changed starter, but now no run
 

What a day,

changed starter, engine cranks and cranks but no firing off. Pulled a plug wire, got spark. Spells like I have gas going in.

All I have done is disconnect battery, determ starter/solenoid, remove and replace starter/solenoid, reconnect starter/solenoid, reconnect battery, crank...

What am I missing/ have I knocked something loose?

is the yellow wire on the right terminal?

Try putting the yellow wire on the other terminal?

Was there other wires hooked up with it? Some people have their MSD or other such things connected at the starter.

I tried swapping the yellow wires and no joy. I have a stock setup pretty much on ignition. I am going to crawl under there one more time with light and see fi I can spot anything obvious, maybe swap wires around one mroe time and make sure everything is good and tight.

One thing that puzzled me is that both times (meaning after I swapped the yellow wires the first time) the car would crank regardless but not start. Is this right? I mean the cranking on either way.

Shane, was there maybe a second yellow wire? I thought some of these pre-Motronic car had an electric injector that squirted while the car was cranking.

Ingo

it sounds like maybe you knocked a wire lose. The main engine wiring harness exits the tin right next to the starter. far fetched but crazy things happen... maybe a wire got pulled off a sensor or something back there?

My 83 had two yellow wires... a fat one (about 10-12 guage) and a small one (14-16 guage). I thought i recall even a third wire (buts its been awhile). I can crawl under mine tomorrow am if it would be helpful.

I am calling it a night. The two wires I have been swapping are the two yellow wires Brad described above. Car cranks but won't light off no matter how I land these two wires.

Sounds like I need to pull the sorry starter out and take a look for something loose in the wiring Brad mentioned. Hopefully it will be easy to find. I know the starter will come out a lot easier (there is my glass half full outlook for the day!). The threads on the mounting posts looked like they had never heard of anti-seize.

i once installed a 944 starter that cranked backwards.

well my fan is turning CW when I crank it...

I noticed the few times I cranked it tonight that there was a definite fuel smell. Tomorrow morning I will pull the starter off and inspect the harness area really well.

a new day is here, may the starting stars be aligned...

I went out and looked at mine. I have a big power coming from the front of the car. A big fat Red power that is going back to the engine compartment. They are connected together. I then have 2 yellow wires that are connected on the same place at the starter. They are both on a spade connector. I dont have a stock starter (I have a high torque) so hopefully its relevant to what you see.

Thanks Brad. That would make sense seeing that mine seems to have no effect as to which spade terminal has what yellow wire on it. I am thinking at this point I knocked something loose, just not sure what. Getting ready to pull the starter back out in a few minutes. Hopefully I can see something amiss. This job is becoming a blow to the wrenching ego.

I hear you on that. Also check up front at the battery that you didnt knock a fuse or wire lose when disconnecting the battery...

Well, amazing how easy it is to remove starter now!;)

Bad news is that I am not seeing anything as far as cables or wires knocked loose. I did not actually see the engine harness Brad spoke of, so I am going back out to take another look at that. I looked at cables at battery and everything looked normal there. I know it has spark. And I can smell gas after cranking it. It seems like it is going to be one of those "slap yourself in the face" kind of things but I would like to start slapping soon. :D

Perhaps you blew a relay, is your fuel pump running? You said you can smell fuel, but you never know.

If the engine is turning and you got spark, then it could be fuel.

P.S. I know it's the fourth, but please be careful. No fireworks in the Garage.SmileWavy

Make damned sure you've not dropped a fuse somewhere.

Otherwise, get some voltage measurements at the starter connection while cranking.


Best,

Doyle

So far the only thing I found loose was the throttle linkage got knocked off where it first connects in the engine bay. Reconnected. Can find nothing else loose.

Put everything back together and still no start. Pulled the snorkel off, turned key on, pulled up on the flapper... I hear something like a pump running, so I am assuming my fuel pump is getting juice. And as said before, I can definitely smell gas after a start attempt.

I can't believe this is happening. The only problems I have had out of the car have the hot start issues with the starter solenoid. I change that and now the cars dead. I'm a 911 loser...

If it is cranking, would I not have proper voltage at the starter? I am asking this in honest sincerity.

she's aliiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiivvvvvvvvvv vvvvvvvvvvvvvvveeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee... muuhahahahahaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

can you tell I am a little excited? I almost think I should make the cause a contest to see who guesses it besides my good buddy Scott (Don) Gilbert. The man never ceases to amaze me. I also really appreciate everyone else's help as well. This was a strange one. I can say though that through this process I am now one pre-G50 911 starter changing fool!

I will leave the cause open to guesses for just a little bit and then I have a couple of questions regarding the matter...

I don't know how it happened, but apparently my no-start condition was due to the car being flooded (with fuel). I described what was happening to my buddy Scott and he said it sounded like the car was flooded and to try cranking for 10 seconds with gas pedal floored. She fired up about 8 seconds into it and smoked up my shop a bit but then clearness prevailed and sheis alive once more.

So, my next ponderance is why did she flood from sitting during the starter replacement. I promise I pumped no gas during initial start as I was not even in the car. Could this have anything to do with finding my throttle linkage disconnected this morning while searching for the cause?

Ending on a happy note: no more push starts for me! And no more driving around the parking lot until I could find a suitable incline.

Yes, you are correct, if it is cranking you should be O.K. Go back to the basics. Make sure you have spark at the correct time (read: timing light) at all (or at least most) barrels and then verify the correct amount of fuel. If the spark checks out you could squirt starter fluid into the intake and check if that makes it fire up if you suspect there isn't enough fuel.

On second thought - maybe you hooked up that secondary injector up wrong and it is now active all the time with the key in the ON position thereby flooding the engine. Take a spark plug out and verify it isn't wet.

Ingo

car is running fine presently Ingo. I have started it several times this afternoon iwth no issues. During the starter replacement, the battery was not connected... that is why I am having a hard time understanding how it flooded in the first place.

I didn't read you previous post. You are asking why the engine was flooded:

Could this have been the aux. injector that is hooked up to the starter. It could have been going all the time simply flooding the engine. It is supposed to be hooked to the same signal that activates the starter relay.

Ingo

So are there two spade connectors coming down to the starter? If so one is the aux injector. Maybe one of the spade terminals on the starter is at constant +12V?

I believe it is as when I switched the two yellow wires on the two spade terminals, there was no change in result.

I think I see what you are saying now, between hooking battery back up initially and the first crank, the thing was dumping fuel if hooked to wrong (constant +12v) terminal. Maybe that is what happened. I will no more in the next few days I suppose as I drive it and see if it happens again.

Thanks for the thoughts.

hey Shane, just found the thread. If i would have read through it before you called I would be stumped. The only info i could gather from you on the phone (you heard how loud it was, big family gathering)was "wont start, has spark, i smell gas" glad its going again. It doesn't take much to flood a cis car on a warm day. The little yellow wire from the sol. goes straight to your cold start valvle, which get power EVERY time you crank , unless the temp switch on the left cam cover is OVER its 95 degree switching point. see ya, have fun