Time trialing question...

makaio · 07-19-2001, 12:49 PM

I have a question for all you time trial drivers. I'm going to attend my first driving school in September at Thunder Hill. How many of these must I do before I can start driving in the PCA Time Trials? Additionally, what is the general fee for entry in a time trial event?

Even if someone could just direct me in the right direction, there really isn't anyone where I live to ask these questions to.

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Matt Chamblin
78 911 SC

emcon5 · emcon5's Garage

This would probably be a good place to start.

http://www.pca-ggr.org/timetrialinfo.html

Tom

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82 911SC Coupe

addictionMS · addictionMS's Garage

you might also read the write up at

http://www.bellmotorsports.com

on School Tips, it may help you in your preparation.

Thunderhill is a great track, I may sign up for that one as well if I can get my car together.

makaio · 07-19-2001, 01:10 PM

addiction, I noticed you are from nor-cal. Where about? And get your car together!

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Matt Chamblin
78 911 SC

JT · JT's Garage

Makaio,

Your driving school at Thunderhill does not count toward PCA experience unless it is a PCA event, and we don't have any events in Sept.

The suggestion to check the GGR web site is right on. To become certified for the GGR series you need to attend a ground school, drive with an instructor at a GGR event until the instructors feel you are competent to drive alone. Your car must pass a tech inspection and you must have a Snell 95 helmit, 5-point belts, roll-bar and fire extinguisher. After you are certified you need a driving suit.

Personally, I would strongly recommend that you begin your driving career with auto-crosses. Its cheaper, easier on the car and teaches you fundamental driving skills in the 911. Its a blast, but the step to Time Trialing is a bigger blast. TT is also the beginning of the shrinking wallet.

Yargk · Yargk's Garage

Damn the PCA with their anal 6 point harness, driving suit, and fire extinguisher requirements. Sure I'll get that stuff soon enough, but I have to get it before August 25. BTW who's going to Thunderhill that day? I should just move to Europe and drive Monza and the ring without all that safety crap, but then I'll get all the safety stuff anyway because it's really a good idea to.

JT · JT's Garage

Yargk,

Better double check the 6-point requirement. I think that was resended.

You didn't mention the helmet - is that anal too? Remind me not to have you as a student if you don't believe in safety equipment!

makaio · 07-20-2001, 12:47 PM

Thanks for all the responses. I am a firm believer in good safety equipment. Hopefully by next season, I will be able to start my time trialing career. Lastly, when does the GGR usually post the schedual for the next years race dates? Because I work almost every weekend, I have to use vacation time to go to the track.

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Matt Chamblin
78 911 SC

Yargk · Yargk's Garage

I said six point because I'd rather have that than 5 point. I have a snell 2000 helmet and I believe whole heartedly in safety equipment and as I said in the message would plan to have it installed even if it wasn't required. What gets me is that I can run with NASA as a student all I want without any of that gear (I've been out 3 times with them already), but there is no lag time with the PCA. I'm just saying that the harness and roll bar requirements should be after, say, twice running with the PCA. You can't get your feet wet without spending a bunch.

orbmedia · 07-20-2001, 01:10 PM

6 point harnesses are designed for Formula type cars. The proper type harness for our cars is the 5 point with the sub belt through the seat bottom and fastened to a hardpoint in the chassis within 20 degrees of vertical.

lsolon · 07-20-2001, 02:06 PM

The 6th point of the harness is called the anti-submarine belt. If you roll your call, what can sometimes happen is that you can slip down the seat, thus wedging your back and neck in a position where you can break your neck.
Thunder hill is a great track! Great straights and plenty of run-off. If you haven't been there, be aware of the heat. It can get Africa hot there.
Have fun

emcon5 · emcon5's Garage

I thought the 5th strap was the sub-belt, and on 6pt rigs there were just 2 sub belts.

Correct?

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82 911SC Coupe

orbmedia · 07-20-2001, 02:26 PM

Correct emcon5,

The origin of the double sub belt (or 6 point harness) is in Formula type cars where the floor of the car is the seat bottom and it is not a hardpoint - usually just fiberglass or composite sheeting. So the double sub belt is supposed to run to either side where there is a structural rail or box section on Formula cars.

If you use a double sub belt on a standard saloon or GT car like our Porsches, it must also run through a slot in the seat between the driver's legs.

addictionMS · addictionMS's Garage

two things,

six points go to the same mount point as the lap belt and the intention is to keep a semi reclined driver (formula car) from sliding under the lap belt in a crash

get the same safety equipment for your passenger if you intend to take one (aka instructor). I have instructed with NASA and I will not get in a car where the driver has better safety equipment than I do. It just is the right thing to do.

JT · JT's Garage

PCA events, at least the GGR Time Trial Series, are considered "drivers education". That lowers the insurance rates, but increases the safety requirements.

The GGR TT Series is usually posted in the Dec. Jan. time period. However, if you work weekends, you are going to have a difficult time making many events.

Correct on the temperature at Thunderhill. If you have an older car without an oil cooler, you can plan on 3-4 laps before you are getting too hot. The other track GGR uses is Buttonwillow. Also a great track with lots of runoff space and also lots of temperature.