Removing A/C? (1987 911)
 

I've been thinking about removing the air conditioning from my '87 911.

It's completely stock, but the air conditioner is pretty much useless. I've heard that they were not much better when they were new.

I resisted the temptation to remove the system last year, based upon the theory that even a non functioning system would enhance resale value, but I think that I love the car enough to keep it for the long haul. I will either live without AC, or replace the system with one of the aftermarket setups.

My questions:

1) Am I being foolish to consider this?

2) When installing an aftermarket system, are ALL the stock components removed?

3) If I choose to remove it, how do I go about it?

I just removed the Compressor and Evaporator and left everything else in place - so the next owner can easily install if he/she wants.

Mine never worked well anyway.

It really cleans up the engine and saves some weight.

Alternatively, you can remove all the hoses, electrical, etc. to really save a bunch more weight - but I am not that committed to the work and resale hit if I sell the car someday.

There are a lot of other posts on this - and i think i have covered both camps.

FYI - removing the bracket that holds the compressor is a pia. I had my engine out and it was a lot easier to remove. Definitely cleans the engine area up....

1. No, lots of people have removed the AC systems. If it's what you want - do it. Can't imagine it will make a significant difference on resale if it's not working anyway. And you can just dump it all in a box to give to the buyer if you decide to sell. One caveat - if you think you might eventually install an upgrade kit - you may want to leave the hoses to the front condensor in place. That way you can tie a cord to them to use to pull the new hoses back through.

2. Depends on the upgrade. Lots of variations on the theme available. Can replace all or some of the parts. I replaced everything but the rear decklid condensor.

3. Step 1 - have any remaining refrigerant evacuated and reclaimed if possible. Then it's just a matter of disconnecting and removing the components. Not really all that difficult. Just a bit tedious and dirty.

I did the full post op routine, all hoses, etc. Though I did save the mounting HW, especially the bracket and hose clamps.

The system really didn't work, and if you or someone else upgrades it, you will get new condensers and most importantly hoses.

-Jack

Woody I have the same situation, 87 Targa, the AC still works but like cr-p. So far I removed my belt but am hesitant about going any further. I live in Florida and it can get really hot but on the flip side if the AC isnt working that well whats the use. I hope someone can push me over the edge to remove it!

AC question
 

I have an 1987 and was not happy with the ac system in my car. I went the route of updating the system which included a Pro Cooler, serpentine evaporator, para ell rear condenser and all new hoses.

The results are great; it works like an ac system should. It has stood up to the summer weather we are having here in Dallas.

I would keep the system and up date.

I think I will look into the upgrade you did. Bottom line in Florida its almost a must in summer. I dont believe I will ever sell it but if I do it will be a plus.

Ironically, I just removed the A/C system from my '87 this past weekend. It was a remarkably cleansing experience. I had been fretting about it for a year and finally took the plunge. When I was finished I wondered why it took me so long to ditch the useless junk in the first place. Nothing permanent, after all. If I decide to reinstall A/C I'll need all new stuff anyway.

From start to finish it took about a day. The most time consuming part is removing the compressor mount from the engine.

Unless you want to upgrade to an aftermarket system, I say remove the old useless stuff now!

Randy

What's the trick to removing the compressor mount in the engine bay? I removed everything else last winter (very cleansing), but gave up on the mount. I think it looked like I had to pull the injectors. Is that risky?

Carl
'87 Coupe

Can someone actually document faster lap times by removing their ac system...as opposed to say, oh, I don't know...maybe making sure their suspension was dialed in?
Sorry, couldn't help myself, I'm in Dallas and it's been over 100 for about 20 of 21 days with no end in sight so getting rid of a/c really isn't an option.
Really regret selling my Audi A4...not sure if any manufacturer is more inept at ac systems than Porsche in the 80's...at least as far as anything I've ever owned.

I just removed mine for three reasons...

1) It didn't work
2) With it gone, better access to the engine bay
3) I live in Seattle - natual AC all around us

I had the engine out so removing the condensor mount was really easy. I can't imagine doing it any other way.

[QUOTE=cscholz;5515874]What's the trick to removing the compressor mount in the engine bay? I removed everything else last winter (very cleansing), but gave up on the mount. I think it looked like I had to pull the injectors. Is that risky?

Fortunately you don't need to touch the injectors but you do need to remove the muffler and the bracket covering the lower pulley. I did it with the engine in the car and it wasn't that hard - just time consuming.

Randy

I was in the same position and ended up replacing the compressor and getting a working AC. It is really nice being able to roll up the windows on the highway and driving comfortably. I live in hot Texas so it's almost necessary, but even if you live in cooler climates, being able to talk to someone while going 70mph makes it very nice. I think you will never regret spending money on a working AC (you will get some of that back on resale), but there will be plenty of times when you wish you had one. I did a heater backdate and that cleaned up the engine bay much more than removing the compressor.

I do like the heater backdate idea but I'm too old and feeble to not have a/c in Texas!

In all the AC threads, there is a very common theme that sums it up nicely.

1. The original version sucks.
2. If you live someplace temperate (west coast) rip it out, you or your mechanic will greatly thank you next time you pull out a wrench
3. If you live someplace muggy hot...well, looks like you are up to spending a couple grand to upgrade it to a functional level, do everything including the 25 year old hoses.

Seems like a decent summary.

-Jack

I have an 87 930 and was checking it out after I got it and noticed that the PO had installed a 12V fan under the condensor in the tail, lots of room for it with the tail and my AC blows cold. I mean cold, my glasses fog over when I get out of the car, I love AC and would never consider taking it out of my car.

i removed all ac stuff. then installed swing-out rear windows. (not easy) 1978 930. with sunroof and all windows open, 100 df is not really that bad. i'm glad i did it.

Are all on the other components of the system stock? Does the fan pull or push?

And I'd love to have flip out windows, but I've also heard that it's a PITA.

AC Up Date
 

Living in Texas without ac would be impossible. I had a 1982 SC when I lived in south Florida and it was satisfactory, the temperature seldom got over 95 degrees, and I used the car as a daily driver; it was my only car. The only draw back was when the compressor, made by York, kicked on your could feel the car slow down

The heat in Texas is another story. you have to make mods to the systems if you want good vent temps. Mine are 39 degrees on a 104 day

Do aftermarket compressors mount to the stock bracket? This could have an impact on whether or not I go through the trouble to remove the bracket.

The Rennaire system with the Sanden 507 compressor uses an adapter that mounts to the stock bracket. Not sure about others.

Took mine out years ago. On really hot days I just drive the other car that has AC.

Having just gone the opposite direction of first trying to save the R-12 system, blowing hoses and receiver dryer, then cutting my "losses" and replacing almost everything with RennAire components, and spending close to $3000, I have some perspective.

Why did I choose to replace it? I guess resale was a consideration and a compulsive "everything must work" mentality were the primary drivers along with reduced noise level when on the interstates with windows down also drove me to do it.

So, am I pleased? Pleased yes with the cool air, not so pleased that I spent so much money, resultant "guilt" that because it's a Targa (or could be a Cab) just taking off the top would have been an option. It's not a commuter car but is driven several times weekly with AC needed only from May perhaps to late September so in reality I could have endured. As others have commented, it all depends on where you live, so for Florida, I would be moved to retain it.

Interesting to me was the unanticipated change in how the car sounds. With no AC running it sounds fresh and eager but with it running the sound is more bassy and sluggish and it feels like it is lugging from the extra compressor load.

OK, sorry for being long winded but to those who have removed their systems, does anyone have a good evaporator motor to sell? After all I spent, the one thing not changed was the stupid motor which now squeals and I can't bring myself to spend another $300 for a new one!

Roger

I guess I am more like you. Oklahoma has HOT summers. It was 103 degrees today and will be that hot tomorrow. I will drive my 85 Carrera to the local car show tomorrow and be very comfortable driving home. It would interesting to see just how much the AC system wieghs. I drive my car way to much to go without AC.

I prefer everything to work as delivered or BETTER than stock.

Having all of the AC stuff in a box sitting next to my fence by the garage, I can say it is north of 100 lbs. I took everything off though....compressor, bracket, hoses, 3 condensers, fan, etc...

Anyone need some old stuff? You have to come and get it ;)

-Jack

this months excellence has a stoey about the quest for cold a/c in an sc.

3k goes a long way in other areas of the car - so it's low on the list for me. But the mines is a Targa and not a daily driver.

Does that $3000 include failed attempts to repair the original system, or was that just the cost of the new stuff?

$500 was due to the failed attempt however I still have another $300 to spend for a new evaporator motor which may also require removal to the evaporator assembly which then means evacuate and recharge the system. Even if it was caught earlier the motor cost would have been the same. Then of course there is still a need to do something to protect the Desert Duty front condenser from road and other impacts.

So winter is coming and I have 5 months of non driving, I have been contemplating removing my A/C for a year.
1) its a Targa so if its hot, I have the roof off.
2) it only blows slightly cooler than the ambiant air and
3) minus a hundred pounds and not driving a compressor sounds good to me.

I think I have another project for the winter, I will just add it to the list.

If you were in Kansas I would advise against it. We would get up early, EARLY, drive the early morning with the Targa top stowed, stop for breakfast about 10-11AM , and then put the top up to get out of the hot, beating, noonday and afternnon sun.

Anybody have an actual weight of a complete A/C system after it was removed or the hp it takes to drive the compressor (even when turned off)?

This was helpful when I deleted mine:

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1287982375.gif

Reviving an old thread. I removed the compressor and rear condenser over the winter. I recall the compressor mount hard to get out of there but not insurmountable. I zip tied the lines in the back because I didn't feel like dealing with it all at the time.

Now I'm working on the front end. I'm installing Rennline tow hooks on the front of the torsion bars. The front condenser and it's related guard are in the way. It looks like there is no easy way to tie off the lines without pulling them through. The car is used mostly for DEs but there's a small chance one day I'll want to put the air (upgrade) all back in. I'm reluctant to pull out lines because 1)they don't weight that much and 2)the might help in pulling new lines through.

Question for the board, If I decide to remove the front condenser, any simple way to deal with the lines without a "hack and pull" job?

thanks