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Max Sluiter
 
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Bump for O-ring sizes.

How much fuel will spill when I take the pump off the sway bar mount?

Thanks

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1971 chassis, 2.7RS spec MFI engine, suspension mods, lightened

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Old 02-20-2009, 01:26 PM
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Does the pump need to generate a specific pressure for the MFI system to work? Ie does the pump degrade producing less pressure (and flow) than it should causing running problems?

What pressure should it produce?

Thanks
Graham
Old 02-25-2009, 07:42 AM
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The Exact Fuel Pump Specifications are:

Regulated pressure = 14.2 PSI, 0.8±0.2 Bar
Flow rate = 125 liters/hour
Porsche P/N = 901.608.105.00
Bosch P/N = 058097 0001
Current draw = 3.5A @ 12V
RPM = 2800

Take a look at The Ultimate MFI Simplification Thread, post #8.
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Old 02-25-2009, 08:51 AM
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excellent, thanks on both counts.
Graham
Old 02-25-2009, 09:00 AM
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I'm really not sure what the o-ring sizes are, precisely. I just brought the old ones to my local auto parts store and matched them up as best I could. As far as fuel spillage, there is bound to be a bit. I simply pull one line at a time and stick a bolt in it to plug it up. The pump is full of fuel, and however much that is will drain out if you turn the nipples down. I just put a funnel in a gas can and set the pump in there to drain for awhile.

As far as that Bendix pump, that roll crimped end looks like a game stopper. If that is the end you need to remove, I think you are out of business. Does the other end come off easily?
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'72 911T 3.0 MFI
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Old 02-25-2009, 09:01 AM
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Max Sluiter
 
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I opened the pump up today. The can was a tough nut to crack!

The pump and O-rings were fine. The problem was the motor. The commutator was completely worn down and the brushes had gotten hot, welded, and chewed up.

The armature needs to be removed, the commutator turned on a lathe, and new grooves under-cut in the surface for some new brushes to ride on.

Anyone doing this job should note that the top fuel line fitting, slightly larger than the other 2, is the line from the tank and will stream out fuel until the tank is empty. Vice grips worked best to clamp off the flow. The other 2 lines were dry.
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Last edited by Flieger; 02-28-2009 at 09:41 PM..
Old 02-28-2009, 09:14 PM
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There was a much older thread on this topic (which I can't find now) which wasn't as detailed, but the author said he tried rubber o-rings and the pump failed pretty quickly. He apparently went to Viton and had no issues. He didn't mention size either, other than using the method Jeff did.
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Old 03-13-2009, 03:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stevemfr View Post
Even if there were sparks, there's no air. Liquid gasoline does not burn - the vapors do. A tank half full is a dangerous thing to keep around when your playing with fire - a completely full tank is not.

There was a link to an aircraft site a while back (in one of the efi-conversion threads I believe) where the author talked about fuel mixture. In explaining the above scenario, he even said something along the lines of: light a match, throw it on the ground, and pour gasoline on it. It will go out.
the fire triangle oxygen,fuel,heat. no oxygen.
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Old 03-14-2009, 04:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeff Higgins View Post
I guess we all know how hard it is getting to find good MFI fuel pumps these days. "NLA" is the order of the day. Well, I found myself in need of one, and even with three on hand, none of them worked. Two didn't run at all, and one leaked out of the electrical connector base. I figured it was time to dig in and see what these are all about. After all, I had two chances to ruin non-working pumps before I had to figure this out and make one work. With nothing to lose, I went to work.
Hi Jeff,

You mention one of your inoperable pumps had fuel leaking from the electrical connector. Did you investigate this one, to see if there was a fix for this leak? I have two of this type of pump, both for CIS, which have developed a leak after sitting unused for some years. The pumps both spin up, dry, with battery voltage applied. Seeing how relatively easy it seems to be to get the pump apart, I have wondered if the electrical connector leak is fixable.

Any thought on this?
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Old 05-01-2009, 04:55 PM
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Bump for my question above on possible repair of the fuel leak around the electrical connector?
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Old 05-13-2009, 03:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim Williams View Post
Bump for my question above on possible repair of the fuel leak around the electrical connector?
Jim,

As far as I know, individual replacement parts like the electrical connector boot seal are unavailable. I recommend you try a product like: Seal-All — Gas & Oil-Resistant Adhesive if the leak is relatively minor. This stuff works very well for sealing small leaks in both gas and oil applications. If this doesn't work, you may just be stuck with a parts pump.
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1973 911E Targa (MFI)
Old 05-13-2009, 05:06 AM
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David,

Thanks for the input. I do have a tube of Seal-All, but in this instance I have my doubts if it would hold. I tried two different early pumps in my CIS bench test rig and both leaks showed up as a pretty healthy stream out onto the work bench. (I do use clean mineral spirits as a test fluid, not gasoline.)

I didn't try to disassemble the electrical connector from the pump so I'm not sure where the seal fits. I suppose I could give the Seal-All a try though just to see if it would hold.
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Old 05-13-2009, 06:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim Williams View Post
Hi Jeff,

You mention one of your inoperable pumps had fuel leaking from the electrical connector. Did you investigate this one, to see if there was a fix for this leak? I have two of this type of pump, both for CIS, which have developed a leak after sitting unused for some years. The pumps both spin up, dry, with battery voltage applied. Seeing how relatively easy it seems to be to get the pump apart, I have wondered if the electrical connector leak is fixable.

Any thought on this?
Just saw this. These do not leak from the electrical connector unless there is an internal leak at the o-ring. Fix the o-ring, and fuel stops draining out of the electrical connector.
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Old 06-12-2009, 10:12 AM
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There is a o-ring around the plastic electrical connector but it's a real pain to get to (at least on these early MFI and carb pumps). Replacing the big o-ring wont fix this leak. Here are a few pictures of a disassembled pump head.

A. This is crimped down on one of the leads comming from the external connecter so I'm not sure how I would secure it if I somehow removed it. However without removing it you can't get the connector out to replace the seal.

B. You can see where the connector comes through the pump head. This area is filled with fuel under pressure when the pump is running.



C. You can see the o-ring here.



I've had a couple of these pump rebuilt but it isn't cheap... Now I know why.
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Old 06-12-2009, 11:54 AM
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MFI electric fuel pump rebuild

I read some posts about electric fuel pumps binding after DIY rebuild. Here a potential reason: I successfully cleaned and reassembled my 1973 electric fuel pump (for MFI). The picture below shows the outer ring for the rollers and a very small gap between that and the roller driver. When I reassembled the pump I noticed that the 4 mounting holes of the outer ring are much larger than the bolts holding it. This allows a variable position of the ring and therefore a varying gap. If this gap is too small it potentially could cause binding. Luckily I did not have this issue since I marked the position before full disassembly. Here is a great link to the rebuild procedure.

Questions:
Does anyone have a source and material recommendation for the O-rings? My pump was already a replacement pump and the O-rings were still OK. Next time I defiantly have to replace them.

I like to get a spare pump so if someone has a broken one or even just parts I would be interested.

Old 11-03-2009, 09:33 AM
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Hello Vintagemotion,

Although I see that your last post is dating from 2 months ago already, I was wondering if you could help me by telling me what is the correct position of the outer ring (the one for the rollers). When disassembling it, I forgot indeed to mark the position so I am a little bit stuck !

Many thanks in advance for your precious help

Guillaume
Old 02-21-2010, 08:41 AM
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Pump Won't Pump

Great thread. I replace the o rings in the pump head and I now have no leaks but I am finding the pump while running isn't pumping fuel at least to the back of the car; not sure on return line to tank. Fuel coming in from tank so not blocked. Is there a need to bleed the pump or lines or any other ideas? Thanks Jim L.
Old 04-15-2012, 03:57 AM
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Hi, I have just taken my pump down as far as I can. My s leaking from the electrical connector. I m now stuck on the axle drive pin, the pressed in one, which I can not remove! So, how do I get down to just the pump head?

I have a 70-71 carb pump. Does that one have he same RPM? If so, can I just change out he drive?


Regards,

Johan
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Old 05-26-2012, 08:30 AM
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Nevermind, I decided I had nothing to lose, so I hammered it out. I also removed the wires, which were just soldered in. So now I have access to all three orings, and they were totally dried out all of them. So now I just have to figure out the sizes, and get it all back together.....


Thanks,

Johan
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Old 05-27-2012, 01:47 AM
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And now its my turn, the 911 left a trail of petrol when I backed it out of the garage for my Sunday drive. Good thing I got out to close the garage door and spotted the trail on the concrete. Fuel is leaking from the electrical connector. The pump was new in 1997, its a genuine Bosch made in Germany unit, probably only done 5,000 miles, but stored for 10 years. Now what? I have the original pump I replaced in 1997 which had the same issue, so I am tempted to have a go replacing the O rings and if/when I fail I'll ship the newer pump off to Pacific Fuel Injection (Gus?). Does anyone have a recent experience of refurbishing one of these pumps, an email address would be good or is PFI phone contact only? A discrete PM with an idea of the $$$ would also be helpful, freight each way will add another US$150 at least from here to there and back to here again. I spent an hour searching the Made in China websites looking for a 1 bar 100 litres per minute in line pump but struck out. Lots of cheap-as Bosch 044 pump replicas, but they are 4 or 5 bar and 2-300 litres per hour. Also found a Carter pump that's 14 psi but its very ugly and bulky. I see the Zims replacement but would prefer to buy from our host if I go that way, could not find anything which might be a warning in itself? Not a lot of support for anything other than genuine Bosch 901.608.105.00 to be found.

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Old 06-09-2013, 10:48 PM
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