How to Diagnos a mechanically DEAD 3.2 Distributor, Send to BOSCH for Service
 

Hey Fellas,

Several years ago I had a skipping distributor and it made a horrible buzzing sound. I found that all my shims have disintegrated, so I replaced them with Hi-Temp SS shims and 1/4" OD(may be a but larger) Roll Pin from McMaster Carr, hi temp-dry lube in the shaft and fixed the skipping dizzy but the buzz was still there.

Some have inquired about how to tell if the INTERNAL SNAP IN BEARINGS are shot and you still get AXIAL (Radial) Slop, liken to a toy top spinning at it's end of spin.

I keep mentioning the BUZZING sound, well here is a Video, click pic to start video:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v5...607_102649.jpg

Jim

You can send it in to get new bushings installed, which is what I'd do. I went through this, and bought a BRAND SPANKIN NEW ONE from Porsche for about $600-$700 after the core charge. I would not recommend doing this, but I had to because my 3.2 was stranded in Oakland, and I needed to get it back to Fresno ASAP.

I think the most important point to make is that everyone who owns a 3.2 or an SC should pop the distributor cap and rotor, and check the shaft for radial play. When the bushings go, the rotor hogs out the cap, you lose spark, the engine dies. But not before a ton of gas goes through the motor and out the exhaust, turning the exhaust and catalytic converter into a glowing orange blob.

Really in for service? How much did that run you? Do you happen to remember the contact info for the service?
I wonder if I can send in my AFM for service too?

Damn, Bosch monopolizing those bearings :eek:

No...a brand new distributor, including a new cap and rotor. I think having your old one rebuilt might be $150-$200. I think there is a place in LA that does them.

The distributor bushings basically wear until they fail, and they give almost no warning before that happens. If you're out of town, then you'll get stranded. I had to buy a new distributor because I couldn't wait the few weeks or so to get it back. I needed a new one dropped shipped, and I was back in two days changing out the distributor in the middle of a parking lot.

There was one guy who this happened to while crossing the Golden Gate Bridge. Same thing: engine quit, exhaust is smoking, and the cat is glowing bright orange.

I think I know about the shop in La La but I recall they said they could not replace the inner bearing. Hmmmm

Do you recall the shop you are thinking about?

The one I'm thinking about is next to L.A. Porsche on Figeuora & Washington

TIA
Doc RussNak

I'm sorry, I do not remember. I did a ton of calling around, and quickly abandoned the rebuild plan, as too lengthy. Basically my distributor had the same problem as the one in the video. The bushing play started to create a buzzing noise. At this point, the rotor will soon hit the cap, and the rotor will shatter.

BTW, Porsche was going to start a rebuild plan for the 3.2 distributors. I wonder if they quit offering that? You might try to track down Gabe at SGS Porsche in San Luis Obispo. He might know.

Ah man, same freakin Boat :(

FWIW,....

Barry Hershon has all the right pieces to rebuild these as new. New Bosch shims and he makes his own bushings to fit each shaft.

While not cheap to do properly, the quality of his work is absolutely first-rate. You get what you pay for, IMHO.

Oh wow, Thank you Steve!

What is his contact info?

I knew those internal bearings had to be custom made :confused:

Got it IAE Inc.

Ok just had a long discussion with Barry, what a wealth of knowledge.

Well here is what he said:

Since I removed the sprocket and was not sure if I put it back exactly the same I have just ruined the timing in microns. Great so she could be toast. I will not chance it and replace as back up, it goes into the Land Fill or sell parts from it.

SO WARNING, IF DO DECIDE to ATTEMPT A PARTIAL REBUILD MARK EVERYTHING TO PUT BACK TO OEM!

He custom lathes the bearings (BUSHINGS) and replaces all parts and bead blast to almost NEW FINISH.

Here is an interesting reply, I asked him about dropping oil under the felt pad. He stated it is a WASTE OF TIME. It does not do anything accept pool oil into the cup of the housing and cause issues of gumming up and mess.

He also stated there are no NEW DISTRIBUTORS only REMANS. Sorry Russ, I did not want to believe it but he said that.

He did recommend replacing the Orange seal ring on the outside, it is original and needs to be replaced for a proper seal at the engine $3.00 part, good insurance.

Jim

Wow! Barry sounds like the right guy to rebuild these distributors.

The square profile seal is important - a round profile seal will not work.

Barry is technically correct, but not 100%. Porsche USA did start to offer their own reman/ rebuild distributor service several years ago ( I want to say around 2006 or so?), but to "seed" the program, they obviously needed to have new distributors (technically just the housing is re-used anyway) to start with. I got one of the first distributors in the "rebuilt distributor" deal. Straight from Porsche Cars, NA.

Been thinking about this - is timing change in microns really that critical? Would it help if I pull mine at lunch and take some ultra hi-res photos? Mine is untouched.

Oh no Dr Russnak, I bought a known good used one from a local dismantler. I was going to rebuild my spare one but will not bother since I messed it up, it can only go on 2 ways.

There is local member and his is acting up and trying to help him out, hope his is just the shims and not the inner bearings/bushings

Draco, you are the Master of substitute parts and workaround solutions. If anyone can do it, you are the Man!

You are too kind sir!

No seriously, you should write a compendium of your solutions for a "solution file" section of PP.com, sort of like an old school Pharmacist's "cures" book.

I don't see how even a degree or three of misalignment would give you trouble. It's the motronic doing the timing, right? I thought the mechanical advance mechanism simply got the rotor roughly lined up with the correct terminal inside the cap every time the coil fired.

Also, as long as decent used distributors are going for $100-$150, Barry's service doesn't make a lot of sense to me. When I talked to him three years ago after my bearings failed, the price would have been somewhere around $400.

I wound up having a local shop try to re-bush mine (their bushings lasted less than a week) before picking up a used one here for $150. It's lasted me another 100,000 miles or so and counting.

If I recall correctly, the other shops I found that advertised rebuild services were:
Jerry Woods
Supertec
Moto-something down there in CA
Motor Meister (seriously... lol)

You guys in CA are really lucky when it comes to specialized porsche work.

(I feel I should mention that if I had an earlier car and actually needed to get a distributor recurved, Barry would be at the top of my list.)

Another opinion
 

John Eisenbud in Denver may be another option. It's my understanding that he has a treasure trove of NOS dizzy repair parts and old-school machines and testing equipment and really enjoys rebuilding and upgrading. I don't know if he's an expert at re-curving like Jerry Woods is but he knows his way around a dizzy. His number is 303-825-0322. He's a bit of a difficult guy to work with but he is supposed to be quite good. If you call, tell him Roger Buswell with RMR told you to call.

I offer a rebuild service for distributors as well.

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1307552622.jpg
http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1307552726.jpg

This is what I thought on a 3.2 and later Carreras.

This is totally, anecdotal and only my personal experience but when I tested my dizzy after my attempts of a DIY rebuild, she did run quiet and normal until I took her up to 80 MPH, then the buzzing started however she did not skip or struggle in anyway.

But still better safe then sorry, I also purchased a known good one for $150. I tested about four of them in a bin by spinning them and looking for smoothness with a bit of resistance. I learned if it spins too FREELY without any resistance, that is signs of a soon to be Bad Dizzy.

Wow, his prices have not changed in 3 years :eek: that is OLD SCHOOL FOR Yeah.

Jim

Do you also custom make the internal bushings for the 3.2 Distributors? SmileWavy

Jim

I do, as well as the internal seal if necessary. It is rare that bushings are out of spec if proper lubrication is maintained.

The failure process is this;

1. lack of oil to the upper fiber shim quickly causes it's failure. Excessive endplay is the warning sign that a service is necessary but there is a good chance that the bushings are still within spec.
2. If the distributor is left in this state the upper bearing rate of failure is quite rapid. I normally see this failure on 3.0liter SC distributors and all have had evidence of water damage which I assume is from washing the engine but could be contributedto other events.

Thank Sir Aaron

Barry H, stated those shims are NLA ( he called it Vycon/Vyton or something like that ).

Please forgive me but How does one oil it? In the Car or Remove Lube and Replace?

May I also ask how you feel about the position of the sprocket, there is only two ways it can go on the end of the shaft. 0 degrees 180 degrees from initial removal, No?

Other than the 356/912 distributors there is no alignment problem.

As far as lubing, I would do it out of the car and figure out a way to get oil to the upper shim.

Intriguing.

Maybe an oil bath then drip dry wipe access off :confused:. I do not want dismantle ever again, I will leave it to your shop ;)

Thank you again sir!

That totally concides with my experience. From making noise, the failure was about 50-60 miles. That's why the only thing you can really do is to check the end play annually or more for older distributors. The failure can create a fire, or take the catalytic converter.

I think fastening that little gear is critical. If it falls off, you might be looking for a new block.

Agreed, I am a bit concerned by roll pins walking out.

Great another reason not to use my spare :eek:

Have you ever seen a properly installed roll pin walk out on one of these? I've got a dizzy that the main shaft and gear were machined out to 3/16" and a double roll pin was installed. I've been running this with no issue thus far.

McMaster-Carr does have the steel TAPER PINs in Metric sizes as well.

I'm sorry, but you are way off base here. The factory pin is NOT what your calling a TAPERED pin which is seen in McMaster Carr. The factory pin is a 4mm straight bodied pin with one-(1) end already mushroomed for the 4.5mm hole in the hardened steel gear.

Honestly no. To be fair, there are plenty of other distributors that utilize rollpins. Bosch however was not one of them. Personally I would not want to be the guy who installed one for a customer that walked out.

Better Safe then Sorry :eek:

Do you have a website?

Sorry, no website yet...it's on the to do list! Give me a call if you have any questions.

Roger That, maybe I will stop by when I'm up there showing properties :D and bring my back up dizzy.

Let me know,

We had the Rothmans 962C at the shop a couple of weeks ago...maybe you'll get lucky and time your visit right. ;)