80 Euro SC... how much hp?

[brock911]

Can anybody tell me or direct me to where I can find out what the hp rating is for a 1980 Euro SC?

Thank you for your help,
Mike

[Flat6pac]

Basically the same as a 78/79SC US @ 180hp...but then the 76/77 3.0 Carrera was the same as 78/79, 8.5/8.7CR and the factory gave that engine 200hp

[BMWonly]

1978 & 79 same as US: 180HP
1980: 188HP
1981-83: 204HP

[brock911]

Originally Posted by Flat6pac

Basically the same as a 78/79SC US @ 180hp...but then the 76/77 3.0 Carrera was the same as 78/79, 8.5/8.7CR and the factory gave that engine 200hp

Thank you for your input.
Mike

[brock911]

If a standard 80 Euro SC with 180 hp had a top end rebuild using Euro heads, pistons and high compression cylinders would the hp remain the same or is there any way to guess at the increase?

[javadog]

An '80 Euro was rated at 188, not 180. If you rebuilt it with all of the Euro parts intact, you could fairly easily get 210-220, if a few things were done. A little attention to the details in the cylinder head, coupled with a compression increase of a little bit, would be easy. If you're buying pistons and cylinders though, you could also increase the capacity. Changing the cam profiles and improving the exhaust would also help and then you'd be looking at a fair power increase.

JR

[SC-targa]

A euro SC for 78 & 79 was rated at 180 DIN HP, which is supposed to correlate to 172 SAE net HP.

The earlier Carrera 3.0 was rated at 200 DIN HP, because the cams were indexed for more top end power than the Euro 78-79 cars, which also had air pumps, which kill some HP from parasitic drag.

The early US SC's had the same air pumps, but an even more restirctive exhaust with a 2 way cat, which killed more HP, but the cams were indexed the same as the Carrera 3.0 to gain the power back.

In 1980, the euro HP was bumped up to a 188 DIN HP rating through optimization.

In the US, the 80-83 cars got rid of the HP sapping air pump & the added a boosted compression ratio, 9.3:1, which helped HP & Torque, but these cars also got the smaller intake runners and ports of the 2.7 liter cars. The net result is the same 172 HP SAE net rating as the earlier cars.

In 1981, euro cars got a 9.8:1 compression and returned to the Carrera 3.0 cam timing for a 204 DIN HP rating, probably 195 HP SAE Net.

[brock911]

It's getting more clear, the hp for a 1980 Euro SC is between 180 & 204?

This particular car had a top end rebuild using Euro heads, pistons and high compression cylinders, now I'm trying to figure out how much increase these components added to the hp, a little, not that much or a fair bit?

I'm trying to decide whether this car is a candidate for a 73 RS backdate or should I hold out for a 3.2?

Any opinions will help,
Thank you
Mike

[javadog]

Sorry, I was a year off in the details. The "big" compression bump was in '81, not '80. 1980 it only went up a tenth of a point...

I like the feel of an SC over a Carrera, so I'd probably choose the earlier car.

JR

[redturbo911]

From what I have read Im thinking around 188 as far as I remember for 1980 EURO

[GaryR]

81-83 Euro SC's have higher compression domed cylinders (9.8:1), the big port heads found on 78-79 US SC's, and the "euro" fuel distributor (i'm told the same as early SCs). Converting an 80-83 US SC to full euro specs is an expensive proposition, converting a 78-79 US SC is a few thousand for the new piston and rings set, cylinder reman/match and associated gaskets/misc.

[brock911]

Thanks again guys, understanding that I don't have a blank cheque, anyone care to make a few suggestions for hp bump that is fairly cost effective?

[Danny_Ocean]

Originally Posted by brock911

Thanks again guys, understanding that I don't have a blank cheque, anyone care to make a few suggestions for hp bump that is fairly cost effective?

Max HP with the 3.0 engine, keeping reliability?

[brock911]

Originally Posted by Danny_Ocean

Max HP with the 3.0 engine, keeping reliability?

Thank you for this link, very good read. Perhaps starting out with a 3.2 set-up makes a bit more sense? Either you pay a bit more for the car and get the motor which appears to be upgradable to 225 - 230 hp with a few tweaks, or you spend less on the car (SC) and spend more on the engine upgrades to achieve the same numbers?

I suppose another option, of which I'm finding out there are many, would be to find a 3.6.

Will a 3.6 mount directly into a SC or a 3.2 Carrera?

Thanks,
Mike

[spuggy]

Originally Posted by brock911

I suppose another option, of which I'm finding out there are many, would be to find a 3.6.

Will a 3.6 mount directly into a SC or a 3.2 Carrera?

Sort of, yes. All the air-cooled motors physically fit, and conversion parts are available to adapt whatever is needed. Just add money.

But there's a lot of ancillary systems you should probably pay attention to then, brakes and suspension being a couple that spring to mind. This adds up. Quickly.

Sell your SC and buy a hot-rod; you'll save a fortune - which you can then sink into continued development...

Remember that the resale market for modified cars is a lot smaller, any prospective buyer needs to like your choices.

[Josh D]

One thing rarely mentioned when comparing power between the Euro and US cars is the difference in torque. Although the 78-79 Euro and US cars shared the same HP, the Euro cars had 195 ft/lbs of torque compared to the US 175 ft/lbs. In '80, the compression bump in the US cars brought torque up to 187 ft/lbs, but maintained the 180 HP with the smaller ports as mentioned above. The '80 Euro had 188 hp and 195 ft/lbs of torque with 8.6:1 compression and the '81-'83 Euro had 204 HP and 197 ft/lbs of torque with 9.8:1 compression. None of the Euro cars had cats and fuel/ignition curves are a little different.