No manual transmission fluid!

mattn · 10-25-2013, 09:07 AM

Yes, I posted this on the mini board but am desperate for information.
As a long time user of this technical forum, I trust the advice I have gotten.

Bottom line: Mini shop says I drained the transmission fluid instead of engine oil and then added more engine oil. After that we took the car (allegedly with zero transmission fluid) on a 1000 mile trip and several shorter (300) mile trips. along with random around town driving.

Does this make any sense to anyone? Car is a 2010 Mini 6 speed with only about 25K miles.

How far will the manual mini go with ZERO transmisison fluid?

By the way we drove it to the shop because it pops out of fifth gear. That problem predates the "oil change"

zippy_gg · zippy_gg's Garage

Let's assume your mini engine takes about 4 qts of engine oil. If you did what the shop said you did you would have about 8 qts of oil in your engine. You would know by now as you would likely kill all the mosquitoes in your county and there would be a lot of blow by pressure spewing oil all over the engine compartment.
Also your transmission would likely acknowledge the lack of lubricant after over 1000 miles by making all sort of noises. Does your engine/transmission smell hot?

mattn · 10-25-2013, 09:26 AM

actually 5 quarts. And no, no smell. Aside from the (ongoing and intermittent) popping out of fifth, it ran fine for a couple thousand miles.

mattn · 10-25-2013, 09:27 AM

I can't find any "definitive" answer on how long a manual transmission will run on zero fluid.

However, I am pesimistic on winning this argument with the dealer.

Dan J · 10-25-2013, 09:48 AM

in my experience they'll last about 10-20 miles. When I was a dealer tech in the 80's
Audi rebuilt trans came with no fluid Shop's would buy and install them and send them out with no fluid 20 miles later the tow truck would pick them up

gordner · gordner's Garage

No way did you do a 1000 mile trek and a couple more at 300 with no tranny oil. You would have melted the teeth right off the gears (ask me how I know!)
And as pointed out, you know when y ou try to double fill your oil pretty damn quick!

McLovin · 10-25-2013, 10:36 AM

lol, a trans going for 2,000 miles with no fluid/oil. Yeah, right.

There's no way that could happen, not even close.

I worked at a shop in the 80s, we had a tech who drained a differential and forgot to refill. It was howling and ruined after only a few mile test drive.

Gear oil is kind of important to have in these things.

manbridge 74 · 10-25-2013, 11:58 AM

Impossible. Even if your 1,000 mile trip was done at 5mph.

darrin · 10-25-2013, 12:24 PM

it would be good to ask the shop how many quarts of engine oil they drained when diagnosing your problem. They'd need to account for well over 5 quarts of engine oil to support their theory.

mattn · 10-25-2013, 01:10 PM

Thanks for all the help. The shop did say there was too much oil. From there perspective the evidence was damning. I went by the shop and pointed to the engine oil drain and to the transmission fluid drain. :-) "I have done this before."
The car is still under powertrain warranty. I think they will work with me.
Thanks again.

zippy_gg · zippy_gg's Garage

Quote:

Originally Posted by mattn

The car is still under powertrain warranty. I think they will work with me.
Thanks again.

Good to hear that!

Bob Kontak · Bob Kontak's Garage

Quote:

Originally Posted by mattn

The shop did say there was too much oil.

Assuming you did blunder, wonder if enough residual oil was in the trans to keep it alive? Nooks and crannies, maybe. Angle you jacked it up?

If there is a pump vs splash oiling that may be why it did not cook in short order.

Still cant see between 8-10 quarts in the crankcase not having noticeable side effects.

Quicksilver · 10-26-2013, 07:58 AM

This wasn't mentioned so I suspect I know the answer...

Did you do a 1000+ mile drive without checking the dipstick?
If it was checked would you notice if it was way over the MAX mark?

porsche930dude · porsche930dude's Garage

and didnt check the dipstick after you refilled it with oil? Plus I would think youd quickly realize your draining the tranny as it would probrobly be pretty clean and very stinky oil

Racekar · Racekar's Garage

Years ago I forgot to put gear oil in the diff of my RX-7 race car. Lasted a 30 minute practice session and half of qualifying. When I took it apart it was junk, I have never seen gears that color before.

I now always refill things immediately or I put a note on masking tape across the tach.

My son over filled our spec miata by 3 quarts and it smoked like crazy over 4000 rpm, I doubt you could put 5 extra quarts in without smoking.