anyone hear of this bill before?

[ffilips]

Dear Summit Racing Customer,



Your hobby is in danger! Proposed U.S. government legislation,
U.S.
Senate Bill S.1766, would allocate federal funds for state
scrappage programs
for vehicles more than 15 years old. In the process, it
could threaten the
very existence of our hobby by:



*Destroying 1960s and 70s era musclecars



*Scrapping 1980s performance vehicles like Mustangs, Camaros,
and Corvettes


*Eliminating many non-performance vehicles which provide
an invaluable parts
source



Take a stand for your rights--and your hobby--by letting
your U.S. Senator
know how this bill will directly affect you. Log onto our
website at
http://www.SummitRacing.com for a copy of our Legislator
Letter, which you
can print, sign, and mail to your Senator. Then, go to

http://www.enjoythedrive.com/san for a complete list of
legislator names and
addresses, plus additional information on U.S. Senate Bill
S.1766.


Act now--your hobby may depend on it!

This was just sent to me by summit racing. This is the first I have heard of this legislation. Does anyone have more details?

[pwd72s]

Yes. The March issue of HOT ROD also covers this bill. Page18, headline: THIS IS SERIOUS! The bill, (S1766) is authored by a couple of the usual leftist suspects...Senator Tom Daschle (D-SD) and Sentator Jeff Bingaman (D-NM). If a car is over 15 years old, these wonderful folks want to save the earth by having it crushed. I guess these people never understand where many of the parts come from that support the old car hobbyist. Or, perhaps they do. Worry not though. This bill would not bother 996 or Cayenne or Boxter (sic purposeful) owners....not until these cars become 15 years old, anyway....

[JuiceMan]

Yeap I recieved that same e-mail.

[82SC]

HAHAHAHA

Mr Sienfeld...could you please drop your 550 spyder, 356 speedster, 911 RS, 911RSR, 904 race car, 935 race car, 917 race car, and your skittles color assortment of early 911 and 356's at jake's junkyard....thanks

In MY opinion there is NO way a bill like this would pass...
even if you gathered all the tree hugging environmentalists in the world...

the automakers are still one of the biggest lobby groups...the unions for automaker workers that make old parts...and all the celebrities and rich corporate people with their VAST car collections...

I think it is just a way for these greenthumb senators to show their voters that they care and they are gonna show some effort...a futile effort but at least we tried...vote for us!!

Maybe they are going to offer an incentive program like if you have a real junker...polluting the environement...no retorable value...the state will chip in some money to buy the car from you get it off the road...put some money in your pocket to go buy a shiney new hybrid electric car!!!

$0.02

MJ

[pwd72s]

MJ, that's the point...where are you going to find parts for YOUR cherry restored car if the parts supply is gone because all the "junkers" have been crushed? Say you threw a rod through that original magnesium 2.0 case, you want to restore your car...uh, no magnesium 911 engine cases made these days. So you're going to learn magnesium casting? I do hope you're right about the failure of this bill, but don't count on it...I've seen a lot of nonsense turned into law.

[82SC]

true true...but I was think more of crushing the toyota cressidas and the like...

[Superman]

Somebody has sold someone a 'bill of goods.' Normally it is not those rascal liberals who are are really behind this kind of legislation. It is the auto companies. They have pushed legislation for years that promotes old car crushing.

They have also fought attempts at increasing the requirements of motor vehicle operators (more reasonable 'proficiency' tests), they have lobbied for subsidies for petroleum companies, etc. In their vewi, the world would be a much nicer place if every car was 1 year old or newer, gas was $0.10 per gallon and everyone six or older can drive.

I am not familiar with the specific legislation mentioned above, but it surely must be similar to the several other bills I have seen in years past. This exhaust emission stuff is not really about air quality, you know. As people who care for and protect classic older cars, we have powerful enemies. Beware.

[orbmedia]

I believe the Bill provides Federal funding to States to encourage the voluntary scrapping of old "fuel inefficient" vehicles. Owners of old vehicles would get a small payment to scrap their vehicle if they buy a newer one.

The US government is not about to pass legislation that takes away private property from citizens.

Run with that one.

[pwd72s]

"Somebody has sold someone a 'bill of goods.' Normally it is not those rascal liberals who are are really behind this kind of legislation. It is the auto companies. They have pushed legislation for years that promotes old car crushing." -Superman

Well, may I kindly redirect your attention to the names of the honorable Senators who authored this POC? They may prefer the term "progressive" to "liberal", but a rose by any other name... But, as we've learned with the ENRON mess, some companies don't care which side of the political aisle they attempt to buy their politicians from. So no arguement from me that the auto companies, if not pushing for this bill, are certainly not fighting it. After all, more $ in selling new cars than in making parts for old ones. Porsche would LOVE it if every car were crushed after 15 years...so would Chevy and Ford.

[82SC]

lets see how long it takes for jack to push us out OT...haha

but I don't think that companies like Porsche would care about cars being crushed...

how many of us would be in the market for a 70K 996 if our cars were gone...i am sure some of us have the older cars cuz they love them, and some of us have them cuz we can't afford a new on...I must say that I am both...if I had the money I wouldn't want a 996...

car companies like ford and chysler, hyundai and mazda that offer econ-boxes as part of their line up would love to see their cars crushed...because if an econ-driver got his car crushed he would go out an buy another econ box

MB and BMW, Rolls-Royce, etc... might benefit from such a law...since if you crushed an MB owners car they can afford to go out and get the newest MB...but most MB/BMW/R-R owners do not wait 15 years...5 years and they get new cars...thus the leasing option offered by the factory...this way they get new buyers every 3-5 years...recycle the old cars to the next icome bracket...etc...also there is the push for pre-certified cars...dealer run used car lots and the like...i would say some but not all car companies are pushing for such legislation...

opinions?

[Oldporsche]

I believe that its another bill that tells us that it's vigilance that keeps the peace.

Yes, I'll sign what ever it takes to get rid of stupid legislation like this. I've seen it before. As we give the government more power the more you will lose.

Good luck,
David Duffield

[makaio]

I hate these idiots with power, that only think of their agenda's! This is what they need.

[cegerer]

How in world does Tom Daschle continue to get re-elected in South Dakota????? California, Massachusetts, New York, etc. I can see. But South Dakota?! I've only been to that fine state once, but isn't it pretty much filled with good ol' common sense conservative farmers? Apparently, there must be a high percentage of welfare/social assistance people there?

[expat]

Don't you just feel like the world is over regulated

Geez...small business get's the squeeze all the time (along with education and health). I would think a lot of small business will suffer under this sort of legislation. Would I be right thinking that new cars need less servicing and that most of that is done in dealerships?

What pi--es me off is the guys who have created lives for the families based on businesses they have built, who would have to respond to legislation like this, and may go out of business in the process.

If pollution is their concern, surely the crap coming out of China's factories (and I'm sure other countries) would be a major polluter. Go after and get them in line first. Then get a WORlD PROGRAM for re-forestation (sp?) established, and grow trees in their billions. Surely older cars can't contribute that badly in the world scheme of things, pollution wise.

If the issue is safety, well mandatory yearly checks should be introduced. Traffic speeds around the world are declining as more cars are used. I doubt an irrefutable arguement could be made for older cars (15yrs+) being more responsible for accidents than new cars - its the driver who makes the difference.

Without sounding like a gear head - cars are part of many countries culture. Being beligerant enough to destroy them destroys ones culture. (yeah, I guess you could go look at the in a museum!!!!!)

Sure we have responsibilities to our planet and each other but for @$%* sake there are bigger problems to deal with - especially pollution in industry, household pollution, education, health and welfare. The global economy/community has to face responsibility for showing care and compassion, bringing people together not subjugating them into a plastic world devoid of any personal freedom or choice.

I love my Porsche and I would not give it up without a fight!

I'VE HAD ENOUGH OF THIS....I WON'T TAKE IT ANY MORE........

Ok...flame me for my unsubtantiated comments.......

Cheers
Mark

[pwd72s]

Hey, Mark? What can I say? Isn't it GREAT to live in the USA? After all, Hong Kong, where you live, is now communist ruled & opressive, right? This "land of the free", the USA. Where we have such honorable elected Representatives as Daschle, fighting to protect our individual liberties? Food for thought, isn't it? Yeah, I suppose Daschle will be coming to crush my car one of these days...

[RoninLB]

Some times I think that if a visitor from outer space ever saw the liberal/left part of the USA the visitor would say "I want to see the manager"

[autobonrun]

I hope this is not a big hoax.

I checked the Senate site and can't find bill S-1766. Maybe I missed it.

http://www.senate.gov/

I also looked at this messageboard writeup and there is no Representative Artz from NH that I can find, although the writeup is interesting.

http://www.covacvag.org/MB2//messages/14.html

http://clerkweb.house.gov/107/olm107.php3


Although, there is an article on this issue from NHRA!

http://www.nhra.com/2001/news/December/121701.html

Confusion rules!

[orbmedia]

Wait a minute.

Seriously, do any of you really think this bill means your car will be taken away if it's over 15 years old and scrapped?

The bill is egregious and stupid, but please don't be a fool and blow it out of proportion. The bill provides incentives to states to run VOLUNTARY scrappage programs.

It's bad, but not to the extent some of you seem to be led to believe. Empower yourself and read the bill. Really try to lean about it before spreading some really stupid ideas. Not even the most liberal congressman could propose what some of you are afraid of. I mean this still is America people.

[Saffs]

Exactly, orbmedia.
This is appears a little unsubstantiated to say the the least! And what it does mean, if it means anything, is low financial incentives to scrap some POS car. NOT your 1973 Porsche 911! As if the Government are going to come and take away your car, seriously!
Other Countries offer such schemes, it isn't new.
And lets make no mistake, it isn't Politicians behind this, it's the Automotive industry. They want people to buy new cars, not run around in 1979 Datsuns....

[epbrown]

Originally posted by 82SC
MB and BMW, Rolls-Royce, etc... might benefit from such a law...since if you crushed an MB owners car they can afford to go out and get the newest MB...but most MB/BMW/R-R owners do not wait 15 years...5 years and they get new cars...thus the leasing option offered by the factory...this way they get new buyers every 3-5 years...recycle the old cars to the next icome bracket...etc...also there is the push for pre-certified cars...dealer run used car lots and the like...i would say some but not all car companies are pushing for such legislation...

opinions?

Hey, RR owners are collectors too! Granted, most of the RROC members I've run into tend towards the Trumpish side, but let's bear in mind that more than 80% of all Rolls-Royces ever built are still on the road. They were among the first collector cars, due to the history of the company and their cost. Most new RR/Bs are leased by corporations for CEOs, so dumping the old ones makes no never-mind on that front anyway - they've never seen one over 3 years old except in pictures.

As for the legislation, I've received post about it and seen it on Usenet's car groups, and as Saffs and others point out, it's not like the governments coming to our homes and prying the keys from us wearing jackboots. Mostly, the legislation hopes to encourage moving people to newer cars as a benefit to the car companies and the environment, and odds are that it's chief effect will be more people junking their cars rather than letting them sit in some old field or barn. I see some negatives to that, but it seems a wash with the negatives of leaving the cars there in the first place. A car that no one was using anyway is made unusable.

Emanuel