranny will last 100,000 miles before the next rebuild.

[Trog]

With great anticipation, I picked up the car Friday afternoon. The first thing I noticed was the feel of the WEVO gateshift. I needed to reprogram my shifting habit to match the gates. Once that’s mastered (all of 5-minutes) the gateshift is pretty transparent. The 2-3 shifts does force you through neutral, as expected. No more shifting in the diagonal. Apparently, the PO’s mechanic had done some work on the tranny. Seems he installed the 1st & 2nd gear sleeve backwards making 1-2 shifts rather difficult. Matter of fact, it was nearly impossible to get it into 1st, and 2nd was hit and miss. Now with the rebuild, it shifts into 1st real easy. 2nd gear still takes some effort if I don’t give the synchro a second. As long as I don’t rush it, it snicks into gear. I have yet to try a 1-2 power shift (rather not). 2-3, 3-4, 4-5, 5-4, 4-3, 3-2 and 2-1 shifts are a breeze.

Was it worth the $9 large.. probably not. But what the heck. It’s not like I need both kidneys, right?

Breakdown: $6500Parts
Labour: $2500

[pwd72s]

This a 915 gearbox? Despite all the goodies and extras, do not power-shift...that's what M-22 Muncies were designed to do. NOT 915's. You do realize the history here, yes? The 915 is a derivative of the 908 race car transmission design. Drag racing type speed shifting was not part of the design...

WEVO makes good stuff...but shifting gates etc. don't change the design of what's inside. Take your time, do it carefully when selecting gears with a 915.

[Trog]

Originally Posted by pwd72s

This a 915 gearbox? Despite all the goodies and extras, do not power-shift...that's what M-22 Muncies were designed to do. NOT 915's. You do realize the history here, yes? The 915 is a derivative of the 908 race car transmission design. Drag racing type speed shifting was not part of the design...

WEVO makes good stuff...but shifting gates etc. don't change the design of what's inside. Take your time, do it carefully when selecting gears with a 915.

Yup, that's my understanding as well. Probably good advice for any tranny.

[scottb]

Originally Posted by Trog

Was it work the $9 large.. probably not. But what the heck. It’s not like I need both kidneys, right?

Breakdown: $6500Parts
Labour: $2500

$9,000 for a tranny rebuild? Hopefully one of the experts will chime in here, but that seems extraordinarily high, even with the "goodies."

[Trog]

Well, I did take care of a few other issues while the car was in the shop. The labor for the tranny work was about $1700, with the remainder going towards suspension and chasing oil leaks.

[richde]

Originally Posted by scottb

$9,000 for a tranny rebuild? Hopefully one of the experts will chime in here, but that seems extraordinarily high, even with the "goodies."

Almost a quarter of the cost in parts was in that LSD.

If you're gonna do it, do it right. My car had some sort of transmission overhaul in the last 25K miles and it doesn't shift that well, probably because it was done cheaply.

[Matt Monson]

Originally Posted by scottb

$9,000 for a tranny rebuild? Hopefully one of the experts will chime in here, but that seems extraordinarily high, even with the "goodies."

That's not really out of the park. As someone mentioned, the diff is a good chunk of that and not all the labor appears to have gone into the gearbox. But if you go run through all the parts on the Pelican main site, you'll see it adds up very quickly when you "remanufacture" a box. Just the 3 sliders by themselves put you at about a $1000. Throw in bearings for $700+/-, and you've still got dog teeth, synchros, stops, and brake bands for every gear, etc. It adds up pretty quickly.

The average price of a 915 gearbox coming through my shop is probably around $3500-4500 for a street box. When you do a full remanufacture on it, it's usually more around $6000-7000. Race builds with LSD's, bearing plates, and special ratio gears are usually $9000-13,000 depending on what exactly we install.

[Trog]

I have one word of advice for anyone contemplating a tranny rebuild. Do your homework. Based on everything I read, I anticipated that at most, the cost would have been $5-6 thou.. and that’s with parts. But until you get the gear-box opened up, you have no idea what you’ll find. Plus, there’s a real desire to change marginal parts, just ‘cause you’re already in there. In addition, through no fault of their own, I sense that most mechanics low-ball the cost of repair in fear of losing a potential customer.

If you want to avoid surprises, prepare an estimate including any optional equipment you may wish to install, then double it!

[Matt Monson]

Originally Posted by Trog

But until you get the gear-box opened up, you have no idea what you’ll find. Plus, there’s a real desire to change marginal parts, just ‘cause you’re already in there. In addition, through no fault of their own, I sense that most mechanics low-ball the cost of repair in fear of losing a potential customer.

Two pieces of sage advice. This is why I won't bid a build without the tranny on the bench. I will sell you one of my exchange trannies that I know what I put into it, but generally only tell people $3-6k on building theirs in house. Then we open it up when we get it and make a list of what it needs. I tell people daily that I am not the guy to come to if you are looking for the cheapest build. I am finding more and more these days I don't have to sell quality like I used to. People are figuring out that a $2000 rebuild only holds together for a couple of years and if they are going to hold onto the car for 5-10 years it's worth spending $4 or $5k to do it right.

[Trog]

In 1984, the sticker price for my car was $45,000++. In 1984, I could purchase a nice Mustang GT with 5-speed for about $12,000. The Mustang tranny was bullet-proof. The Porsche, not so much.

So, who in their right mind would accept a car, costing almost as much as a house, with the 915 transmission? If this is how they worked when they were new, then I would have had my lawyers contacting Porsche to demand restitution?

Were all the supercars of that era plagued with marginal gear-boxes?

[Matt Monson]

Originally Posted by Trog

In 1984, the sticker price for my car was $45,000++. In 1984, I could purchase a nice Mustang GT with 5-speed for about $12,000. The Mustang tranny was bullet-proof. The Porsche, not so much.

So, who in their right mind would accept a car, costing almost as much as a house, with the 915 transmission? If this is how they worked when they were new, then I would have had my lawyers contacting Porsche to demand restitution?

Were all the supercars of that era plagued with marginal gear-boxes?

The Mustang you mention had Borg-Warner synchros, as did many other cars by then. The synchro design found in the 915 gearbox is a Porsche proprietary design which they had patented many years earlier. And the 911 was on the chopping block potentially looking at being discontinued, so why update it? The 944 and 928 were using Borg-Warner synchros a good ten years before you saw one in a 911 transaxle. Porsche was slow to abandon their own design and embrace something better like everyone else was using and didn't do it until they put the G50-01 in the last few years of the 3.2l Carrera.

But you also need to look at what was going on in our society at that point. In the mid-80's a Porsche 911 was a status symbol that was only rivalled by the Ferrari 328 and the Lamborghini Countach. It was far far less expensive than those true exotics. Those same Ferraris and Lamborghinis needed a major service and a valve adjustment every 5-6k mi. And those services cost thousands of dollars. A 911sc or a 3.2L Carrera on the other hand was a jump in and go vehicle with service intervals similar to what you see on a Camry or an Accord. It was the best of both worlds giving you a sports car that was close in performance to the Italian cars but with cost of ownership more on line with the other German marques. On top of it all, it had the racing heritage that so many of us embrace today. We could look back at the 911's and 935's of the 60's and 70's and there was a direct lineage leading to the street cars of the 80's. In return for that, many people were willing to accept a transmission that was outdated, funky, and decidedly Porsche.

[Trog]

Matt, I guess you summed it up perfectly.

If the 911 was able to run with the Ferrari’s and Lambo’s for a fraction of the cost, then that would indeed award it a certain amount of ‘character’. Considering its Achilles heel, I guess one had bragging rights if they knew how to drive a 915-equipped vehicle. In a time when cars were increasingly lacking character, I guess it meant something owning a vehicle that valets were unable to park.

I’ve driven both 915’s and G50 911’s. And for my money, I prefer the 915. There’s something about ‘working’ the tranny that makes driving the car so engaging. The double-clutching, the rev-matching, the sounds and feedback, seem so period-correct.

If I need a perfect gear-box, I can always take my Mazda for a spin.

[dlague]

I did a similar rebuild on my 915 about 18 months ago. I paid in line what you did.

I also put in a billet side cover replacing the stock one for more strength.

I really like what the Wevo shift gate did for the shifting, but I quickly found out my linkage needed some help. I had a Weltmeister quick shift kit in the car at the time and it was a mess. This shifter raises the pivot point both laterally and fore and aft. The Wevo does not like this.

I put in the factory shift kit and this made a huge difference. The factory kit has all new internal parts for the shifter so this tightens everything up, and the lateral shift ration stays the same so it matches the Wevo gate.

I also changed the coupling connecting the shifter rod to the trans to the Wevo. $200 for this part is steep, but it is beautiful and works well. You can put new plastic bushings for $20.00 in parts, but it too will get sloppy in a couple of years.

If you are not sure about your shifter and linkage I would at least replace all the plastic bushings. I like the shorter shifter, but that is not everyone's taste.

One minor note on the shifter, the shaft is brazed into the lower area. A month after the install this let go and I had to take it all back out and re-weld it. So I am an expert at assembling this shifter.

Dick

[Trog]

One of the first upgrades I did was installing a WEVO shifter, change bushings and installed a Strompsky shift coupling.

So, that's it for gear-box/shifting upgrades. Now I get to focus on suspension, but that will have to wait till next year.

I'm thinking coil-overs.

[dlague]

Good for you....you are way ahead of me in the shift control area. Good work.

I just could not believe how badly my new transmission shifted because the shifter and coupling were so sloppy!!

[rnln]

what? $9k to rebuild a tranny? Am I missing something here... or it's simply the price for driving a 911?

[Trog]

Originally Posted by rnln

what? $9k to rebuild a tranny? Am I missing something here... or it's simply the price for driving a 911?

Like most things in life, you get what you pay for.

[Dottore]

Trog:

Can I ask who did the work, and how happy you were with them?