Is it possible to remove control arm without engine drop?
 

Hi,

I'm currently working on my suspension and if possible also replace the control arm bushings. Now is the bolt located in the direction that the head of the bolt faces the tranny.

I have heared that it is virtually impossible to remove these bolts without an engine drop. Is this true? I would hate to have to fully drop the engine just to replace these bushings.

Would a partial drop do the job? Removing the tranny support bolts and lower the tranny so that the front end of the selector shaft hits the body?

Or alternatively, I have heared that people grinded through the bolt which goes through the bushing and replace it. But as far as I can see there is not enough room to cut due to all the cables and fuel lines.

Anyone had any experience with this?

Thanks !

Hessel

I tried to open the bolt without removing the engine... did not work for me. Im dropping the engine anyway soon... so until that.

if some one modified your car to do it then yes

if not, then it can still be done - do you own an angle grinder and or SawZall?

how old are you & how athletic are you?

Angle grinder is there, but the athletic part?:)

But seriously, how would you do that? Not much space and a lot to damage in that area.

Don't I remember reading that it's possible to cut the bolt with a hacksaw?

yup that's it - you'll have to search to get the particulars

angle grinder, hacksaw, sawzall

or just drop the powertrain - if it's been a while; you can pretty up the engine compartment, service the CV's, do all the other stuff in those threads

one I have not seen mentioned is to replace the shift shaft seal on the trans. - seems a common failure point & easier to do then (prophylactically) than in situ

also read long term maintenance thread

Right - if the bolt is in the stock position, you have to cut to get it out. When you get the nut off, you can expose enough of the bolt under the bolt head to do the cutting. The replacement bolt can go in the other way. I don't think you can move the transmission around enough with the shift rod in the chassis hole to do any real good that way.

Perhaps a better question is why are you doing this. When I did this on my '77 maybe 5 years ago, I found that the rubber bushing was basically just fine (not, of course, after I had mangled its parts getting it out). Not at all like the situation we often find with the spring plate bushings, where wear on the rubber leads to looseness.

And the rubber part is thin, surrounded by a steel jacket, and grips a steel bushing. It is rubber so that there can be a little deflection as the suspension moves. Which is why replacements, if not rubber or rubber-like, are spherical bearings. Hard polyurethane bushings don't work in this application. Removing this is generally a racing modification. Not clear just how much more precise the suspension action is after you replace it with a spherical bushing. Being a racer, of course eventually I had to do this.

Can't say as I felt any change, but so what - got to keep up with what everyone does, and it was the antepenultimate non-metalic bushing (penultimate was the Elephant Polybronze for the spring plates, and yet, if ever, to do are the rear shock mounts).

But it is going to be easier if you pull the engine and transmission out.

My suspension is probably original and 40 years old. The rubber part of the bushing is not completely parished, but I do see some cracks.

Reason is that I am already working on my suspension. Springplate is out, driveshafts are off, etc. So while i am working on the car and have the new bearings on the shelf, it just feels wrong to leave these bushings in there.

There is not a terrible level of play on the bushing, but it does not take much for me to move the arm around from left to right.

So if I can get access to cut off the bolt head without the real threath of severing a couple of cables, etc. it just feels like the right thing to do.

Thx!

Cutting and removing the bolts was actually quite easy with a "sawzall" and a 9" blade. I had to buy used bolts as replacements and they just barely fit in from the outside on my '72. Here is a related post:

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/porsche-911-technical-forum/542227-partial-engine-drop-trailing-arm-bushings.html

Thanks Mike!

Did you have to dent the torsion tube in the end to get the bolts back in from outside in?

Thx Hessel

I dunno exact answer re denting but newer cars do have a dent there...

Think about the Elph. bushings vs. new rubber.

I didn't have to dent the torsion tube, but I'm not sure I can give you definite info here as I don't have any other years to compare. My car is a '72 made in December of '71. There is a slight dent to the torsion tube already, but as I haven't seen earlier and later torsion tubes to compare, I can't tell you whether or not my car has the real "dent" or not. Someone else will have to chime in with more info as to when the dented tubes appeared. I can say, tho, that without the slight dent on my car's torsion tube there would not have been enough clearance for the 85mm long bolts that my car uses. Once you cut the bolts be sure to replace them with correct length and grade bolts, as the parts books show at least two different sizes depending on year. I had to get them used from a dismantler as they are no longer available new.Here is a pic of my torsion tube with the slight dent - perhaps someone will be able to tell if it's a true dented tube or not. Hope this helps.http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1288640831.jpg

Thanks! I'll get under the car in the next couple of days to check things. I don't think that a '72 or '71 don't differ that much aroung the torsion tube area.

Oh yes very possible

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/porsche-911-technical-forum/215427-lime-rock-thrash-disassembly.html

Read it. Thanks!

Did you have any issues putting in the new bolts from the outside in? I have learned from a frind that he had some issues getting the new bolt in due to lack of space between bolt hole and torsion tube.

I have seen that. but for 99 USD for the two? Sorry, but i am a little too dutch for that? ( it's true what they say about us......)

I don't remember any issues with fitment and I sure didn't have to dimple the tube. Make sure you find the right bolts BEFORE you cut the old ones.

yes it was done on my 73 and my bushings where really bad. I replaced with the sport rubber from elephant. IMHO they should be tight as you get toe in toe out variance with a bad bushing.

I had to cut the open end off a wrench and used closed end with the metal shaft. It worked well. No drop needed. glenn