Ready for my 911SC project - long

[Deschodt]

Ok, it's my turn (finally) to start on a little 911 project, after drooling all over my keyboard for years... Except mine's a budget project, as opposed to some of the lavish work seen here....

Anyway, my 83 911SC has just started slipping its clutch @ 180,000 miles (the shame, I was hoping to get 200K out of it) after 20+ track days... She's a great car but cosmetically, has seen better days... No, really... My hood has so many paint chips it looks like it's got chicken pox ! My front valence is unrecognizable. Both fogs lights are long broken... The bumper shows more primer than paint ! The front end is ROUGH !



My project is a backdate, but not your usual RS or RSR. I have early fenders (in need of repair), I want a classic S look, just with a wider rear end (courtesy of the SC fenders). So an S spoiler up front and for cleaner lines, no RS tail. The front end needs repainting anyway, so might as well backdate... I am not a huge fan of my platinum color, I'd prefer the slate grey of McQueen fame, but once again this is a project on a budget so repainting only the new bits will save me $$$ and I have no problem keeping the black trim either, I like that better anyway.

A few questions in no particular order:

- cooler: I don't want a front one requiring an RS front bumper. Would a second carrera fender cooler on the driver side work for occasional track work? I think Jack's running that but I can't remember, might be a 3.6 cooler... And could I somehow duct airflow from behind the horn grilles (post backdate) towards each cooler with some judicious drilling/cutting?

- interior: I want alcantara everywhere (that artificial suede material you can see on the 997GT3's steering wheel). Does anyone make an alcantara headliner for the SC era yet, or do I have to remove mine and have one cut to size and sown ? Does anyone with any experience with this material know if I can glue it to an RS door panel, if so with what glue ? I'm getting the seats redone in that already (dark grey).

Not 100% sure what do do with the SC side trim under the door, and the resulting holes if I pull it. If I have to repaint that, my paint job suddenly encompasses the whole car since there are not cut lines. I've only seen one backdate that kept the SC/Carrera trim (curtis' car) and it looked pretty good to me. Bright side trim would not work with the black window surrounds anyway. Neither would bright 70s mirrors, so possibly Aero mirrors if the base can fit over the footprint of the existing flag mirrors and not cause a door repaint. Are those plug and play ?

I'm going body shop hunting this w/e for someone to help me decide if I should repair my spare early fenders or splice some grungy early buckets I also have onto my SC fenders... Decisions decisions, but easy, because 100% cost driven.. I plan on keeping track of costs and build details and post here... Could also turn out that I am better off repainting the whole car, which I'd love to do but can't quite afford.

Let me know if you have any suggestions re: the above ;-)

[Larry_Ratcliff]

I know of a couple of people that just run 2 fender mount coolers. However, I think if you just went with a single 3.6 fender mount cooler with some fans it would be more than enough. Do you have problems with overheating with a single carrera cooler?

I have not heard of the SC back date hood. However, it sounds interesting if you could post more information on it.

Steel S bumpers are hard to come by and bring a pretty fair premium when you find one. However, I would suggest holding out for the real one. You might find that making the fiberglass one fit right will end up costing just as much.

Good luck it sounds like an interesting project.

[Deschodt]

The backdate hood is made by 2 people: Damon @ SERIES 900 and TRE owned by Dave bouzaglou I think... I don't know which is better and or cheaper. Both let you use a fiberglass long hood repro with a modified latch positioning, without modifying the SC bulkhead. So it's 100% bolt on. I think the only catch is that you must extend the length of the release trigger so that you can actually reach itwith your fingers, as the extra lentgh of the longhood would make that harder. Thanks for the advice on the cooler !

[PcarPhil]

Originally Posted by Deschodt

A few questions in no particular order:

- cooler: I don't want a front one requiring an RS front bumper, it's an esthetic thing (not logical but it's *my* dream bastard backdate), even though I know they work best. Would a second carrera fender cooler on the driver side work to spread the heat load for occasional track work? I think Jack's running that but I can't remember, might be a 3.6 cooler... And could I somehow duct airflow from behind the horn grilles (post backdate) towards each cooler with some judicious drilling/cutting?

- interior: I want alcantara everywhere (that artificial suede material you can see on the 997GT3's steering wheel). Does anyone make an alcantara headliner for the SC era yet, or do I have to remove mine and have one cut to size and sown ? Does anyone with any experience with this material know if I can glue it to an RS door panel, if so with what glue ? I'm getting the seats redone in that already (dark grey).

- Bumpers? A bit of a conundrum on both ends. I'd like to install a real pre-73 rear bumper for the looks of it (well, the 2 sides, I have an aluminum center section for lightness) but I am afraid the work to accomodate SC flares will cost $$$... I might settle for an RS rear piece but still install rubber trim on top of it, though I bet it won't be long enough !

On the nose, I really want an S bumper, and I'd prefer steel, but I cannot find one so I guess aftermarket is the only way to go. I plan on getting the SC backdate hood (no cutting and all reversible, should SCs become the next long hoods- he he), so in essence, the final car should look like a 73S with slightly wider fenders (and maybe a tail).

Let me know if you have any suggestions re: the above ;-)

Yes you can run 2 Carrera coolers.

To do a backdate you'll need to cut off the rear reflector panel. Everything else can be bolt on.

[PcarPhil]

Originally Posted by Deschodt

The backdate hood is made by 2 people: Damon @ SERIES 900 and TRE owned by Dave bouzaglou I think... I don't know which is better and or cheaper. Both let you use a fiberglass long hood repro with a modified latch positioning, without modifying the SC bulkhead. So it's 100% bolt on. I think the only catch is that you must extend the length of the release trigger so that you can actually reach itwith your fingers, as the extra lentgh of the longhood would make that harder. Thanks for the advice on the cooler !

Getty also makes the backdate hood.

[JeremyD]

Yes on getty -

pretty sure TRE makes fender extenders that can be grafted on to make short hood fenders into a backdated longhood.

Pretty sure jack runs two carrera coolers - one behind each headlight bucket. I too like the cleaner look of the S spoiler without the drop down cooler "mouth"

[RWebb]

someone did put in an alcantara headliner - do a search - not much info but you can get their contact info

[axl911]

928 Leather shop has all the Alcantara stuff you need.

http://928leathershop.com/Dashboard,_Console_and_Panel_Covers.html

Drool...

[Larry_Ratcliff]

Well after reading your post you really got the wheels turning in my mind. Slate grey with some talbot berlin mirrors and even back date the guages to some chrome bezel green face guages .... Has me thinking about doing a back date on my SC ... Mine is petrolium blue so I would have to change the color though... would not look right as a long hood.

Its really the perfect platform. You get the early car looks without having to worry about the rust. Good luck

[Deschodt]

Well, I have most of the parts except:

a) the fender bottom part from alfaparts is taking FOREVER to get to me
b) the early fenders need to be repaired before I do the mock up



So I started with interior stuff.... Alcantara door panels, work in progress...
I'm not 100% happy with the hue of the fabric, although flash pictures make it appear even more gray (should be black)... I can redo that easily anyway....



I thought about RS panels, but I've done that before and I much prefer the SC door handles, you can actually grip those to close the door effectively, they don't confuse passengers, and the same passengers can hold on for dear life on them ! I kinda tried the SC handle by itself and will wait and see if it grows on me if not I'll repair the door pockets and reinstall those as well....

The thin-ness of the panel + foam + alcantara means that the locking button "cup" kinda floats a little in its panel hole... Like I said, I'll probably keep working on this !

[Walko]

Loks like a nice project

[RWebb]

where did you buy the Alcantera?

[Deschodt]

Originally Posted by RWebb

where did you buy the Alcantera?

Fabric shop. I checked out a few before finding one with "sofa grade" material, ordered 4 yards of it for $77. I may even have enough for a headliner ! But I dread that part (popping all windows and seals)

Calico corner, I think, was the place. Not sure they are nationwide, but I can tell you they had never sold fabric for a porsche door panel before ;-)

The one thing I learned was that you can glue it with 3M carpet/trim glue. Just let the glue go tacky, and staple the thing to keep it in place. When dry, remove the staples, and you cannot tell there ever was one anyway...

The difficulty is the thinness of the alcantara vs. the stock panel+ padding+vinyl... (and staple marks on your table, oops) It changes the fit of a few things so you have to restore that thickness in places....

[garmo]

Greg - is the alcantara thin enough to go over the original leather on the door panels, dash, etc? or do you need to pull the old stuff and put a buffer of sorts in between? Looks like your door panel came out nicely!

[Deschodt]

It is definitely thin enough that you could glue it over an existing surface...but unless that surface is smooth and flat, it might look funny. The SC panel for instance is full of stitches, ridges and other patterns. Would not have worked there over the leather/vinyl...

You could reuse your door panel cardboard with some foam, or spring the $70 or so for a brand new bare door panel with foam backing and go to town on that ! It's less risky too, if you screw it up you still have the original !

[Kemo]

place some foam on the back of the door panel to fill the gap and stop the lock "cup" from jingling around. you dont have to get too fancy, scraps should work fine.

nice project!

[Deschodt]

OK... I can't get used to the blue hue of the alcantara panel, so I got me $15 of grey alcantara instead, that matches the seats. I think I like the contrasting look better.... Still debating reinstalling the door pockets, I know they belong but I kinda like the "without" look !





Now I have to scotchguard those because they could get dirty real easily... And redo the "blue" side from above... I put foam around the cut and it fits a lot better, Kemo, no question... I was just lazy last time around !

PS: Found a good source in the US: http://www.gulffabrics.com/alccolor.htm

[Deschodt]

Ok, progress... I took the fenders to a 912 Buddy, Bryan, who's pretty good with a welder and pretty generous with his time ! Yes, this is not gonna be one of those quick "pro" backdates. Not only am I on a budget but I have no welding talents, so I will depend entirely on the kindness of my friends ;-)

First we cut the bottom of my crappy fender (sorry, cell phone pic, last time I promise)
Turned out we should have cut higher, but we found out too late - something to be said about blasting/dipping/stripping your entire fender before what seems like a straightforward repair. There was more rust and bondo than we thought... you can (almost) see on the left corner another square hole that we patched after the fact....and after the cut....




Bryan welding from the backside, to limit the amount of front side grinding ! He let me try and I suck... I will learn, but on scrap metal and then on my Bimmer (2002 with rust), not on my Porsche ;-)



And the final result, semi final anyway...



The was a lot of bondo so the curve of the fender looks "ehh" for now, but it's good.
We installed all the braces in the back with spot welds for reinforcement: you can see the spot welds from the picture.

Here's the backside, not a great shot, but...



Still have to drill those in the right places to be able to bolt the fender onto the car, repair the lip on one side (very thin metal, we went through the part we had previously reshaped)... Ironically, 90% of this repair will be under the trim anyway...

We used the bottom fender repair from alfaparts.com... A word on that. For the price, <$100, Bryan thought it was cheap and well made. See, *I* thought I got had because it took 3 weeks+ to get to me, it did not fit well and we had to cut and reshape some areas, but that goes to show you that if you don't have a clue, maybe you should not be too quick to complain ;-) So, it's a good deal apparently, but needs some work ! So that's my clueless endorsement anyway...

Next week, maybe, we'll repair the other fender (the "rail" that is used to bolt the fender on the car is rotten) - doesn;t need to be pretty, my kinda job ;-)

Q: I need to clean up the paint/bondo: so, stripper, sanblasting or dipping.. anyone knows a shop in the Tampa Bay are that they can vouch for that does either of the above ? I got no preference, just want the bondo off with the paint with minimal mess so I will farm it out.

[POORSH]

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[Walko]

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