Seine gate shift question
 

Have a quick question about the gate shift. I have started installing it and have put the carrier plate on and gate shift arm.

The instructions indicates that to ensure full contact between the gate shift arm and carrier plate, temporarily clamp them together.

Should they actually be touching? The picture provided suggests a 3-4mm gap between the arm and the carrier plate tab. Not too sure what should be contacting?

Here is how mine currently looks:

http://i1087.photobucket.com/albums/...ps5d551f25.jpg

I have one of these. Installed it many years ago. Works great.

With respect to your question, I'd have to pull the boot up to see how mine looks. I am assuming that you have it in 1st gear in this pic. On mine, when it is in neutral, it is in the 3-4 gate and does not require any force right or left to move back and forth between 3-4. Just a little pressure to the left and it slides easily in the 1-2 gate. Conversely, just a slight pressure to the right and it goes up into 5th. Not sure if this helps at all.

Roger

Full contact refers to the relative angle between the tabs on the shift lever tab and the carrier plate. I suggest using a small long nose locking plier to clamp the tabs together (try 1st gear) while tightening the hose clamp.

After the spring-loaded tension plate is installed, the default lever position in neutral is in the 3/4 shift plane. When shifted into 1/2 and 5/R, the lever tab should rest against the carrier plate tabs.

Hope this helps,
Sherwood
Seine Systems

I woudl also weld or JB weld the tab because the hose clamp alone won't hold very well in my experience. I put the JB over the hose clamp and it has held fine.

Thanks for the reply. The pic I posted is the gear in first. As you can see there is a decent gap between the carrier plate tab and the gate arm. I was a bit unsure whether there should be a gap or not given the picture seemed to suggest there should be a gap unless I'm looking at it wrong.

While in first, should I shift the carrier plate to the left so that it meets/contacts the arm more then use the nose clamp while tightening the hose to create contact ?

The aim I presume is for them to be touching when shifting in first and second?

Sorry if these questions have an obvious answer but just prefer to get it right.

Ditto!

Roger

The arm only assumes its right and left position when you add the spring loading, which you have yet to do. The spring pulls the lever to the right, and the arm just keeps the lever from being pulled too far to the right. You can't adjust the lever for right/left. But you can for up and down, and for parallelism, which is all you need to do.

After you have the arm clamped on, and the spring stuff in place, you need to check the shifting. If the arm prevents the shift lever from being far enough to the right in 1st/2d gears (not sure that could happen), or it bumps into the carrier plate ear when trying to shift into either of those gears, you need to adjust the shift coupler in the back.

This makes sense now that the spring will push it against the carrier tab. Thanks!

Do get it welded. It won't hold with just the clamp.

Once you do this, how does the shift boot fit down over it?

Will definitely get it welded. Shift boot will need to be cut from what I've seen

I believe if you look in the Seine installation instructions you will see that 3-4mm clearance at that point is what they recommend. I don't have them in front of me at the moment but I remember a picture showing that.

I didn't have to cut the boot for mine. However, the bolt that sticks up on the right (spring tension bolt, if I recall) did eventually pop through the boot. Not a big deal.

Also, if you don't have a welder handy, the JB Weld on mine has held fast for at least 8 years.

Roger

3point - just stop thinking, and keep on with the installation. You aren't making any steps you can't retrace if needed.

Install the anodized aluminum part with the spring and see what is happening. If it ends up with the hooked tab contacting the tabs on the plate in 1/2, and it shifts fine, you are all set except for welding the hooked part on.

If things aren't quite right, you could move the plate a bit to the left (but note it can't move far, because you need those slots for the 5/R spring loading stuff to allow the vertical spring holder plate to move up). Or tweak your shift coupler. Or both. It will work.

In your picture, it looks like the hooked tab could be a little lower. Lower is better, because you will have some wear on this piece after many miles and shifts. Easy to adjust - just slip it down until its horizontal piece starts to contact the top of one of the fixed tabs, then scooch it up a tad. But this may be an artifact of the camera angle, and it may already be in the best position.

Walt, thanks.. will get on with it.. i have been a bit busy and havent moved passed whats in the pic, but looking to get it done in the next week or so. Regarding the hooked tab height, I noted this also and was planning on lowering it

I cut the rubber boot, added an acorn nut to the screw to reduce chaffing, and then re-installed the leather boot. Looks stock, works great.

Or you can do like this and not cut the boot.
I've driven with this setup 3000miles now.

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1381393748.jpg

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploa...1381393762.jpg

Looks great! Is that a seine kit?

no, its a modification i made to the seine kit, i didn't want to cut the boot

Neffets - that's pure genius. Plus, if you have the factory short shift kit in there also, you don't need to grind the opening on the right larger.

Well ahead of my friend who took a longish piece of metal rod he had lying around which was about the diameter of the factory cross pin and drilled some slots to hold the clip parts. It stuck way out passenger side, and he used a piece of old door spring to hold it down. Said it worked just fine. But that was a race car.

I've often wondered if a guy couldn't duplicate the system Porsche used, but on the right side. But the reverse lockout is in the way on top.

Your fix makes one wonder if Porsche didn't over engineer their system, what with two springs and the fork piece to keep the springs from bending and all.

Had the kit in my 86 for about 4 years. Works flawlessly. I clamped it, adjusted it, spot wielded with the clamp on. Then removed the clamp and finished the wield. Did not have to cut the boot.;)

Adding on related question here...
My new-to me '85 911 has a seine shift kit and short shift installed.
The 3-4 channel requires slight, right pressure to shift from 2 to 3, or from 5 to 4.
Can I adjust somehow adjust to avoid adding pressure?? There metal tabs on the shifter are welded on. Thanks for any thoughts....Dave

The device is designed to require pressure, but not exactly as you describe. If it is adjusted correctly, the shifter should rest in the 3-4 when in neutral. Slight pressure to the left will put it into the 1-2 gate, and slight pressure to the right will push it into 5. I installed mine so long ago I no longer remember how to adjust it. However, that is also a testament at how well this works. It has never required adjustment.

If you don't get the info that you need here, certainly contact Seine.

Roger

Thanks Roger. Too clarify. At the appropriate velocity and motor speed to shift into 3rd gear, and with the shifter "at rest" in neutral (no hand pressure), IF I then push the shifter straight forward - it will not go into 3rd gear. In order to get the car into third gear, I "feel" for the spring and push slightly to the right (not all the way to 5th gear) - and then the car goes into 3rd. Basically the "at rest" neutral position is just a hair offline (left / right wise). Can I maybe bend the tabs? Do I have to remove the welds and redo? Other? Thanks again! Dave

From your description it sounds like you need a hair of an adjustment at the coupler in the rear not the actual shifter in the front. There are a lot of documented threads on how to do that. As already mentioned, in the 3/4 plane the shifter should slide into 3rd and 4th without any lateral pressure required since it should already be automatically "centered".

Also make sure the bushings are in good shape, etc.

FWIW, I also replaced the shift rod coupler with an aftermarket one (Stomski Racing, if I recall). This helped to provide for much more positive gear selection as well.

Roger