Opinion Please On......

[murphyjp]

an 87 Targa, 116k miles.

The Good

-Appears to be original paint in very good condition. All identifying stickers/tags/etc in place.
-New alternator and battery recently with battery tender.
-Dash in great shape with not cracks or tears.
-Seats in great shape, drivers a bit worn and maybe has been redone at some point. rears excellent. Drivers power.
-Tires have about 6k miles on them but are a few years old, 2008 date code. Some bad here, but we'll get to that.
-Clutch redone about 6k miles ago.
-No rust

The Bad or not so good

-Front tires are the wrong size. They are the same size as the rears 255/55, tech said the fronts should be 205's? Anyway, all tires are the same size.
-Left rear sway bar mount broken, common I'm told, not too expensive to replace. Or weld existing??
-oil leaks. tech says about $2k to reseal motor. oil thermostat pressure switch and hose. Left come line leaking. Front crank & intermediate shaft seal.
-fog lamps on the fritz, owner says they crapped out before, fuse.
-wiper washers not working.
-some areas of the undercoating in wheel wells and undercarriage have been scaped off by rocks, etc... I'm assuming this a common thing. Not at all bad, just a few spots. Is there a touch-up process for this?

So, with 116k miles and no rebuild history I am not too surprised with the leaks. The small Stuff I can tackle no problem. Oil thermostat lines in the right rear wheel area, right? should be a do-it yourself. The only stuff I would have done by my local shop are the main engine reseal and sway bar mount.

With all that in mind, I've got the purchase price down to $10.3k. Would there be much issue with driving the car as is this season regarding the oil leaks? I was thinking since the motor has not ever been redone, I'd maybe have it refreshed and leaks fixed over next winter which would give me some time to plan for the cost. Top end, what is the difference between this and the full rebuild other than cost. The small items I would fix on my own asap.

What are your thoughts price vs. issues. I'm sure I forgot to mention many things so bring on the questions.

Opinions? Discuss....

[RoninLB]

if it doesn't need a valve job now chances are it may within 20k miles

[mpetry]

you've actually surveyed the car better than many. 10.5 is not a bad price as you've described the car. Couple comments: Are the front WHEELS the correct Fuchs or is it on aftermarket wheels?

Yes, you will have to weld the sway bar mount, it's not an uncommon failure.

Have you driven the car ? How does it drive ? Go fast, stop straight ? Can you get a compression check done ? Looking at the plugs and oil consumption will tell you something about the state of the engine.

[warner53]

Leakdown and compression test?

Oil pressure when warm?

Not a bad price IMO.

Pictures?

Is it a daily driver or can you do a engine removal yourself?

Warner

[Bob Kontak]

How bad are the leaks? A couple of drips a day or a little puddle? Sure you can drive it. Thousands do.

Sway bar mount usually means aggressive driving but the tubs on these cars are not known for wearing out. Just get it fixed.

Fog lamps/wipers can be fixed with a multi-meter and a little patience. My fog light connections need wiggling occasionally. Probably the pump motor is shot and/or the one way t-valves under the cowl can fail allowing the fluid to gravity drain back into the reservoir losing the prime. Very low cost repairs.

The 87 has a G50 transmission which alone is worth a couple of thousand over the 915,

$2k is a lot to spend on just seals alone. The heads are probably in need of attention. Mechanic should have mentioned that.

What does "Left come line leaking" mean.

Edit - Price looks pretty good.

[murphyjp]

-original fuchs I'm pretty sure.
-Valve job would be part of a full rebuild vs. top end? Sorry been reading here a while but still a little foggy on this.
-Meant left cam line. reading the tech scribbles is less than easy.
-It is not currently a daily driver for the owner, nor would it be for me.
-Forgot to mention the brakes have been redone recently too.
-Car drives straight, stops good, pulls good, etc. Body straight with not dents, only two small paint touch-ups found.
-when running t some oil drips on the heat exchangers and causes a little smoke and smell when the engine lid is open.

[murphyjp]

I could do the engine removal myself. I have the aptitude. Maybe not the nerves.

I was surprised to find out about the leaks. Did not see any oil on the garage floor. Leaks are under running condition it seems.

[kanadary]

sounds like a good price and the car looks great. if its leaking when its running, it will leave a oil spot when its stopped.

[mpetry]

it looks good from here. Nice and straight. Price is right.

If "oil drips on the heat exchangers" well that could be crappy gaskets on the lower valve covers. Get the silicone ones, new hardware, and maybe a set of turbo valve covers from our host. Problem solved. There will be others, just work thru them and learn along the way as you make the car "yours".

[Bob Kontak]

First pic looks like the fender and the door are not the same shade. Still not a show stopper at that price.

[kidrock]

The problems you have outlined are common for these cars. If you are a DYI type of guy, $10K would be almost a steal.

It's only a "Labor of Love" when it's an easily-solved problem. Anything more difficult is a PITA in my book.

[Kidasters]

I say do it. I'm biased, because your car looks very very similar to my 84 Targa.

Be warned though - no matter what people say, every Porsche is at least a $20,000 car. I bought mine for $7500. With repairs, I'm into it for about 10 or 11K now. And I still have work to do.

Get it. Love it.

Ken

[murphyjp]

not leaking from the valve covers. I know one leak can be seen by looking over and down behind the fan, or looking through the fan blades and behind. The area is kind of under the cruise control cable and right a bit. Sorry don't know the engine breakdown. But a small pooling of oil was seen here.

Owner does say he has added oil from time to time but nothing that he thought was out of the ordinary.

I guess I'd like to get through the first season with the car and then refresh the motor to whatever extent needed. The engine has never been done and seems silly to just fix the leaks and then maybe have to float the bill in the not too distant future for a rebuild. I guess a preemtive strike if you will.

[murphyjp]

Originally Posted by Kidasters

I say do it. I'm biased, because your car looks very very similar to my 84 Targa.

Be warned though - no matter what people say, every Porsche is at least a $20,000 car. I bought mine for $7500. With repairs, I'm into it for about 10 or 11K now. And I still have work to do.

Get it. Love it.

Ken

I hear ya, how long have you had yours? Cost over time is easier to swallow which is why I'm wondering if there is any reason I can't drive it for a while as is.

I do plan to complete much on my own, but will admit the engine is a bit daunting. The removal and lowering process worry me. I'm confident I could replace the leaking seals, but have never torn into an engine and a rebuild would test my nerves.

[kidrock]

with only 116K miles, you could probably go another 100K + without having to do a refresh. The possible exception would be valve guides, which tend to go on these cars.

So let's start at the beginning again....get a compression test and a leakdown before you purchase.

If everything checks out OK, fix the leaks and drive her like you stole her.

[Kidasters]

Well - I had my first 911 for a year. It was a 964, and it was abused - and it took it out on me. It broke down once a month, as I tried to used it as a daily. I sold it when the transmission cratered.

This is my second one. I've owned it for about a year. It's a toy. I drive it when I can. Which hasn't been much lately. I gutted the interior in late January/early February. I've got it about 90% back together. But it's been a lot of work.

One thing that is different with this one. With my daily - I was terrified to work on it. Scared I'd break something and not be able to get the car back together to go to work on Monday.

So - I sold it. Boy do I miss that car. After I replaced it (with a BMW E46 330 - which is a great family car), I bought a 1973 BMW 2002. That's basically the car I learned to wrench on. I replaced the rear end, brake lines, brakes, exhaust, carb, relocated the battery, re-did the carpet, and on, and on. And through time, became an OK wrench.

Then, I got my mini. Which was a bit more difficult to work on. No room to do anything. But - I kept at it. Learned how to re-build calipers. Tune HS2 carbs. Do a bunch more stuff I didn't know I could do.

So - now I have another 911. I've been wrenching pretty well on this one. I've re-built the auto heat (which didn't work when I got the car). Replaced all of the breather hoses on the engine. Replaced the oil thermostat o-ring. Valve cover gaskets. Plugs and plug wires. Fuel injectors (WitchHunter Performance is awesome). Re-did the shift linkage bushings. Cracked open the brain, and installed the Steve Wong chip. Did the factory short shift kit and some other stuff as well.

I've gutted the interior and I'm re-doing all of it with the AppBiz carpet kit. Once I get it all back together - we're going to get a new windshield. And - I'm going to have my Porsche mechanic take a look and see what he thinks.

In my box of stuff to do, I've got Kendall trans fluid ready to go in, new motor and transmission mounts, and the Rennaire a/c upgrade to do. Plus - just got my Gary Stratton Duck Tail in the mail the other day, as well as a front spoiler.

It's all nuts and bolts. And time. If it's not your daily - relax and do it. You may have to walk away (sometimes several times), but you can do it.

Ken

[Hodgey]

Originally Posted by kidrock

with only 116K miles, you could probably go another 100K + without having to do a refresh. The possible exception would be valve guides, which tend to go on these cars.

So let's start at the beginning again....get a compression test and a leakdown before you purchase.

If everything checks out OK, fix the leaks and drive her like you stole her.

+1,000,000 on the PPI>>>>must do!!!!!!!

[mpetry]

First pic looks like the fender and the door are not the same shade. Still not a show stopper at that price.

I saw that too. It might be just the lighting - you can always look at the bolts inside the trunk - do they have paint missing ? If so the fender has been off.

[murphyjp]

Not sure on the paint shade. Did not see that when I was looking at the car, but it was not really sunny. Not a deal breaker, the car looks really good.

Not afraid of nuts and bolts. Just want to drive and enjoy it before getting into the heavy stuff.

[carjmark]

+1 to those recommending leakdown. Why? If the valve guides are worn you will need to do the top end which is 80% of the labor to do a full tear-down. With the "while you're in there" work you will add $5K+ which means not a good deal. If a leakdown indicates top end rebuild you can use that to negotiate price down or move on. If solid you have a good deal.