Sunroof cable issues

Wavey · 04-10-2009, 12:29 PM

My sunroof has been stuck for a while. It would open about 1", then lock up. It would close as normal.

I just opened it up and I'm not sure what I'm seeing, so I'd appreciate some guidance. I got the headliner loose and moved back, and I got the top panel off. The tracks, guides, plastic pieces etc all look fine. At the rear mounting points (pic below), the blocks are free to slide forward and back and are not attached to anything. If I sight down the tracks, I *think* I'm seeing the ends of the cables, about halfway back.

These blocks are where the cables are supposed to attach, correct? The problem is I can not find where the cables should attach. I've cleaned them and examined closely, picked around with a scribe, and I can't find any holes or anything.

The motor and gearbox are still in the car. Now that it's partially disassembled, the cables will not move forward or back with the motor, and I'm hearing a lot more noise from the gearbox. So I'm not sure how I'd even get the cables forward enough to reattach. I did a search and it sounds like they can be JB welded and re-crimped.

What am I not seeing right, and what do I need to do next? It seems weird that both cables would detach at the same time.

subwayrat356 · subwayrat356's Garage

Have you released the gear box from the cables? This should allow the cables to slide, though I guess if they are not attached to the roof, i don't know how you would reach them.

Wavey · 04-10-2009, 02:07 PM

I did some more searching and I think I have this figured out. It looks like I have to drop the motor/gearbox, then I can remove the wind deflector, then the tracks slide out forward. I already pulled the deflector and the screws at the front of the track, so I could get the part in the pic above removed. Now I see where the cables attach, and I can do the epoxy/re-crimp repair there. I also unzipped the rear headliner and I fiound the cables pushed way back out of their tubes, and slid inside the headliner along the rear window. I'm wondering if my drive pinion is shot - which I'll find out tomorrow. Broke one of the deflector clips so I need to order parts anyway.

A couple of questions:
Everything realy should be cleaned and assembled without lube, correct?

Re: the felt weatherstrips - is it correct that the rear strip attaches to the back edge of the sunroof, rather than the car roof? Mine were both attached around the roof opening, and it appeared they were that way from the factory.

subwayrat356 · subwayrat356's Garage

In Wayne's book he does say not to grease the tracks because on a hot day it can melt and drip into the interior. Also it attracts dirt and debris when the roof is open.

there are two rear weather strips- the felt one and a rubber one, both attach to the back of the sunroof. The front attaches to the roof.

matt demaria · 04-10-2009, 02:23 PM

Rear felt and rubber is attached to sunroof itself. (I have seen a lot of variations of assembly from hans and fritz, not necessarily correct.)
If cables are broken I replace them. The cables were superseded to the 964 part where the aluminum side rails have to be changed. The brush diameter on the sunroof cables had been increased 1mm in diameter.

john walker's workshop · 04-10-2009, 03:09 PM

the cables commonly pull out of the slider blocks. they were crimped in place. if they are not frayed too bad, you can carefully twist them back in and recrimp with side cutters. you first have to rewrap the multi-wire cable core with some pliers so it's a smooth as possible spiral twist like it used to be, then reinsert it into the block with a push/twist motion. sometimes it helps to use a drill bit the size of the cable core and clean up the hole in the block so the cable will go all the way in. early slider blocks were white plastic, and you can't fix those. i always save the cable for later repairs though.

jorian · 04-10-2009, 07:42 PM

I did exactly as JW advised and I also used a little JB weld on the cables before I re-inserted them in the blocks and re-crimped.

fredmo1947 · fredmo1947's Garage

If you have not already done so, go to the Tech Info Center on this website, then to Technical Articles, then to Misc., then to Sunroof Repair. This article walks you through the complete removal and installation of the sunroof and its various parts. I recently did this with my 76 911S and the article was right on target and removed the guess work regarding the inner workings of the sunroof. I replaced the cables, guides and misc. hardware (total cost around $300). The sunroof works perfectly, and the article made it much easier than fumbling my way through it.

Wavey · 06:22 AM

Thanks everyone, especially johnwalker, great description. I did find the tech article late yesterday fredmo. Looks like this will be a simple clean up, epoxy and re-crimp the cables, and reassembly. Nothing else appears to be broken or even worn very much, so I can't see any reason to go to the later parts, especially given the cost. But I haven't gotten to the drive gear yet.

Re: the rear seal, I'm the second owner and have all the service records. I can't find that any sunroof repairs have ever been done, and the real seal was definitely glued to the roof opening, not the sunroof. Sure looks like it came that way from the factory. But I can see the reasoning for it going on the sunroof.

So - tear down, clean, epoxy/crimp this morning, and let it cure overnight, then back to the Ruf bumper installation which is the real project!

john walker's workshop · 04-11-2009, 07:03 AM

there's a rubber seal glued in behind the felt seal on the sliding panel. it has a V shaped cross-section. the open side of the V faces forward to capture water and allow it to drain off to each side into the channels. good idea to get a new one that isn't squished flat. there's about 5MM space between the felt seal and the rubber seal.

Wavey · 04-11-2009, 07:41 AM

Got it, thanks John, great tips! Just ordered all the little plastic bits and that seal. I got everything diassembled and cleaned this morning. Cleaned the cables with brake cleaner abd blew them dry - they look like new. I think I'll coat them with some spray-on dry film graphite (John Deere Slip-Plate), which leaves a dry teflon-like coating. Got the sliders, guides, cable tubes, and drain tubes cleaned too. Next step is the epoxy/crimp, then I'll clean up the sunroof panel, headliner, wind guard parts, etc., and let it all sit until I can reassemble.

This is part of a winter list that started with Ruf bumpers and Carrera tail, which turned into also repainting the hood, which turned into getting th paintless dent guy here and buffing out the rest of the body to bring it up to snuff. Then added a complete AC rebuild (as long as the hoses were so accessable with the bumpers off), and why not install the H4s and Sucro relays that have been sitting here for a couple of years, plus dozens of other small jobs, plus replacing the rear Elephant Polybronze bushings that went bad, +++. You know how it goes. The car has been in my shop, up on jack stands since Thanksgiving, and I really want to wrap it up. But the sunroof issues were important enough to do it now. Trying to be patient, really ready to be done with all this, but I just can't do stuff half-assed.