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Question distributor lube...

How and what do you use to lube the felt on the distributor? I have read a few articles on this, and I am still vague. Also how often should I do it?
Thanks

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Matt Chamblin
78 911 SC
Old 06-07-2001, 02:08 PM
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I put a few drops of 3 in 1 on mine.

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Robert Stoll
83 SC
83 944
Old 06-07-2001, 03:32 PM
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Matt,

Engine oil, or 3-in-1 oil, take your picK! Ideally, you should use a spring hook or pick, and pull the felt plug out to see if there is any rust or gunk present. If not, then put drops of oil down the shaft until it won't take any more, then put the plug back and put a few more drops of oil on it, until it is saturated. This 'oiling' needs to be done a couple of times a year, or every time you change the oil!

You won't find anything about it in any service manual I know of, but I happen to believe distributors are the most neglected part of the engine, and hence, believe that on pre-'84 cars they should be removed (at TDC, #1 cyl.) and completely disassembled down to the centrifugal advance mechanism, thoroughly cleaned and degreased, checked for bushing/washer/shim wear, rusted advance mechanism, etc. every three-five years. The circlip immediately under the felt plug must be removed to disassemble the advance mechanism. Lube with engine oil as you reassemble.

The following exploded diagram is a generic diagram for a Bosch centrifugal advance version with points and optional vacuum module. If you ignore the points, the basic mechanism is the same for all 911 Bosch distributors.

Typical parts than need replacing are the #11 and #12 bushings, and various washers and shims in the #30 group.


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Warren Hall
1973 911S Targa

[This message has been edited by Early_S_Man (edited 06-07-2001).]
Old 06-07-2001, 04:23 PM
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Thanks for that post Warren. I printed it out and added it to the missing distributor section of my Bentley manual. It's right next to the missing brake caliper rebuild section.



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Bill Krause
'79 911SC Euro
Old 06-07-2001, 06:34 PM
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Thumbs up

Thanks Warren!

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Matt Chamblin
78 911 SC
Old 06-08-2001, 09:19 AM
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Question

Warren wrote, "The circlip immediately under the felt plug must be removed to disassemble the advance mechanism."

I've got the distributor apart on the kitchen table. How do you get the circlip out? Is there a tool for this? Everytime I try to pry it apart it just spins. Any ideas?

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Greg
72 911S
Old 06-12-2001, 06:36 PM
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Greg,

I normally use a jeweler's screwdriver, slotted bit, about 1/16" wide, and a dentist pick to brace the other 'end' of the clip. The idea is to 'pry' one end out of its' groove ... once upset from the groove, you can take away the screwdriver, and use the curved pick to pull it out, while 'covering up' most of the end of the shaft with a finger or thumb to keep that devil from going INTO ORBIT! If you can find a corner to 'face' into, with smooth tile floor ... your prospects of loosing the circlip are minimized! I've never lost one, but have had to crawl around on the floor with a flashlight to find the wayward Identified Flying Object!!!

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Warren Hall
1973 911S Targa
Old 06-12-2001, 06:48 PM
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Thanks Warren.

I've got the vacuum/points plate out so I can get to the centrifugal weights below. The bottom half of the distributor was completely dry and covered with quite a bit of surface rust. I've removed the springs and the weights so I can clean underneath. The springs don't match. One appears to be made from heavier wire and have more turns. Is that common, or has someone already performed surgery at some time in the past? There's no radial play in the shaft so I suspect the bushings are okay. One of the fiber washers which sits directly under the centrifugal advance mechanism fell out in peices. Where do you find replacements?

Thanks again,
Greg
72 911S
Old 06-12-2001, 07:59 PM
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Greg,

No amateur butchery in your dizzy ... the springs are always mismatched, because the advance curve has a steep slope (rapid advance) part provided by the lighter spring, and a gentle slope (slow advance) part accomplished by the heavier spring, per the following diagram:



The fiber washers, and shim washers should be available at a local motor rebuild shop, or industrial bearing spply.

------------------
Warren Hall
1973 911S Targa
Old 06-12-2001, 09:03 PM
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Wow! This thread gets printed and put in a safe place. Thanks, Warren.

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'83 SC

Old 06-12-2001, 09:36 PM
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Yeah, where does he come up with this stuff. Hey Warren, what's really going on out at Groom Lake? And that Bermuda Triangle thing. Can ya help us out here??

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Robert Stoll
83 SC
83 944
Old 06-12-2001, 10:18 PM
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Since the subject of distributors and correct operation, i.e., the advance curve keeps coming up ... here are some pertinent pages from the '72-'73 spec book ...

Page 47 gives the crank pulley and settings ... note that the third notch at 30 degrees Before TDC is not labeled in the drawing!



Next, p. 46 gives the instructions for checking/setting the timing:




Finally, p. 48 gives the checking points in tabular form that corresponds to the advance curve posted above from the service maual:



Please note that above idle the vaccum retard diaphragm has no effect on the advance curve, so having it disconnected has no effect on engine drivability or responsiveness!!! It is used only to improve emmissions compliance at IDLE!

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Warren Hall
1973 911S Targa
Old 06-26-2001, 05:18 PM
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TO: THE "DISTRIBUTOR" GURUS
I REALLY HESITATE ASKING DUMB QUESTIONS......BUT HERE GOES ANYWAY. VEH. IN QUESTION IS A 75 911S W/ BOSCH DIST.#0 231 184 001. IT'S VERY OBVIOUS THAT THIS 29 YR. OLD DIST. NEEDS SOME SERVICING. WEIGHTS ARE RUSTY, LOTS OF OLD GREASE AND DIRT, BUT SHAFT IS OK AS IS VAC. DIAPHRAM. THE PROBLEM IS I HAVE THE DIST. PRETTY MUCH APART BUT I CAN'T FIGURE OUT "HOW TO REMOVE THE STATOR/ROTOR PLATE" TO CLEAN IT AND TO GET TO THE SPRINGS AND WEIGHTS UNDERNEATH?? DO I NEED TO DRIVE OUT THE PIN ON THE GEAR AND PUSH THE SHAFT OUT?? IT LOOKS LIKE THE STATOR/ROTOR PLATE IS "PEENED" IN PLACE. DO I NEED TO SIMPLY PRY UP THE PLATE?? NEED AND APPRECIATE ANYONES HELP. THANKS, PHILIP
Old 03-11-2004, 07:47 AM
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Richard Parr form PMO told me yesterday that cars with webers like to idle at abot 5-6 BTDC.
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Old 03-11-2004, 07:54 AM
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Warren, what is the best timing light to use when you reinstall the dizzy?
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Old 03-11-2004, 07:55 AM
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Warren Hall and John Walker get my vote for "most informative posts"! These guys rock!!!
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Old 03-11-2004, 08:56 AM
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Re: distributor lube...

Quote:
Originally posted by makaio
How and what do you use to lube the felt on the distributor? I have read a few articles on this, and I am still vague. Also how often should I do it?
Thanks

------------------
Matt Chamblin
78 911 SC
Don't forget the cam and cam follower. Bosch makes special grease for this, should be available anywhere a rebuild kit is. Don't know if the Bosche product is mandatory, I use it 'cause I have it. Can't recomend an alternative. I'm sure someone can.
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Old 03-11-2004, 09:57 AM
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Philip,

The plate which has the thin phenolic wafer that the weights slide on is attached to the shaft that the gear is pinned to. If the bushings and shaft show no radial play, and end float is less than about 0.005" ... then the shaft generally doesn't need to be disassembled.

If the phenolic 'sliding-surface' wafer has disintegrated or cracked ... Stoddards has a replacement Teflon wafer -- originally designed for 356 distributors that can replace the sliding surface in six-cylinder distributors with a bit of trimming to fit.

John,

I haven't shopped for a timing light in over 20 years, but two important features are an inductive clip-on pickup and advance dial display. Mine is a Craftsman model with calibrated rotary dial, but I know there are now models with digital displays, too. To plot the advance curve ... you need to have a resolution of at least 1, IMHO.
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Old 03-11-2004, 10:47 AM
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In the beginning, when the Earth was void and without form, before JW, before engine rebuild books, before 101 projects, even before Superman, there was Early_S_Man. Guiding souls through the Dark Abyss. He still checks up on us regularly, offering his unmistakable wisdom. Many have benefitted. Some have ignored his pearls of knowledge. Pearls before swine.
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Old 03-11-2004, 10:59 AM
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"until it won't take any more"

Are you sure we need to use that much? (??!!) I've always just put a drop or 2 on the felt -- you mean so much oil that there is a whole column of oil up to the top of the felt (all the way down the shaft)? Or did I miss something?

Also, what about newer distributors like the 964 dual drive one?

Thx, - Randy
Old 03-11-2004, 12:49 PM
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