Just drove my first 'early' 911.....(long)

[rallyman]

I just test drove my first early 911(a '70 T) that I am (actually was) considering buying.

First the good....WOW what an experience (especially after driving nothing but trucks for the past 5 years.....or more!). Talk about raw and in your face! I really liked it.

Subjectively, the car felt tight, steering felt good, the engine was represented as being rebuilt about 5 years or so ago and not having many miles on it in the meantime. It seemed strong enough (nothing to compare it to though!) and the gearbox didn't give any problems and the clutch was sweet.......recently done at Dieter's in San Diego.

The engine had a PMO Weber conversion on it and the carbs seemed to be leaking somewhat. There also seemed to be ALOT of black (I'd say oil) residue on the under side of the engine, although in the 45 minutes or so I spent with the car I never did see any signs of dripping

Cosmetically the car was lacking....a pretty good 'ding' running all the way down the driver's side. and numerous little dings here and there. Prolly bondo in the driver's door too. The interior (other than the dash) was sort of shot - well specifically the front seats and carpets were really bad. Headliner, dash, and rear seats seemed ok.

odo showed 67K but looking at the car I bet it was ATLEAST once around.....

The car was also represented as being mostly 'rustfree' in a PPI 3 years ago. There is 'surface rust in the corners of the windshield and a couple of other places

Seller was asking $6500 (but indicated a willingness to drop down). He was 'willing' to do a PPI, but he 'had someone who was bringing cash this afternoon, so.......' Any rate I felt that the car was not what I was looking for even before the PPI subject came up......

Three questions that this brought up for me are:

1. What's the deal with the 2 batteries? (I've seen this before on 911's but it never really mattered to me then - this car had two aftermarket batteries sitting out of the boxes and on the trunk floor...... )

2. Is this a reasonable price for a car in the condition as described? (hard one I know, but just trying to get an idea).

3. Any ideas how/where I can go to get a bit more experience in knowing what these cars should 'feel' like? For now, I plan on test driving every one of these for sale that I can get near!

As always, THANKS for your help! I am hoping I don't end up like Nostatic........I want out of that truck and into a REAL car!

[Cornpanzer]

Sounds similar to my experience approx two weeks ago when I drove my first early 911T. The car wasnt what i was looking for (obvious rust repair , etc) but I look at it as sort of a reconaissance mission. Now I have something to compare with in future test drives. The cool thing was that even though I knew this wasnt the car for me.....I liked it!!!! Im sure I will fall in love with the car I eventually buy. The T is not an especially fast car (Im used to approx 180 hp in a 1700lb VW beetle) but I loved the way it drove. Anyway....back to the subject. Seems to me with the little experience that I have that the car you looked at was probably overpriced. If the only rust that is in the car is thosee spots you mentioned than maybe it is worth talking the guy down. But it seems to me that you could probably find a better maintained early T in CA. My problem is that I am in Ohio and there is VERY few early 911s left out here. Iforsee a buying trip to SoCal whemn my day arrives. =) Hope you find your car....let uys know how your search turns out.

[nostatic]

You need to drive more cars...you cannot believe how different each one will feel depending on the state of repair and how the car was treated. As for the "I got someone coming over with cash", tell him congrats, and if it doesn't sell to call you back. As described $6500 is not a *great* deal for a T, especially given the obvious rust (odds are there is a lot more that you can't see). The beauty of shopping in SoCal is that unless you happen across a total find, there is always another car around the corner. It is a buyers market these days, unless the car is something truly unique (ultra low miles, early S, etc).

And there are worse things in life than ending up like me. You should see how I *used* to be.

[JSDSKI]

Wait till you get into a 72 2.4 T,E, or S with MFI...eyes wide open!

The two batteries were put out there to improve weight distribution - the 69 - 73 and 74 cars were subject to a lot of setups that were intended to improve the cars under the rules of "production" based racing... the batteries belong in special cubby holes on each side of the spare.

Surface rust on these (ungalvanized cars) is like an iceberg - the biggest part is unseen... be careful - especially around structural parts - windshield pillars, suspension mounting points, rocker panels....

Pricing varies according to the consumer - from 3500 (rusty beater T) - 25000 (clean E or S) without pictures a wild guess is:
start at $5K and go from there.... always do a PPI that includes compression test and rust examination.

Looking at more cars equals more experience go the Autofest in Ventura - you will see everything --- its a great show.

Enjoy- the only regret you will have after the purchase is;
"Why didn't I do this sooner?"

[HarryD]

I did the same thing you are doing about 1 1/2 years ago. My advice, look at a bunch of cars to get a feel for what is normal and what is not. If you are lloking for a pre-76 car, look for evidence of rust, rust repairs and places where the PO is trying to hide rust. Rust is a real killer to these cars and there a bunch out there that are on the verge of "returning to the earth". I most have looked at over a dozen cars before I found my rust free one that needss serious engine work but I figured I can fix the engine and be ok for 1,000's of miles or get a great engine and have the car vanish underneath me. The choice was easy.

Have fun.

[Brian993]

I say buy it. No PPI. Wayne can use the business and you can keep us entertained with learned to weld and cars at the shop posts. $30000.00 later you can post pics of your mint T.

[rallyman]

Thanks for the 'words of wisdom'!!! BigB But I think I'll hold on this one..................

Harry I know what you mean............I have 2 914's right now........one of which I can almost see disappearing daily!

Again thanks to everyone else for the tips, advice and words of wisdom!

By the way........I noted the cubbies for the batteries in the nose, do you have to buy a special battery to fit them or do you just use a hot knife and cut them to size?

Thanks again!

[nostatic]

Is this the light blue car on autotrader? I was wondering about that car...

[rallyman]

The light blue car in San Diego.......I've been trying to get the guy with the light blue car in LA....no luck so far......

[curlesw]

While taking a Saturday afternoon drive (I love the Escondido to Ramona route ) I saw a 70 911 T in Ramona (of all places). I took a quick look (my wife would kill me if I even mentioned the thought of buying it). There were some scratchs on the hood, the alarm works , not sure about anything else...looked like a new paint job.

Food for thought.

Wayne C.

[rallyman]

Do you remember where it was or a phone a #. Or any other info?

[curlesw]

The lot is located on the south end of Ramona, I think it's called Classic Cars or something like that...can't miss it. If you are driving south on Main St the lot is located on your left. There are only 1-2 car lots in Ramona...if you go past Dye Rd then you've gone too far. If you go see it let me know what you think.

Wayne C.
83 SC

[Bill Douglas]

I think Nostatics on the right track looking for a car. Become educated about what you want.

Actually, I'm like that at the moment. I'm looking for a new girlfriend. I've been doing a lot of looking and going for a few test drives. In fact I know exactly what I want and are looking for a particuarly good example with a few faults as possible

[Mike Feinstein]

Bill,

Be sure to have a careful look under the hood before jumping in. You will find that surface blemishes get more acceptable as time goes on. You may want to examine the underside carefully for leaks or drips....definately undesireable. Sniff around a bit also, there should be no funny smells...if she's a keeper, she should exude a pleasant aroma with no hints of incomplete combustion. Be careful, many of them prefer to run rich...can drain your gas money in a heartbeat then leave you by the side of the road. Of course, this is more common among the pristine examples with perfect headlights and a perky tail.

Happy hunting!

[nostatic]

Originally posted by Bill Douglas
Actually, I'm like that at the moment. I'm looking for a new girlfriend. I've been doing a lot of looking and going for a few test drives. In fact I know exactly what I want and are looking for a particuarly good example with a few faults as possible [/B]

Well, if you hear about any in LA, I'd be willing to check them out for you. You know...test the fluids, alignment, compression, steering rack. I'm very thorough.

[Adam]

Bill,

Just make sure the one you settle for is a low-mileage example. Nothing worse than finding a nice one that's been abused and has had multiple, careless owners.

Ensure the body is in good condition and that there is little chatter or obnoxious add-ons. I could go on and on with tips for the test drive, but I won't bother...

[nostatic]

I wouldn't hold out too much hope for an early car sitting in a lot in Ramona. It might be a decent car, but odds are pretty low, especially if the paint is new ("let's take this rusty pile of crap and put a shiny cheap paint job on it").

Let me know if you want me to look at any cars up here in LA. Gawd knows I've got to do something while I'm supposed to be working...

[Bill Douglas]

Thanks for the sound advice guys. Mike, you had me rolling on the floor laughing. Good point Adam - or worse still - turns out to be an exrental

[curlesw]

Never said the car would be worth it, just another data point/reference to help in the learning process. But then again, never, know.

Wayne C.
83 SC

[nostatic]

So does a rear spoiler add or detract to the value of your girlfriend? And what is a good color?

Oh wait...I got my threads crossed.